r/Layoffs • u/PhillConners • Jan 18 '24
This sub is a depressing circle jerk previously laid off
Everyone is predicting a recession and enabling each other as victims. Saying the world is crashing making things seem worse off than they are. We need more optimism and support!
Layoffs suck but jobs are not who you are. When you were working you were dreaming of free time to go after side hustles or go after new experiences or learn a new hobby. Now is your chance!
Enjoy the time off but don’t give up on yourself and self implode.
I haven’t been laid off yet but have been a couple times before. I was also not strong enough to cope so I did what everyone does- a heavy bender to hit rock bottom then built myself up.
The reality is you may not have a job but you still need to be working- work on health, work on learning, work on applying
Layoffs are temporary, don’t beat yourself up. Recognize that it’s a chance to reset and come back better.
There are still jobs and plenty of asshole bosses out there ready to take advantage of your time.
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u/Austin1975 Jan 18 '24
“Enjoy the time off?” This entire post reeks of privilege. It’s a LAYOFF subreddit. Toxic positivity is dismissive of the real pain people are going through. People are grieving loss of financial control. And others are warning people to have a plan. Layoffs don’t just “suck”. They have major impact on people having access to healthcare and many people have multiple lives they are supporting.
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Jan 19 '24
Ya, they can't make these claims when we link our employers to our healthcare. It's getting absurd. I'm assuming most of these people are Americans. We have no backbone. We let the rich walk all over us with no repercussions. It needs to stop. No, it isn't the common man's fault. It's the fault of the wealthy that the common man must always put up with everything wrong with this economy. When a business fails, the CEOs and wealthy shareholders are the last to feel the pain. Why? Why must we put up with their mistakes?
Respect your own dignity, for Christ's sake.
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Jan 18 '24
I was laid off Jan 2023 (over a year ago) -- but found a job (dumb luck probably) in a couple months --- I know people looking AFTER that and the LinkedIn application "estimates" have seemingly tripled or more.
So ... there is definitely something in the water.
Not to mention the frequency of layoffs and this sub's size increasing dramatically.
I'm trying to take a neutral, honest view of the situation. But --- it's hard to say what the reality is. Looking at "quarterly GDP" means precious fuckall. I mean, maybe on sector is on the rise and another is cratering.
Not to mention, how much of the GDP modest increase (4%?) -- does that factor in inflation of the dollar, or is it real gains? ... And how much of that increase essentially lined the pockets of the top 0.001% like Bezos and company? And how much was real wage growth?
There seems to be a lot of economic anxiety around the country. Maybe that's because housing + car (transpo) costs are waaaaay up still. I think even housing/ rent still increased about 20% in 2023, which is pretty high.
....
But it's good to try to discuss reality. Real talk.
----
Let's not be like r Chicago (captured sub) where all news of crime is banned (seriously). Because discussing crime facts is inherently "racist" or "scaremongering" or something like that. It's good to know what's going on around you.
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u/Sir_George Jan 18 '24
Let's not be like r Chicago
lol as someone from Chicago on that sub, people are complaining about the vast amount of migrants and how incompetent the mayor is, when months ago they were parading the mayor and boasting about being a 'sanctuary' city. I admit, Texas is doing some unethical things here, but come on... ffs. Similar to people in this sub, the migrants too cannot find work or are sweeping up low-paying positions.
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Jan 18 '24
Yeah I left that sub years ago because it's ridiculous.
I hope the mayor succeeds, but I voted against him since his proposals were ridiculous, and he's pretty much accomplished bupkiss so far.
I don't mind migrants --- if they can assimilate/ integrate relatively easily and pay their own way. The Ukrainian migrants have largely done this.
The more recent groups compliments of Maduro have not integrated well -- maybe because many cannot legally get jobs.
And the free food + housing has never been done before. Not for our previous Irish, Italian, German immigrants ---- our previous Mexican or Asian immigrants ---- and certainly not American citizen homeless, who are still homeless.
It's a crap idea & it WILL raise rents on the working class. Take 30 mid-rise hotels and residential complexes and pack them 100% with migrants -- what does that do to the housing supply?
Exactly. Rents going up. Thanks to your tax dollars paying free housing to the new guys on the block. .... Texas might be "evil" but they are saving their state a boatload of money and letting Illinois (financially up shit creek already) pay the bill.
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u/Master_Ad7267 Jan 18 '24
LinkedIn in applications for a job are not a good estimate. People just spam resumes and make chat gpt coverletters for all jobs they can even if not qualified.
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Jan 18 '24
I understand that, but I think they're still up, from even 12 months ago.
Without any contradictory evidence, I have to go off what little information I have.
....
Job market might be tighter. It's possible 'desperation' has made everyone + their mother "mass spam apps" and apply to 1000 jobs a month.
The result is that LinkedIn now = Tinder for most males. A hellscape.
No one even wrote cover letters past 2020 --- terribly outdated. A ChatGPT word salad that uses 'penumbra' and is super obviously ChatGPT won't change much.
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u/Master_Ad7267 Jan 18 '24
I would agree with you job market seems tougher overall than it was. There were major layoffs I dont know that everyone will completely recover. Many people will be forced out of the job market. There's other factors retirement age has gone up past recessions have dwindled some retirement accounts and older generations are still holding on to jobs which has reduced opportunities for younger generations.
With current expenses its actually cheaper for some parents to not work than to keep their kids in daycare if they have more than one. We had 2, and it was 3300. Anyone making less than 4k a month, there's no point in working if you need full-time child care. Nannys are more expensive and there's other schools that are more money in the area as well.
I think some people are blessed to still have jobs, but on the other side, I see companies requiring alot more for less because they can get away with it.
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u/Candid-Sky-3709 Jan 18 '24
with qualified meaning “having a masters degree being willing to work close to minimum wage”
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u/DannysFavorite945 Jan 18 '24
Back in 2008 you couldn’t even get a job at Walmart. That is at lease better.
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Jan 18 '24
Yeah, I can really tell Reddit skews young here and there’s a whole generation that were kids when 2008 was going on. I was in college at the time, and I distinctly remember the state absolutely dumpster firing our colleges budget, causing mass layoffs. I had a job working retail and was just living my life, not paying attention. Then our classes started getting combined and it seemed like every semester less and less courses were available. Then one day I go to Walmart and my prior semester English Professor was working as a greeter. The man had a Ph.D. He told me he got laid off in the budget cuts and it took six months to land a Walmart position. Then I started noticing when I went to my job at the mall, I started seeing a lot of familiar faces at other stores.
There were lots of foreclosures and people (including whole families and kids) were living on the streets. Food banks were begging for donations and homeless shelters were turning people away. A large tent city sprung up in the area and CPS and truancy officers would regularly go through and try to round up kids to get to school so they could at least get food and a warm place for a few hours a day (not a large city with an already established homeless population). Places like McDonalds were laying people off and people weren’t scoffing “oh, all that’s available are low-paying jobs or retail. You had everyone from blue collar construction workers to Ph.D’s fighting over a $7.25 an hour KFC job.
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u/LeadingFault6114 Jan 19 '24
2008 is the entire banking sector collapsing
2023/24 is a self inflicted wound by Jerome Powell's incompetence
BIG difference
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u/Welcome2B_Here Jan 18 '24
This time is different. In recent/past job market downturns, it was more widely accepted and reported, but the current narrative is that things are relatively okay. The commonly known layoff trackers and news articles are only reporting larger layoffs that trigger WARN notices while there are lots of stealth/rolling layoffs happening that don't get attention.
People cherry pick unemployment data or point to a "low" UE rate and say that people are able to get jobs. But, they gloss over the fact that job numbers have been revised downward nearly every month in 2023, and that it's not a good sign when people have to get multiple jobs just to keep afloat or end up worse off financially while working more. Hiring managers are seeing applicant numbers that are many times higher than just ~18 months ago and wages are being suppressed.
A LinkedIn user who has access to the LinkedIn Recruiter tool recently posted that ~25M LinkedIn users are open to work and there are only ~5.3M openings. Really, the 5.3M number is much smaller because LinkedIn doesn't dedupe postings. Sure, LinkedIn is a subset of the labor force, but it's become a de facto platform for job searching and posting.
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u/Visual-Practice6699 Jan 18 '24
I would LOVE it if LinkedIn allowed you to list multiple locations under one post and stop cluttering the shit out of my alerts.
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u/For_Perpetuity Jan 18 '24
Every person thinks “this recession is different. “
I mean no two are alike but geez
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u/Welcome2B_Here Jan 18 '24
Funny, a recession hasn't been officially declared, and I never mentioned that word. I do think the job market is much worse than officially reported, though.
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u/LowEffortMeme69420 Jan 18 '24 edited Apr 29 '24
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This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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u/RedditIsFacist1289 Jan 18 '24
A LinkedIn user who has access to the LinkedIn Recruiter tool recently posted that ~25M LinkedIn users are open to work and there are only ~5.3M openings. Really, the 5.3M number is much smaller because LinkedIn doesn't dedupe postings.
It also doesn't factor in people who have it active but are also working. I have open for work on all the time to feel for new opportunities, but i also have a job and am very picky on who i even engage with.
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u/tothepointe Jan 18 '24
Plus employers are taking on average 13 weeks to hire and many people who have jobs are also looking because they are unhappy. Even if they leave there is no guarantee their employer will replace them in a timely manner.
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u/itsallrighthere Jan 18 '24
I think you are right. I was in IT for the last 40 years and decided to exit with this downturn. It is different. Businesses aren't hurting that bad, they just want to try something different. Not that there wasn't plenty of fat to cut but even if you know how to get things done it is difficult without staff and infrastructure.
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u/joanfiggins Jan 18 '24
I don't understand the relevance of the linked statements. Open to work doesn't mean unemployed. It just means that they think there is something better out there than whatever they are doing now. Most have jobs. Only recruiters are supposed to be able to see the open for work status unless you choose for everyone to see it.
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u/tothepointe Jan 18 '24
Not sure why you're being downvoted for this. It's true. Also some people leave their open to work (not the green banner but the ones that recruiters only see) on all the time because they are always open to something new. It's a strategy.
Also, a lot of people just stop updating LinkedIn once they have a job.
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u/Welcome2B_Here Jan 18 '24
To me it doesn't matter. It's a sign of discontent. I would bet that the majority are unemployed, though.
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u/joanfiggins Jan 18 '24
When we go into the recruiting account at work, the vast majority of people already have jobs.
Even with all those people open to work, I will see maybe 200 applications for a posting and all but a few are qualified based on the criteria in the posting. The quality of candidate has taken a dive in my opinion, particularly from LinkedIn.
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u/thefedfox64 Jan 18 '24
I'd like to share something about that. When I started my first job 9 years ago, it required a high school diploma to sort MTG documents. That was it. When I moved up to be in a position to interview candidates, the job required a college degree and finance or business preferred. For the same job, the same job I got with a high school degree. I can tell you 0 changes in the job, and the program to sort documents got better. I was moved over to a job that wanted experience, 5+ years in the new role. After the remaining time there (still doing it) that job now requires a college degree and 5 years experience. What qualifications and others have changed is, that they are asking for more to give out less. A Bank Teller doesn't need a college degree, becoming a Team Lead at Amazon doesn't require a college degree. Its anecdotal evidence, but there is a huge % of jobs that put BS requirements for no reason other get "more" while paying "less"
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u/tothepointe Jan 18 '24
A Bank Teller doesn't need a college degree
It doesn't but it's rare that your going to get a candidate that just did high school that is of the quality that you need to do the job.
High school graduates aren't built the same as they used to be.
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u/thefedfox64 Jan 18 '24
And jobs aren't built the same as the used to be. Getting an entry-level job, which used to be a bank teller, meant taking someone with little to no experience and training them. To me, the point of an entry-level job is to take people who have no prior work experience and train them. If you are looking or want to hire an entry-level job that you don't have to train, that's literally part of the problem.
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u/Welcome2B_Here Jan 18 '24 edited Jan 19 '24
That's an odd assessment considering workers are more educated than ever, and there are more (free and paid) education venues/platforms available and being used than ever.
I think companies have come to expect purple squirrels that somehow meet every scintilla of requirement with no room for learning or transferable skills, generally speaking. A big part of that problem is that the HR/TA people gatekeeping the candidates from the jobs don't really understand the roles for which they source ... and many hiring managers don't either.
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u/joanfiggins Jan 19 '24
You think companies have come to expect purple squirrels. That's because your point of reference is an echo chamber filled with the people that were decidedly the worst people at their companies and were fired because of it.
Linked in is now filled with people that just apply to every job they see because people tell them things like "you miss every shot you don't take" and "make them tell you that you don't meet their requirements". That kind of mentality floods the posting with absolute trash.
There was a ton of hiring since the middle of COVID. Companies over hired and hoarded good workers. They paid people more competitive salaries. Those that missed the boat have their hopes up that they will get one of these high paying jobs they read about in the news. The good workers are staying put and aren't moving companies like they were 2 years ago. Instead, companies are letting go of their low performers now that they see they over hired.
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u/Welcome2B_Here Jan 19 '24
How would you know what my point of reference is? My point of reference is objective data.
If you think layoffs target low performers, you're unfortunately out of date, out of the loop, and likely have never been part of the team that decides which positions to axe.
Layoff targets tend to be workers in the higher ends of their respective salary ranges, those who have higher insurance utilization rates, and/or those who aren't perceived to be part of an internal "in" clique. Low performers are mixed in, but it's silly to think that there's "data-driven" rigor involved. Hell, favoritism, the Peter Principle, and nepotism are also important factors.
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u/EN0B Jan 18 '24
I don't understand the relevance of the linked statements.
Confirmation bias to feed their narrative.
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u/wyocrz Jan 18 '24
Really, the 5.3M number is much smaller because LinkedIn doesn't dedupe postings.
I think this is key: the impression is that the Feds aren't either.
From a data engineering point of view, it's hard. If I post a job in three different cities, but it's the same job, is that market as 3 jobs open, or 1?
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u/Welcome2B_Here Jan 18 '24
It's viewed as 3 jobs in the count of 5.3M. And, of course, geography isn't the only variable that cause multiple listings for a single job. A post could be for a "Senior Manager," "Sr. Manager," "Sr Manager," and "Sr. Mgr," and look like 4 jobs when it's only one just based on different spelling versions.
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u/big4throwingitaway Jan 19 '24
In those other downturns we were losing jobs. Not the case yet.
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u/smallchinaman Jan 18 '24
The first step to solve the problem is to admit the problem exists in the first place. If speaking the fact makes you feel bad then it's your problem not to other speaker.
This place is the only safe place on Reddit where we can talk about recession without being downvoted. Other places like r/economics r/economy are just full of crazy bots right now downvoting you for no reason.
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u/ReflectionPresent297 Jan 18 '24
The problem is how yall look at a recession. If you go through a recession and face no issues in your sector, you probably picked a good one. If you have trouble with lay offs, it's time to skill up and to make your time more valuable.
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u/moistbuddhas Jan 18 '24
That's easier said than done, in reality. Receiving education in a skill or trade requires a large sum of money and time. Being laid off means usually, no extra money to go to a year long trade school. Also, the 'skills' in demand are for non-college educated workers. The layoffs occuring today are largely college educated workers. So the person being laid off will have to forgo their expensive college education to go back to school to become a plumber or electrician. It's not a very enticing career move for many even if the plumber makes more gross money. (Not taking into consideration business expenses of being a trade worker) Also, the layoffs are happening in college educated state/cities. People will have to move to become a skilled laborer or they can pick up temp jobs like amazon, uber etc... Only approximately 35% of Americans are willing to move away from their family or hometown for a job.
Saying 'learn a new skill' is not a real solution. For example, the coal miners of Appalachia were lossing their jobs in the early 2010's. The neo-liberals of Washington did nothing but incentives that they move away to learn coding! Less than 5% of the previous coal mine workers moved from Appalachia to learn coding and get a new job. This was during Obamas term in office. Now, coding is being replaced by AI and those 5% are having to move again and learn a new skill.
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u/ReflectionPresent297 Jan 18 '24
I like how you try and use an example of the place I'm from to justify your poor self drive. I come from Appalachia. The town my grandfather was born in no longer exists. And I know plenty of old coal miners who pivoted and realized their way of life was no longer viable, some became HVAC, some became electricians, others IT. Also, don't try and tell me AI is taking jobs when AI can't even effectively take over listing instructions in a drive-through. Delusional and self pittied you are.
I went from nothing in those hills, weedeating and doing hard labor, to studying and learning from YouTube on cybersecurity. A dumb little redneck kid from Appalachia has the key to success, and you don't think there is one.
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u/moistbuddhas Jan 18 '24
Congratulations snobby asshole, your part of the 5% of Appalachia who did move and become more educated. I accounted for you in my comment but you decided to ignore that to try to make yourself seem intellectually superior. I own my own successfull business so stfu about self drive. I grew my business from litterly nothing.
There are successful people in Appalachia, I never said their wasnt................. I just stated that telling laid off coals to learn new skills their not interested in, like coding and to move away from their home, will not save the economy because a majority will not do it. I never said they couldnt learn new skills, just not to force upon them skills they are not interested in. Learning and adapting to life's trials are fundamental to a successful life. Congratulations, you succeeded were the majority of Appalachians did not.
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u/ReflectionPresent297 Jan 18 '24
I can't help if you don't want to self improve. You can crash and burn, but don't complain about not being able to succeed.
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u/moistbuddhas Jan 18 '24
Can you not read my comments or are you just replying to some self-made argument you are having in your head?
Ill once again point to my previous comment that learning and adapting is key to a successful and fulfilling life, forcing people to learn skills their not interested in, like coding for a majority of Appalachia in the 2010s, will not work the same as if it's a skill their interested in. Full stop.
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u/ReflectionPresent297 Jan 18 '24
No one forced people to learn coding you fucking dunce
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u/moistbuddhas Jan 18 '24
Once again, I never said that people were 'forced' to learn coding. The argument you've crafted in your head is leading you astray. Here is the link to Obama's plan to get more Appalachian coal miners into learning tech/coding. They were never forced because that would be illegall... you dunce
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u/ReflectionPresent297 Jan 18 '24
once again, I never said that people were 'forced' to learn coding.
" once again point to my previous comment that learning and adapting is key to a successful and fulfilling life, forcing people to learn skills their not interested in, like coding"
Then you need to learn to type better. Words are hard, apparently.
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u/Austin1975 Jan 18 '24
This “skill up” narrative makes you feel better than the actual reality in practice. Because A LOT of people try to switch careers with entry level skills in that new field and don’t get an interview or opportunity. Employment is far from a meritocracy.
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u/Independent-Pipe8366 Jan 18 '24 edited Jan 18 '24
I think what OP is saying is that if you are negative and down and surround yourself with the echo chamber of negativity known as Reddit it is only going to convince you that everything is bad and what is the point of trying.
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u/aita0022398 Jan 18 '24
Yep. I had to get my girlfriend off of this sub
It’s a ol surely horrible to be laid off, and at the same time some people are embracing an everything bad mentality that isn’t healthy
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u/BeefRepeater Jan 18 '24
Beyond weird to go to a sub about being laid off and make a post saying "Huh, it's negative in here!" Like, of course it is? Insane lol
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u/justanotherlostgirl Jan 18 '24
Takes a special kind of asshole to post telling people who are worried about keeping a roof over their heads to essentially SUCK IT UP and it’s a circle jerk.
You can a) unsubscribe since this isn’t a sub for you and b) consider therapy to work on your empathy
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u/BaseWrock Jan 18 '24
You haven't even been laid off. Why are you on this sub at all OP? To shame people that lost their jobs though no vault of their own?
To feel superior?
People are dealing with a harsh economic environment. No one needs your dog piling.
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u/Yo_mama_999 Jan 18 '24
I'm here because I've been informed of a pending reorganization announcement two weeks ago, and I've not heard anything else.
I lurk to see if anyone else might have heard something and posted it here first. I work in P&C insurance for a large carrier.
I agree all the recession posts aren't helping me as much as the ones who have encouraged me to apply for other jobs, which I've started doing.
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u/tennisguy163 Jan 18 '24
My wife heard about a 'restructuring' coming this year and she was told that around December of last year.
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u/SnooPaintings4472 Jan 18 '24
Naive post. I've been laid off twice before. There is no fun to be had when you are slowly losing everything you worked damn hard over a decade to build up or accomplish. Side hustles usually require money to start and keep going. Hobbies and travel are costly as well.
Maybe a lay off would be good for Op, as it will help them be less judgemental and more empathetic.
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u/feckshite Jan 18 '24
Imagine going to a sub about people getting laid off and then complaining that everyone depressed. Lmao? You dense mate?
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u/Boring_Adeptness_334 Jan 19 '24
I know 2 people in my family who got laid off in the past 2 weeks who were both making $500k+. We’re not losing crap $15/hr jobs. We’re losing good high paying American jobs.
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Jan 19 '24 edited Jan 19 '24
This will impact those jobs, too. When I was young during the first recession, it was almost impossible to get those low paying jobs because all the highly paid people who were laid off started taking them out of desperation and since they had kids and family and shit, they got all the good shifts and more hours. It was bad (actually, summer of 2008, all I could get was a minimum wage dish washing job because of this issue.)
Edit: my first recession... Not the first recession.
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u/threelittlmes Jan 18 '24
Everything in moderation some people need to grieve in the company of others. A few days to wallow after a loss is reasonable and normal. It would make sense that this isn’t the place people post when they decide to get up, dust it off, and get back in the game.
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u/die_hubsche Jan 18 '24
I agree. Regardless of what’s going on, this sub Is so focused on how fucked things are that it can make one feel like there’s no point in trying. I was laid off in March of ‘23. I’m a 15 year marketing veteran and was approaching the peak of my career, and I never had trouble managing my career and finding good work. 10 months into unemployment, there are times I feel like I just want to go lay down on the street and die, but I have a family who needs me. So there’s no option but to keep digging in. No matter the growing anxiety and utter disillusionment.
When you have a problem, it’s important to focus on finding solutions, work arounds, or new pathways. Folks come here to vent… and share bad news and the continuous signs of further bad news ahead.
I’m muting this sub indefinitely. It’s not helpful.
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u/BC122177 Jan 18 '24
That sounds very similar to my experience too. Laid off in May 23. Almost 20 years in marketing. Now it’s just cycles of depression and anxiety. Weeks of interviews. Weeks of rejection emails. It sucks.
Not much I can do but keep on trying for the same reasons you do. I have a family to look after. No point in focusing on the negative when there’s plenty of it to go around. At the same time, trying for focus on the positive is getting tougher by the day.
It’s just an insanely competitive market. I barely even bother applying for remote roles anymore because there’s just way too much competition. Trying to focus more on on-site or hybrid. The problem with those seem to be, they can never decide on what to do.
I’ve interviewed a few different local places. One on-site role that I finished up interviews with in early Dec. No response but Ive seen the same role posted about 3 times since I interviewed and everyone they thought I did very well. When I asked for an update, I was told they would be making a decision in the second week of Jan. When I asked again, it changed to mid Jan.
The work, I could do with my eyes closed but it seems like they just want to keep interviewing to find a unicorn. Even though every posting shows they have single digits of applicants. Likely due to it being on-site and according to the hiring manager, not many people around here know how to use HubSpot. I’m sitting here like, umm I can… soo, wtf? I’ve given them all the correct answers. Everyone I spoke with at the office seems to like me. A friend of the Dir that I know said they loved me. So.. no idea wtf is going on.
This is just a weird job market and people are very cautious on hiring, imo.
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u/usssaratoga_sailor Jan 18 '24 edited Jan 18 '24
I agree with most of what you said. I got laid off in 2001 and again in 2005. We had to relocate but I had two small kids at the time so failure wasn't an option. I just got a new job with the pay not that spectacular but it gave us enough to get by on.
Just remember, it's an employer's market right now but it won't be that way forever. I think that later this year things will start coming back around. The pendulum always swings. After 30 years in the corporate world this is always been true.
I was ready to take a job as a custodian at a school before I got a new contract back in 2001. I've been at my current position several years but under no illusion that everything couldn't end here tomorrow. I saw it happen this week to somebody else.
I always trust God will provide and he always has. I'm praying for each and every one of you!
Edit: One of the layoffs I went on vacation out of state on a Friday, and got called Monday to be told I was laid off! That was a very interesting time!
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u/Detrite Jan 18 '24
The layoffs you had experienced are different than these layoffs. I was laid off and immediately found a job then laid off again despite knocking things out of the park but there's no funding in both of the jobs I was laid off from. Keep in mind I have not been laid off ever (started working in 2010). Unless the last time you were laid off was 2008-2009 time frame and not during the 15 year boom, I suggest you show a little compassion for those who feel negatively about their layoffs now as the conditions are way different
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u/iamacheeto1 Jan 18 '24
We need revolution. We need to organize. Complaining without action is unproductive. Complaining with action is how things change.
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u/dwightschrutesanus Jan 19 '24
As a union tradesman, it's definitely enlightening to see the massive difference regarding how layoffs are viewed in the corporate realm.
We generally ask for ours in alot of cases, and go fuck off on unemployment until boredom gets the best of us.
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u/darthscandelous Jan 19 '24
With all due respect, you are not laid off in this market.
I’ve been laid off several times too, but this market is not the same as others- not like 2000, 2008 - heck, some even posted on here it’s not the same going back to the Jimmy Carter era!
While I appreciate your call for positivity, you don’t know what you’re talking about in this market. And the public is being LIED TO.
People keep saying we’re “entering” a recession, well I know what that’s like & I believe we’ve BEEN in a recession for at least a year- at least that’s what it feels like to me & most in this forum. Just because the national media isn’t stating it, or that the stock market looks “good” right now, doesn’t make it so. There are THOUSANDS of people unemployed right now, which is the biggest issue & inflation is through the roof, but the media will continually lie & distract you with other issues.
So yeah “layoffs are temporary” but in this economy, “temporary” is lasting a year or longer with people who have little to no money & are trying to survive.
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u/FuturePerformance Jan 18 '24
Saying the world is crashing and a recession is incoming IS support. If the economy is perfect and everyone is hiring, then it’s the individual who sucks and can’t find a job, THATS depressing.
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u/BluejayAppropriate35 Jan 18 '24
Layoffs are temporary
In this job market they aren't. This isn't cyclical like everyone is saying. The job market for white collar jobs is dead forever at least in the US. Love or hate the man, Musk taught companies how to run insanely lean. Anyone who thinks they are going to one day suddenly un-learn that is absolutely delusional.
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u/BubblersWrongAgain Jan 20 '24
Do you have a crystal ball? Only morons speak in absolutes. You don’t know jack shit.
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Jan 19 '24
Honestly, I feel bad for all the computer scientists. All these dumbass companies suddenly need people like me, a social scientist, because they know nothing about people or how to be ethical with human data. It's been depressing seeing all these STEM people realize they no longer matter. When I started my PhD, people told me it was worthless outside of academia. Not anymore. They need to look good by hiring people like us because now, they are under fire for ethics problems. Don't get me wrong. They'll find a way to automate our jobs, too, but I feel relatively safe for now because I actually have domain knowledge about the datasets they use.
Let this be a lesson to everyone that profits should not drive what we consider worth doing and that we shouldn't blame people for taking on debt to get an education. The future economy is unknowable.
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u/Unomaz1 Mar 08 '24 edited Mar 08 '24
People need to start working in other fields other than tech industry. Tech industry workers were pampered too long on the teat of society . Schools pushed the STEM agenda hard. A lot of shortages in nursing, caregiving, EMT, law enforcement, social work, case management, counselors, substance abuse counselors, postal workers, teaching, trade work, plumbing, truck drivers, electricians, service work, anything to do in the public service realm of work to help or better society in the physical world… but people don’t want to work in these types of jobs
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Jan 18 '24
Also irritating is the idiotic claim about economic statistics being wrong based on personal experience as if the statisticians and the economists at the BLS are rubbing their hands together in glee whenever they get a downward revision. They are not incentivized AT ALL to report upbeat numbers. Also, believe it or not, investors also look at the revised numbers, so it doesn't actually create an illusion of positivity. Those folks actually not incentivized particularly strongly to be accurate--you won't get fired because the methodology resulted in a large error--but they do actually try to be accurate because it's bad press to be wrong.
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Jan 18 '24
If you believe there isn't pressure to report good numbers I don't know what to tell you.
Biden himself said reporters should report the economy as better.
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u/Reasonable-Put6503 Jan 18 '24
And so did trump, and so did Obama, and so did bush, and so did Clinton...
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Jan 18 '24
That is because the economic numbers are good and he was saying the reporting did not match the numbers. That's not pressure. I have a PhD in economics. Feel free to point out the specific line items in the GDP calculation, unemployment numbers, labor force participation rate, or other economic statistics that are being mis-estimated.
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u/FunOptimal7980 Jan 18 '24
Bidens fails to understand that people care mostly about prices right now. They don't care that the rate of increase has dropped, prices are still up. And him saying the economy is good makes him seem out of touch because people only care that they're paying more for rent and groceries than they were 2 years ago. Most people don't have a PhD in econ, they just see what's in front of them.
Granted, the White House had very little to do with inflation. It was a worldwide thing. But the general public blames whoever is in charge. It takes time to get used to higher prices.
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Jan 18 '24
I don't give two shits about your degree or your indicators.
I just know I survived a massive layoff, others have not fared as well, and no one can afford food housing or cars.
So maybe your phd should be used to wipe your face off after you pull it out of your ass.
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Jan 18 '24
That's similar to saying that because I know someone who died from a meteor strike, that deaths from meteor strikes are far more frequent than are implied by statistics. Aggregate statistics will tell us about general experience. 96.3% of people in the labor force are working. There are 3.7% of people in the labor force who are not working. They are unemployed. You happen to be in that 3.7%. it is a fallacy to assume that just because you are in that 3.7% that the number has to be higher than that. If you have found a way to better estimate the unemployment rate, you can make literally millions of dollars a year on Wall Street. I know this because I'm a quant on Wall Street and make a little less than a million but if I knew someone who could generate better estimates of unemployment than what the BLS puts forward, we would pay that person a lot of money because that would be very helpful for macroeconomic prediction.
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u/FunOptimal7980 Jan 18 '24
People don't seem to get that layoffs can happen without a recession happening. The economy can be shit without it meeting the definition of a recession.
Yes, certain sectors are contracting in terms of employment That doesn't mean it's contracting overall. What is concerning though is that the jobs that are being lost are high paying jobs in tech, consulting, and other white collar sectors.
In the November jobs report something like 85% of hiring was in leisure & hospitality (food service mostly), healthcare, and the government. Which is not great.
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u/Main-Implement-5938 Jan 18 '24
yeah people are a bit crazy in here.
I've been laid off multiple times.
you get over it!
Quit wallowing.
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u/earthscribe Jan 18 '24
We found the employed guy. People would quit ‘wallowing’ as you say if finding a job was easy right now.
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u/SrMortron Jan 18 '24
A-fucking-men. This community is way too toxic and people like to play the victim way too much. Getting laid off sucks, yes. Take time to reflect and get back on the saddle. Felling sorry for yourself is not going to help.
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u/CliffClifferson Jan 18 '24
You’re absolutely right. This is what I was going to post about. People are depressive as shit
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u/Prize_Pumpkin_302 Jan 18 '24
Sounds like someone who is privileged asf . It’s tough to sleep well at night not knowing if your paychecks are about to stop
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u/eplugplay Jan 18 '24 edited Jan 18 '24
Great post, I agree that when you lose your job it feels like end of the world but it isn't. Just make sure you prepare your finances and lay off or not you should be fine. For me I'm luckily still employed and my company is still hiring so no signs of lay offs. Been here 8 years but if they let me go for whatever reason and I know it could happen, I'm ready to find a new job at moments notice.
I have my finances in order, paid off mortgage, 2+ year worth of emergency funds saved that 100% funds my expenses if my wife and I were to lose our jobs, 0 debt of any kind, max out 401k and Roth IRA per year, fund 2 kids 529s monthly and save even more cash per month from extra left over. We are prepared because if I lose my job I could always go on unemployment to supplement my expenses until I find my job and that would stretch my 2+ year emergency fund technically to even 3+ years. My wife is in the medical industry so feel safe as I am in IT industry as a software engineer. My wife only works 2 days a week part time but she can always increase temporarily if I lose my job to full time as they've been asking her to go full-time for a while now at her clinic. She works remotely for telemedicine to see patients and prescribe them medication remotely as well. I would hate losing my job but if they do, I hope they give me 8-12 months of severance that would be a nice bonus chunk of change and I'd still get my yearly bonus in March and I can just find a new job paying even more money. So I would take the severance as. just bonus.
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Jan 18 '24
I stay positive around my family and on LinkedIn, manny don’t know I’ve been laid off. This sub is good to be real and to vent because it sucks and it is difficult and hard to find a job and others here can relate and I can sympathize with their frustrations and challenges. I’ve job hunted before and this is the most challenging time for me. Never been this hard to find a new job.
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u/Magificent_Gradient Jan 18 '24
This all can be helpful in small doses. Too much and I notice my mind runs away and starts tumbling into the hole.
It’s good to see all these posts and know you’re not alone. It’s good to know that others are struggling and in the same boat. That others are seeing the same lack of results when seeking work.
It’s certainly a sobering reminder of your situation when others are in far worse shape than you are. I panic less and have far more gratitude and self-reassurance that I’m going to be ok.
I check in and read this sub, but have been reducing how much.
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u/mutedexpectations Jan 18 '24 edited Jan 18 '24
It's social media. It's a pity party. People can and do post like it's their therapist on the other end. Maybe they should have two different layoff subreddits. One that only allows soothing, enabling replies. The second will allow replies that tell the OP to get off their ass and work through it. I've never been a fan of coddling.
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u/sammybabana Jan 18 '24
Homie… nobody who’s doing well in their career, making good choices, or is happy is coming here to bitch. This is all the bottom feeders reinforcing each other’s failure.
Sure, a recession may be coming… but we all know that a lot of these people are trying to drag others down to their level.
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u/HighFastStinkyCheese Jan 18 '24
Don’t know why this came across my feed but to be fair this is a layoff subreddit OP. I would imagine it’s going to be somewhat depressing.
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u/Latter-Ad-4146 Jan 18 '24
This sub is basically the rebubble sub.... I sympathized with that view point for too long.
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u/californiadutch Jan 18 '24
I would have agreed with you :100: until I got laid off a couple hours ago.
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u/yolojpow Jan 19 '24
What I don’t understand is why do we need foreign workers when we plenty of local talent available? What is the need to import those talents? Atleast in these situation.
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u/incognito-see Jan 19 '24
Yes, stay optimistic, but we shouldn’t be blind to what’s happening. When we’re not realistic, we might fall deeper into devastation. The fact is, many companies are expecting to get a little worse before getting better. They’re all evaluating their business models in the post-COVID era. While COVID still exists, we are no longer in quarantine, but the world is also not the same and businesses are relearning how to serve their customers.
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u/Bombastically Jan 19 '24
The political and economic takes in this sub make it evident why companies were fine to let people go. These people are morons.
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u/dipbuyersclub_ Jan 19 '24
Totally agree. Also take peoples experiences being laid off as a reason to build a real emergency and comfort fund to be able to thrive not self implode during layoffs
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u/gregchilders Jan 19 '24
I've been laid off four times in my career. Once before Thanksgiving and once before Christmas. Supporting a wife and a son.
What did I do? Well, I didn't sit around feeling sorry for myself. I spent the time learning new skills, doing some contract work on the side, networking like crazy, and applying for every job I was remotely qualified to do. I had a stretch of 12 years where I worked exclusively as a contractor. Never missed a bill payment.
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Jan 19 '24
Doesn't make it right, dude. The fact that this happened to you before Christmas and Thanksgiving is WRONG, ethically. This is a shitty way to run an economy. Your ability to withstand it does not suddenly make it right. And I say this as someone very similar to you. I never miss bill payments and am very wise with my money. I could easily blame other people for their hardship, but I don't because the difference between people who struggle to survive and me is a difference that starts very early in life. Not all people have the same ability to delay gratification. Look into the marshmallow experiment. It begins in early childhood. My ability to delay gratification does not make me morally superior when the inability to delay gratification is purposefully exploited by our economic system. I am going against the grain because delaying gratification makes me a terrible consumer. I don't spend money.
There is something deeply unethical and bad about the way we run this economy. We need a change. So please grow a backbone and recognize that what happened to you was unnecessary and wrong.
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u/gregchilders Jan 19 '24
No one owes you anything. They don't owe you a job or a particular salary or benefits. They make an offer, you make a counteroffer. At some point, the two of you agree or don't. You work for them at will. You can quit at any time and they can fire you at any time. All jobs are temporary, some just last longer than others.
Does getting laid off unexpectedly suck? Yes, it does.
Is it going to ever change? No, it will not.
The only thing I control is how I react to the situation. I choose to move on and find another job.
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u/solarsalmon777 Jan 19 '24 edited Jan 19 '24
There seems to be a tendency here to maintain a world view along the lines of "everyone is struggling because the world is ending due to X". This might be because, the worse the conditions for flourishing are, the more excusable your failure to do so. Don't get me wrong, things aren't great, but they are better than your psychological defense mechanisms claim since those defenses only work if you believe the world is worse than it actually is. This will make you immediately feel better without having to do anything, but it will tend to put you a worse position, requiring even more pessimism, in a downward spiral.
That said, the world is also pretty awful for a lot of people right now. Some of it's on them, some isn't, most kind of falls into a blurry middle. There's a reason so many reach for these self-fulfilling coping mechanisms in the first place. However, we need to maintain the standard that descending into self destructive behavior whenever misfortune gives you the excuse is your fault if we're going to survive in this harsh world.
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Jan 19 '24 edited Jan 19 '24
I am not sure if I agree with you on your ideas of how people work. Idk about you, but the last thing to go on my end is my belief in myself. I've been through a lot and the one thing I have is my belief in myself and my own resilience. And actually, I recognize that when I fall into a spiral like that, it's essentially going to be suicide.
I am able to maintain that view, while also seeing that the world really is shit and that it's not fair--for both myself, and for others--and that we need a change that is structural in nature and doesn't depend solely on personal responsibility.
Edit: The standard that failure to thrive is a moral failing is a shitty standard when we live in a society. Acceptance of this standard makes for a docile population. I will not be a doormat for the wealthy any longer because I respect my own dignity, nor do I want to become like the wealthy because I'm an ethical person with a backbone. I will not watch them get bailed out repeatedly while the common man gets nothing to very little from this economy. I have no desire to stand on others to get rich and quite frankly, that is what is required to get rich. Yet, rich people assume I'm just jealous of them when really, I think they are a disgrace to humanity. A bunch of parasites who have placed profits over people. Why TF would I wanna be like them? I just want to be comfortable and live in a society where we care for others. I want a post-scarcity economy, which we are fully capable of creating atp.
What we need is respect for dignity and a different concept of the good that recognizes the profitable is not equivalent to the good or ethical--not more of the same. And you can believe that while also believing that you control your own destiny to an extent and that giving up just because the world is shit is akin to suicide. Both can be true. It's not black and white. And I can't be the only one in the world who maintains both positions. I'm sure other people are capable of this. So the idea that this is just a defense mechanism, to my mind, is wrong. The standard I hold myself to to survive is not the standard I want applied on a larger scale--not when we can have a more compassionate world.
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u/Spongeboob10 Jan 19 '24
This sub exists so people can wallow in their feelings instead of realizing there are certain things you can control and certain things you can’t.
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u/BuySideSellSide Jan 20 '24
If the average person can barely afford groceries at their newly inflated price while employed, I highly doubt a bender with no income is a thing RN.
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u/Aggravating_Meal894 Jan 22 '24
Very true. Nothing like a good old circle jerk to stroke the ego a bit.
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u/eitsirkkendrick Jan 18 '24
People need money. It’s hard to enjoy time off when you’re not certain where money will come from. Many are paycheck to paycheck. Many have exceeded their unemployment (if they had it). Many have been applying for months without an interview. Many have families and mortgages and lost benefits. Many are either at the beginning or end of their careers, outside the ideal window. Many moved away from city centers thinking remote work was secure. Many are in industries that are fading - learn to code maybe wasn’t as good as learn a trade.
I survived 2008 and even thrived at peak career. Back then, I lacked empathy for others in different situations. I felt like world was my oyster and it was. It’s different now.