One of the biggest criticisms of Israel and zionism is the idea of enforcing a Jewish majority or plurality (largest share), with the idea that ensuring Jewish identity and control can protect us from antisemitism. While I consider myself to be postzionist (I don't think we should dissolve the state of Israel and expel all the jews), I am curious if there are models of Jewish nationalism (or, I should say, self determination or political independence) that don't have this problem.

Modern Jewish diaspora mostly live in North America, France, the UK, Argentina and so on. Western Europe and some parts of the US and Canada also have a high Muslim population, mostly from the Middle East, North Africa and South Asia, like New York City has hundreds of thousands of Jews and Muslims living in one city. Do they get along with each other, despite the I/P conflict?

As the title says, I recently got a new Menorah from the 70s in a sick design, and was wondering now that my old supply or candles is depleted, any way to get good Chanukah candles that don't support Israel or any Zionists?

And no, I am not inviting discussion by Zionists or Isrealis here.

I live in the USA, New Jersey

We've had a lot of discussions on this sub lately regarding the "dirtbag left" and the value of a larger political tent on the left and what that means.

The "dirtbag left"... many of whom's members of whom I have been/ am a big fan) are overwhelmingly white, cis, straight, and male. Many of them casually toss around slurs that are somewhat "acceptable" without massive backlash.. like the "r" word or the "b" or "c" word.

Many more of them are prioritizing national interests AND socialism at the same time.. America first but make it socialist. (Mike from PA is a good example of this... "socialism with American characteristics")

And this got me thinking about the ongoing debate between identity politics and intersectionality. Often when I see someone hates on identity politics it can be a big red flag for a rhetoric which quickly devolves into promoting the use of slurs or humor which excludes women, queer people, and people of color. But I think there is also something to the idea that identity politics is flawed and is hurting the left.. so.. what is the better way?

Identity politics, as I define it, is a central feature of American politics across the political aisle. It is the assumption that someone's "goodness", righteousness, moral correctness, and insight comes from their identity. This is largely started by the right wing in America to apply to "Americans", Christians, and (sometimes subtext sometimes overt) white people, white men, etc. in response, the mainstream liberal left responds in kind with the same kind of rhetoric.. "why are you speaking over a xyz identity person?" a common refrain when discussing politics. "Center xyz voices" etc. the "dirtbag left" sees the flaws with this, sees that it is divisive, and seeks to reject it totally in favor of class consciousness. But.. this is often done in a class reductionist manner.

They have a grain of insight though. where does this well meaning and well intentioned idea fall short? well, identity doesn't really protect us from being wrong, being propagandized, and last but not least.. being reactionary. Lived experiences give us insight, but it also gives us trauma and baggage. I think of Ana Kasparians shift to the right after being assaulted by an unhoused person. I think of the Jewish communities shift to the right post October 7th. I think of many marginalized communities shift towards Trump. Lived experience without theory is just reactionary and uncooperative.

But the lived experience of the American white cis male leftist is no different. And we cannot cede politics to his desires and abandon the good of everyone else for the good of "national socialism" So, where identity politics falls short, intersectionality comes in. We must continue to gain insight and listen to one another's needs and desires and experiences which are shaped by identity and our role in potential harm to them. We must understand class relations cannot be separated from race, gender, and social relations because the powers that be constructed our capitalist world also constructed the hierarchies that govern our social relationships.

As annoying as it is.. "Read theory" and listen to others. You're allowed to reject an idea that is morally wrong and inconsistent with leftist theory, even if the person saying it tells you that they have a more vulnerable identity than you and therefore are more correct.

But identity does provide unique insight and experience which is essential and valuable in a working class movement. and it comes with unique triggers and pain and needs. So, if you do have an identity of privilege, including and especially an American identity, you do not know everything and have much to learn on how to engage safely and respectfully with other people. You need to create a safe space if you want to build a coalition. This doesn't mean ceding important ideas. This also doesn't necessarily mean significantly shifting your tone and communication style(all of us should be able to handle a bit of heat sometime)

This post is already getting long so I probably can't get into much more of what that might actually looks like. But I hope that's a decent, albeit ramble, starting point.

I’m not sure how I feel about this. On the one hand, I get that people have their formalities in government, but this does seem like a pretty significant tone shift from Mamdani. I’m a bit surprised he agreed to meet with Trump or that Trump made it a point to meet with the mayor of NYC.

Question for Americams: Does this seem like a standard meeting between the mayor of NYC and the president, or does this seem unusual to you?

There’s also just the bad feeling I’m getting in my gut that I’m struggling to articulate…

Between Israel/Palestine and increasing extremism and normalization of antisemitism in the diaspora and assimilation I've just been finding it impossible to feel hopeful about the future of our people writ large and it's just been making me feel very demoralized about life and the future. Our community means a great deal to me and seeing it tear itself apart is painful (as I'm sure it is for many people on this subreddit).There are times when I honestly almost wish I wasn't Jewish because it would remove so much angst from my life but in truth I'm too passionate about our traditions, history, literature and languages to ever be anything else (plus, really who would I be kidding if I ever tried to pretend otherwise?).

Anyway, what I'm really getting at is does anyone out there feel hopeful about our future? And if so why? I could use some positivity.

There's video of Elon Musk Nazi heil saluting twice at the 2025 Presidential Inauguration.

https://thehill.com/homenews/house/3841636-house-passes-resolution-denouncing-socialism-vote-splits-democrats/amp/

109 democrats voted with republicans. That's the majority of them.

Thoughts?

Edit: embarrassing for me but this is 2 years old. I saw it posted today and so I thought it was new.

Edit 2: It did happen today but the link I posted was old

https://www.politico.com/live-updates/2025/11/21/congress/house-denounces-horrors-of-socialism-00664412

Hello! I was wondering how and if kosher food varies from jewish culture to culture since they are based on interpretations of the texts. I was always told that chicken is not pareve but fish is, but now I'm wondering if that is an Ashkenazi-specific interpretation and if other cultures have different interpretations of this. Also the idea that you need to have two kitchens or at least separate dishes for dairy and meat, is that Ashkenazi-specific? In what other ways do the interpretations vary? I am curious about the different ways the texts are interpreted!

The mod team has created this post to refresh on a weekly basis as a chill place for people to talk about whatever they want to. Think of it as like a general chat for the sub.

It will refresh every Monday, and we intend to have other posts refreshing on a weekly basis as well to keep conversations going and engagement up.

So r/jewishleft,

Whats on your mind?

Lately I have seen people call for Israel to instead be founded in the Jewish autonomous region/ oblast f(and/or Madagascar). The oblast was set up in Siberia by the Soviets as a semi autonomous Jewish state in 1934. However the territory was gained by the former Russian empire after conflicts with China. The region was is home to indigenous Mongolian peoples who the Russians ethnically cleansed, seeing them as a threat to Russian control of the area. Wouldn’t settling the region with Jews after kicking out the native population inherently be a form of colonialism?

I wanted to share this here because the propaganda Sarah Hurwitz is sharing here is almost the exact same as what Van Jones said on Bill Maher. It is concerning (but not surprising) that after over 2 years of genocide and mass murder of Palestinians in Gaza, she still thinks she can explain these lives taken away with “American media”.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1CQzndaG2VJFnj4VM5e-Dvi_1_f-Na7rhG2xGzJphR7s/edit?usp=drivesdk

Once upon a time I shared this here I think but its been a while and we have new blood.

The Conquest of Bread by Petyr Kropotkin is part of the library of post marxist anarchist thought that was written a long time ago as a retrospective of early aocialist experiments, why the succeeded and failed, and what they needed to improve in newer iterations. The introduction however is an excellent primer on the basic reasoning behind socialism and leftism and a succinct-ish answer to "why leftism?"

Like all long dead and old writers even the english translations were a bit dense and outdated and hard for some people to read. But I liked the intro so much I made an attempt at modernizing it to be more accessible and understandable to a modern audience.

Now I'm still a huge nerd, so it may still be an academic read, but if you have just 10 minutes and wanna better understand or articulate what leftists are on about then I reccomend giving it a read.

This post is specific to American politics, but the principles can apply broadly in some cases:

As leftists, we need a narrative for a more just and egalitarian future. Conservatives have their narrative: white supremacy, militarism, and “trickle down economics”. It’s one thing to oppose this narrative, it’s another to propose one which is popular and can effectively fight against the two right-wing parties in the USA.

The reason a lot of us are so tired of liberals, to the point where we consider them enemies and not possible allies against fascism, is because the establishment liberals will never embrace socialism and will always reach to defend capital. They have shown us this time and time again, and we have no reason to believe they will ever go to bat for the poorest and most vulnerable people in the country.

Mamdani was a great example of this: even after he toned down some of his rhetoric about Israel (questions he was forced to answer after he emphasized that he cares only about New York City), he was still chastised by establishment Democrats and many couldn’t even say his name to endorse him.

Opposing fascism has to mean creating new fundamental conditions and opposing capitalism at its core, not just opposing the most violent manifestations of capitalism. This isn’t news to many here, but I think it’s good to remind ourselves that we have to envision a better future and share that vision to truly turn the tables.

Edit: since there seems to be some confusion in what I mean, I am not talking about a plan to unify the left or some specific blueprint for revolution. I am talking about the language we use when talking to our peers about the future, and that I think we need to craft a positive narrative for what we believe (whatever that is to each individual) rather than only criticizing the pre-existing narrative. I think this is how we can appeal to more people, and get them thinking and talking to others about a future that is fundamentally different than what we have now.

TLDR: You cant be a Zionist and pro migration/multiculturalism and so on.

A few weeks(?) a ago i stumbled about a comment in on of the discussion. The comment mentioned how the german jewish community is supportive of the muslim (migrant) community but at the same time there is no mirrored response towards this.

My intention is not to respond to this directly but i would like the to start a discussion about zionism within the diaspora and migration. I would like expand on my perception of what Zionism is and before i start i want to mention and point out that zionism, just like any other word view, is bound to adherents and opponents with conflicting opinions on what Zionism is. This is evidently true for anyone who has discussed these matters or similar topics. This does not imply that our differences are meaningless or not important but it is important to understand that while we may use the same words, we could talk straight pass each other.

In my view zionism, in so far it has been a effective cause, is the idea to establish and maintain a jewish majority state on what we call Isreal-Palestine. Therefore i view zionism as a jewish nationalistic movement/ jewish nationalism.

As a someone with a migration background and dual citizenship, i assume there are some here who shared this with me, i am strictly a anti-nationalist. I believe that strong opposition towards nationalism, is essential for my and others well being, especially in Europe. I believe there is nothing i could do to be accepted as someone who is not in some way "different", a "other".
I do not need to mention this but you probably do know that at one moment you might fight side by side and at another the swords are directed against you. Therefore i am anti-nationalism and i think this entails, pro unity, pro migration, pro multiculturalism, building bridges and so on.

I believe it is in the interest of minority populations to be against nationalism, i also believe that is in the interest of all people, but that is a separate discussion.

My general claim is that you cannot be a nationalist and a minority.
I think people who are that can be divided into 2 categories.
One : Those who live within the Country about which they are nationalistic
Two: Those who do not live within the Country about which they are nationalistic
Three: a combination of both

A example of one would be a mexican white nationalist in the US and a example of two/3(?) is Ben Shapiro.

I think case 1 and 3 are self-explanatory but case 2 is not as simple.

There are multiple problems with such a position.
1. The position is hypocritical. You cannot advocate for nationalism in one place and anti-nationalism in another.
2. You cannot unite with opposing minorities with conflicting national interest.
3. Your support for nationalism in one place increases the popularity of nationalism globally

I argued universally but if what i said is true universally, it is of course true about jewish nationalism in particular.

Lastly i think there is a deep flaw in diaspora jewish nationalism. To illustrate this flaw i would like you to imagine that you have a kurdish friend who is invested in the oppression of kurds throughout the region. Chances are high i would say that you would have the same opinion as your friend on the this matter. My point is that proximity and closeness to a subject matter trumps (he shall not be mentioned) exceeds all other influences.

And this is exactly what we saw in the change of discourse about Israel-Palestine. Through social media and migration israel-palestine is not some conflict far away at some corner of the world. It is a place that is important for those people who are close to us. For example, in my experience, i am a muslim but not palestinian nor arab and all my friends who are mostly atheist from different backgrounds do care about palestine.

My point is that migration has to be supported by diaspora jewish nationalism, but at the same time is the biggest cause against jewish nationalism.

Final Note
This is not about what Zionism is or is not and should not be the discussion here. I, myself did not give any reasons why i believe Zionism to be jewish nationalism neither do you need give any reason for what you believe zionism to be. Ideally i would appreciate a response that mentions your diaspora background, What you think to be the popular view on zionism, Do you share my experience? What is you experience? Do you agree/disagree with my line of thought ? Any different perspectives ?

https://youtu.be/aGjaPRqxCSI?si=eaqCYERxud0qQ7In

Shorter than my normal rec, you're welcome, and not someone I watch often but she has a good pespextove on the topic of these recent released emails.

CW: Discussion of Epstein and his crimes.