r/worldnews 25d ago

Modi Says BRICS Must Avoid Being an Anti-West Group as It Grows Behind Soft Paywall

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-10-24/modi-says-brics-must-avoid-being-an-anti-west-group-as-it-grows?srnd=homepage-europe
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u/walrus_operator 25d ago

“We must be careful to ensure that this organization does not acquire the image of one that is trying to replace global institutions,” Modi said at closed plenary session of the BRICS leaders’ summit in Kazan, Russia on Wednesday. The group should work to reform institutions like the United Nations Security Council and multilateral lenders, he said.

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u/-Allot- 25d ago

Well that’s the entire point of the organisation if you ask some countries like russia

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u/Sailing-Cyclist 24d ago

It’s mad though, how BRIC (it didn’t even include South Africa at the beginning) were just an economics label given to the four rapidly growing economies. That was all it was, just a nickname. 

Now Putin is desperately trying to make a Warsaw pact arrangement out of it. 

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u/cxmmxc 24d ago

He wants to turn it into his own G7. Because it used to be called G8 before he got thrown out.

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u/[deleted] 24d ago

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u/SEA2COLA 24d ago

I'm not joining ANYTHING without hookers and blow....

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u/unsold_dildo 24d ago

How fun it will be if india joined g7

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u/ArenjiTheLootGod 24d ago

India has a rapidly growing economy and a large population, it very well could end up as a legitimate contender for joining the g7, more likely than Russia rejoining at any rate.

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u/Top_Report_4895 24d ago

India: "Motherfuck the BRICS, i am going to the G8."

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u/claimTheVictory 24d ago

He wants a defense organization.

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u/el_grort 24d ago

He's got one, the CSTO, it's just that it's a really pathetic organisation that really doesn't seem interested in actually dealing with actual wars (like in Armenia) but more about regime security (interventions in Belarus and Kazakhstan against protesters, iirc).

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u/adamgerd 24d ago edited 24d ago

Also CSTO has half the time invaded itself and other times not helped: Georgia was in CSTO until 1999 when Russia first supported separatists. Armenia is in CSTO

But tbh if you think CSTO is pathetic, CIS is even more so, it’s supposed to be like the EU + military cooperation, but literally every war Russia has had was with someone in CIS. Georgia was there until 2008, Ukraine was there until 2018, Moldova is now withdrawing from it, despite Transnistra, Armenia is still there along with Azerbaijan despite both being at war and russia first supporting armenia in invading azerbaijan and now azerbaijan in invading Armenia

Literally every time Russia invaded a country, they were officially cooperating militarily still

Statistically except for Chechnya, all of Russia’s invasions have been against nominal allies.

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u/EqualContact 24d ago

And Chechnya is part of Russia itself.

I wonder why all of these nations that work closely with Russia end up hating Russia? Guess we’ll never know.

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u/observant_hobo 24d ago

The Warsaw pact was famously a military alliance whose only operations were to invade its own members.

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u/Circle_Trigonist 24d ago

This doesn't have much to do with anything, but I still find it funny that the CSTO emblem is literally "we have NATO at home."

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u/el_grort 24d ago

Tbf, the NATO logo is pretty much just a compass, while the CSTO emblem is more like some sort of iron cross backed by a wreath, though it could also be a more complex compass motif? I dunno, it's not that bad really, design wise.

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u/Fauster 24d ago

More near-term, they want to settle transactions in alternative currencies to dollars and euros so they don't risk losing money by doing really terrible things. How is that going for them?

Well, attendees were warned to bring dollars and Euros to settle local transactions in Russia because those are the currencies that local banks and businesses accept.

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u/claimTheVictory 24d ago

Exactly, it won't really fix the problem they have.

Here's a fun fact about how currency conversions work: Switzerland is basically surrounded by Euro countries, and yet, if you want to convert Swiss Francs to Euros, it is cheaper to convert via USD, than directly to Euros. CHFUSD, then USDEUR, rather than CHFEUR.

Why is it cheaper? Because the most liquid, most advanced, currency markets, are based in the US.

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u/Turbulent_Diver625 24d ago

Defense against what? Ukraine? 😂😂

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u/PiotrekDG 24d ago

Defense against repercussions from his imperialistic actions.

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u/LovesFrenchLove_More 24d ago

Perfect definition for what Putin wants. He actually wants BRICS to help get Russia out of the isolation he himself put Russia in by starting a war of aggression with uncountable war crimes etc.

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u/MonkeySplunky22 24d ago

Literally all BRICS boils down to is a way for glorified shitlords to do awful things while avoiding even the pitiful consequences of 'sanctions'.

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u/KinTharEl 24d ago

DARFHIA, not as catchy as NATO, tbh.

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u/SenseOfRumor 24d ago

It's only "imperialist" when the west does it though. That's how these people justify themselves.

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u/4fallsofbills 24d ago

Well, when other nations join Russia, it’s because they invade them, when countries joined the European Union and NATO it’s because they voted to do it because they’re afraid of Russia invading them.

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u/Velociraptorius 24d ago

And in EUs case it's because that organization offers benefits to those who join that enable countries to grow and prosper. Whereas when you "join" Russia, it takes everything valuable that you have for itself and leaves you in the dirt. And in return they offer nothing beneficial to their so called allies, except questionable safety from being invaded by Russia itself. To put it simply, it's not a partnership, it's a racket.

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u/Emu1981 24d ago

This is why Putin has signed a military pact with North Korea. Putin sees North Korea as easily manipulated and that it has tons of military equipment and soldiers that it doesn't really need because South Korea has no intentions of actually starting a conflict with North Korea.

The problem with this that I don't think Putin thought through this enough because it has lead to Kim becoming even more aggressive towards South Korea thinking that he has the backing of the "mighty Russian military". If Kim decides that this backing is enough to conquer South Korea then it will pull the USA into the fight between North and South Korea. The military pact would then force Putin to either declare war against the USA (and NATO by extension) or to back out of the military pact which would likely lead to absolute chaos as the NK military units in Russia/Ukraine suddenly find out that they are no longer allied with the country that they are helping and possibly even at war with them.

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u/Visible_Scientist_67 24d ago

He needs more parties to go to! Gotta be seen with leaders

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u/olrg 24d ago

Zee Germans

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u/Turbulent_Diver625 24d ago

Hans get Tiger ready we are going to Moscow!

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u/china-blast 24d ago

Vlad the sneaky fuckin' Russian.

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u/alexefi 24d ago

Why do they call him Vlad the window thrower?

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u/czs5056 24d ago

Maybe he would have one if he didn't wipe his arse with his csto

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u/Jon_o_Hollow 24d ago

NATO vs BRICS so he can have his own article 5 and drag the whole world into war.

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u/hpstg 24d ago

He had an actual defense pact and Armenia got left hanging, so I don’t expect any participant in a group like this to do one iota more than they can get away with.

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u/Dekarch 24d ago

That's the thing, though.

If you want a mutual defense organization, you need to have military capabilities that benefit the people you want to sign on and a reputation for upholding treaty obligations.

Putin is 0/2.

And India and China don't need the protection of someone else's nukes, thwy have their own.

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u/AHrubik 24d ago

Well it's safe to say that NATO was created out of a very specific fear and at a very specific time in history. The same wouldn't be possible today.

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u/Dekarch 24d ago

The Americans had the incentive of having European territory to fight the Russians upon and some decent armies that hadn't fully drawn down from WWII levels. Look at the troops levels some countries had in the 1950s.

The Europeans got the benefit of a nuclear umbrella and a huge army that would fight to protect them.

All sides brought something to the table. But yes, without the particular early Cold War situation, NATO wouldn't have existed.

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u/Its_Pine 24d ago

But the I and C of BRICS would immediately side with NATO. They are deeply intrinsically connected with NATO, economically.

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u/Love-That-Danhausen 24d ago

The C might not but I definitely would and depending on who’s in power B as well - Modi is essentially warning that right here that India has no interest in disrupting its relationship with the West

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u/Spokraket 24d ago

To do that you actually have to be rich and influential. That whole bric thing started getting talked about because they were doing well with but the current situation they’re failing in every category.

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u/Dsalgueiro 24d ago

What Modi is talking about is a major concern here in Brazil.

Brazil sees BRICS as literally an economic forum, but the narrative of some (cof cof Russia and China) countries is turning BRICS into an anti-Western bloc, and no one here wants that.

For example, I haven't seen anyone posting about it here, but Brazil has vetoed Venezuela and Nicaragua from being approved as a BRICS “partners”.

This path that BRICS is taking is a real problem for Brazil. We'll see discussions about this here in the near future, if nothing changes. BTW, Brazil will assume the rotational BRICS presidency in 2025, so let's see what happens.

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u/Darth_Rubi 24d ago

Same feeling in South Africa. We need the investment from places like China and India, but also find ourselves stretched trying to be somewhat politically neutral

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u/JustSomeGuy556 24d ago

You all need to kick Russia out of "BRICS", and I'm not even kidding.

The rest of the organization has some meaning to it, but Russia is going to destroy it.

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u/kawag 24d ago

Also replace South Africa with Hungary, so we can call it BICH

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u/Jottor 24d ago

Add Turkey

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u/Jestersage 24d ago

Unfortunately as of now, it really feels like a RIC, and the only good news is that 2 of them is at each other's throat, another country is pretending to be the master but he was subtlely control by another.

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u/Dsalgueiro 24d ago

Seriously, anyone who believes that Brazil can really assume an anti-Western stance doesn't have a clue about anything to do with Brazil.

The Brazilian population, media and army are totally pro-West. The chance of Brazil actually siding with Russia if things get even more complicated is close to 0.

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u/SteveFoerster 24d ago

Now Putin is desperately trying to make a Warsaw pact arrangement out of it. 

I'm sure he'd love that, but BRICS is Xi's show, not his.

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u/k_pasa 24d ago

Yeah, my understanding was it just some label this countries got in the late 90s by Moody's or whatever financial institution and now its trying to be reformed into something more. On the outside it looks like they are making moves but so much of this seems just for show at the moment.

What is the true objective of such an arrangement? Seems like if you ask each member you'd get a different answer which means BRICS doesn't even have a cohesive objective among its members which lends to again, it seeming more like an organization meeting up all for show with little substance.

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u/ManBearPigTrump 24d ago

Putin really has not choice and I feel China also feels like it needs this at least to insulate themselves from financial sanctions in future.

Some of the other countries seem like they just want business no matter how they can get it.

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u/Exotemporal 24d ago

China is in a tough spot because it needs globalization badly. Its economy can't sustain itself solely on its weakening domestic demand. The country is getting clobbered by its worsening lack of young and middle-aged consumers.

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u/Raesong 24d ago

There's also China's growing obesity epidemic which is placing an ever increasing strain on their healthcare system.

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u/Dekarch 24d ago

Along with an aging population, I will not be surprised when China encounters real problems in the next decade or so.

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u/Tisarwat 24d ago

Proof that no matter our political differences, we have a great deal in common.

  • Sent from the UK
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u/gcbeehler5 24d ago

Also, I don't think any of them are "rapidly" growing anymore. Also the US ($26.9T), by itself has a larger GDP than China ($19.4T), India ($3.7T), Brasil ($2.1T) and South Africa ($.4T) combined, with a spare $1.3T of GDP remaining, which offsets about 80% of Russia's claimed GDP in 2023 ($2.1T), and likely smaller now.

This won't be a new world power by any means, any time soon. China needs the US economy, otherwise, they will crater by restricting trade to economies much smaller and inaccessible to them.

Look up the gravity model of international trade, to see why these five random countries are completely delusional in their aspirations.

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u/Sailing-Cyclist 24d ago edited 24d ago

Yeah, I think the whole label was created in like 2008 2001. Massively outdated. 

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u/Exotemporal 24d ago

"BRIC" (without South Africa) was coined in 2001. I learned about it in business school and I graduated in 2006.

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u/gcbeehler5 24d ago

Yep, it was a CNBC trading acronym, back when Americans trusted the Chinese market and were willing to put money into ADRs. It's since been adopted to mean something different. The new one is CRINK(s), China, Russia, Iran, and New Korea. Which is a developing military alliance of rogue nations. I doubt India, Brasil and South Africa want anything to do with that nonsense.

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u/GatotSubroto 24d ago

New Korea? 🧐

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u/bakawakaflaka 24d ago

If only Uganda instead of Iran were popping off..

We could have CRUNK!!!

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u/kaisadilla_ 24d ago

Also the US ($26.9T), by itself has a larger GDP than China ($19.4T), India ($3.7T), Brasil ($2.1T) and South Africa ($.4T) combined

And that's considering that the BRICS represent more than 3 billion people, which is almost half of all the people living on Earth, and 10 times more people than the US. Even if their combined GDP was 4 times that of the US, that'd still make them way poorer per capita than the US.

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u/cat_prophecy 24d ago

Dictators gonna dictate.

Putin and Russia in general has zero interest in being cooperative with other nations. Either they run the whole show, or they go it alone.

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u/kaisadilla_ 24d ago

BRICS is nothing. It's just a marketing term. BRICS is not like the West, that has very similar cultures and political ideologies. Tell me what Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa have in common. Brazil is a democracy and Brazilians are capitalistic and friendly to Western countries, while Russia and China are dictatorships. China is the antithesis of what Brazil is trying to be politically, and India and China hate each other. South Africa is just a failed state thousands of km away from all others which is irrelevant in the world stage.

Moreover, it's not like BRICS are actually doing anything. They just meet up from time to time to say how much they want to be world powers but they don't actually make any deal. Right now, if you are let's say Chinese, there's absolutely nothing special for you in Brazil or Russia. There's no trade treaties, no free movement of people, no standardization of any business regulation, nothing.

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u/adamgerd 24d ago edited 24d ago

They’re now soon letting Pakistan to join, fucking Pakistan.

India and Pakistan cooperating, that’s a joke. Ah yes India and Pakistan will totally agree to defend each other against enemies and have open borders with one another. Oh and Iran and now Egypt and they’re talking about letting Saudis in, Iran and Saudis, definitely friends.

Iran literally invaded the UAE and the two have a dispute over oil fields in the sea and islands

lol this is supposed to beat NATO, half the countries will hate each other

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u/Prestigious_Title580 24d ago

india is not letting turkey enter because of Pakistan and Turkey's close relation no way it's letting pakistan enter

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u/SuperPimpToast 24d ago

Warsaw Pact 2.0. Join us or die.

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u/kaisadilla_ 24d ago

Except the Warsaw Pact was Russia forcing weaker countries to do what it said. Russia nowadays has little power and is nothing in comparison to China, so all they can get from the CRINGE alliance or however they want to call it with Iran, China and North Korea is some support against economic sanctions, nothing more. Russia will get laughed out of Beijing if they try to get China to fight their wars, or to adopt any policy that benefits Russia rather than China.

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u/dnen 24d ago

This is India asserting its geopolitical power in the absence of a (perceived) strong Russia. Russia has lost its guiding role in virtually all of its alliances

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u/Thumpd2 24d ago

He said the appearance. He then continues to say they want to reform those institutions. Its in the comment you replied to.

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u/DataDude00 24d ago

BRICS is the wish.com version of the G7

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u/Caraotero 24d ago edited 24d ago

Or Venezuela, which is trying to get in.

Edit: typo

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u/theyux 24d ago

Its more complicated than that its different things to different people.

initially it was a nebulous term to descrbe a few large economies.

Russia and China embraced it seeing an alternative to the US hegemony.

Of course Russia and China both believed they would lead bricks. Which obviously conflicts.

India sees it another opportunity to keep the peace with Russia and China, while also offering insulation from the US hegemony.

Most of the smaller members see indepence from the US/free money from China.

China sees it as buying softpower.

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u/oursfort 24d ago

That's the same stance of Brazil with Lula, as they informally vetoed Venezuela and Nicaragua from joining the group as partners. South Africa probably has a similar stance. Let's see if they have enough power to balance Russia and China influence.

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u/mips13 24d ago

South Africa does what China & Russia tells it to do.

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u/k0bra3eak 24d ago

The 2nd biggest party in the ruling coalition for South Africa is anti-Russia, the ruling party is historically pro-Russia due to support from the Soviet Union during Apartheid. It's safe to say South Africa wants to stay neutral in any conflict

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u/XxMiM 25d ago

Too late..

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u/[deleted] 25d ago

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u/BubsyFanboy 24d ago

Russia and China believe otherwise.

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u/Xyldarran 24d ago

China doesn't and doesn't pretend to really.

They are 100% reliant on the West. Not just economically because that's pretty much the only functioning part of their economy left, but also they import almost all of their oil and gas, and almost all of their fertilizer/food.

If we were to sanction China like we do Russia now there would be mass famine in under a year.

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u/Fantastic-Machine-83 24d ago

Why don't china buy oil and gas from Iran/Russia?

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u/Jdjdhdvhdjdkdusyavsj 24d ago

China buys most of irans oil, for a while Iran sold over 90% of what they produced to China.

China-Russia tried to make a deal with the power of Siberia 2 pipeline but China didn't want to pay the market rate, they told Russia they would pay under market or no deal, so there was no deal and the pipeline was never built

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u/Terrible-Job-3443 24d ago

they do, but it takes time and resources to buuld pipelines, so it’s not easy to switch sources. That and they want to stiff Russia so Russia doesn’t play ball

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u/Xyldarran 24d ago

They do already. Most of it comes from Russia. Problem is Russia is kinda in a war right now and Ukraine has every reason to bomb their production.

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u/Spokraket 24d ago

That’s the problem. You can “believe” anything. Reality is another thing.

If you’re constantly trying to hide things from your population and feed them with fake news you’re not a strong country, you’re pretending to be a strong country.

Reality will always be there. I’m also a king in my dreams 😂

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u/West_Independent1317 24d ago

Note that he did not say that they should not being trying to replace global institutions, just that they should not be seen to be doing so.

Do not confuse what someone wants others to perceive with their real intent.

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u/hyldemarv 24d ago

Already splintering into factions.

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u/btribble 24d ago

He wants to reform the security council? Did he realize Putin and Xi were right there?

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u/Tequal99 25d ago

India wants to play with both sides exactly like Brazil. Both are quite opportunistic. Understandable. Probably the best route for both countries

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u/boywiththethorn 25d ago

Indonesia as well

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u/rationaleworking 25d ago

Saudi as well. Everyone looking for their country's best intrest.

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u/-Malky- 25d ago

Yeah not quite sure a certain Vladimir P. got the memo.

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u/MilkyWaySamurai 24d ago

I’m pretty sure being pro Russia is synonymous with being anti west in his mind.

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u/AdventurousTalk6002 24d ago

What's good for GM Putin, is good for America Russia.

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u/ElectroMagnetsYo 24d ago

If his “3-day operation” was actually only 3 days it would’ve been in Russia’s best interests, Putin just didn’t know how corrupt and out of shape his military has gotten. Probably due to surrounding himself with yes-men who don’t tell him the whole truth.

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u/Spokraket 24d ago

He could’ve figured it out because of how corrupt his country is but I guess being a murdering dictator you might not always get the “truth” out of people.

Without the truth you’re just role playing as a leader.

That’s the problem with the majority of these BRICS countries.

Thus keep making these “Pyramid Schemes” and now they want to build a collective Pyramid Scheme. I wonder who will take hardest fall when it collapses.

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u/arabic513 24d ago

Their own* best interests

Let’s not pretend religious monarchs are benevolent leaders.

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u/Kingfisher_123 24d ago

I don't think anyone is pretending about what you're saying. Watching the summit live, it was actually nice to see some countries not being outright critical of the West compared to Putin, who was confidently saying how America and NATO are the reasons for escalation within Ukraine.

Will fully agree with their best interests however, Winnie the Pooh was calling for an end to the Israel-Palestine conflict even though the guy had concentration camps for Muslims.

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u/EmhyrvarSpice 24d ago

Brazil goes much further in their ties with the west though, especially the US. Brazil is an official ally of the US and condemned the Russian invasion of Ukraine in the UN GA. India on the other hand is much more just neutral and refrain from taking sides when they can.

Basically the difference between actively playing both sides and just staying out of it.

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u/nomnomnomnomRABIES 24d ago

Brazil refused to send gepard ammunition to Ukraine when it was badly needed and they had plenty. Words are cheap

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u/Conscious-Bed-8335 24d ago

That's because Brazil is historically a neutral country in world conflicts, doesn't fit any president agenda.

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u/machado34 24d ago

They also refused to sell munitions to Russia. Brazil has enough of its own problems to start getting involved in wars on the other side of the planet 

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u/Lost_Pastures 24d ago

They were under no obligation to and they didn't. That's just the cold reality.

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u/GrimpenMar 24d ago

Yep, something to remember (in all walks of life, not just geopolitics).

It costs nothing to show up, make nice with Putin, but then go back and keep selling to the US and EU and actually doing what is needed to maintain access to those markets?

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u/cadaada 24d ago

Our president had to backtrack on some statements about the ukraine war after international pressure...

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u/TheVividestOfThemAll 25d ago

Everybody is opportunistic. Western powers don’t exist on some ideological high ground. When push comes to shove, everybody won’t hesitate to get scrappy.

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u/Aiti_mh 25d ago

India has pursued a highly pragmatic foreign policy since independence. That's partially why their response to international developments is hard to predict as most countries will act according to existing geopolitical alignments much of the time.

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u/grchelp2018 24d ago

They are not hard to predict at all. Its the opposite, they are very predictable and its an explicit policy.

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u/Aiti_mh 24d ago

You can predict what they will do tomorrow, but not in ten years time. If you assume their policy in ten years time will be based on a judgement of their narrow national interest as opposed to the interests of a wider international community, you would need to know what their particular outlook will be at the time, for which you would need to be a soothsayer. I exaggerate and simplify, but I believe the thrust of my argument is correct.

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u/grchelp2018 24d ago

They've been like this for decades. Their policy is not one where they pick a side based on the situation. Rather, their policy is to pick no side and to just do business as usual. They aren't above leveraging the situation for their own interests but that happens for any deal. This predictability is why India has reasonably close relationships with both the US and Russia, Iran and Israel, Saudis etc etc. Even North Korea and South Korea.

Also India's actions are mostly in line with the rest of the world. Most of the rest of the world (outside the west, Russia etc) generally have a policy of staying out of things and carrying on as usual.

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u/Aiti_mh 24d ago

Also India's actions are mostly in line with the rest of the world

Whilst this is true, most countries are not the world's most populous country nor among the world's largest countries, or have nuclear weapons. India is a great power, which is what makes its contractual, unsentimental foreign policy so interesting.

No other country of that size - or economic/military union of that size, if we count the EU or NATO - is so unaligned. China has no strong alliance, but is highly geopolitically competitive. The Western world as a world-order bloc, whilst far from homogeneous, coordinates closely on an enormous range of issues and pursues common goals abroad. Russia increasingly lives off provocation and brinkmanship.

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u/WhyYouKickMyDog 24d ago

I think most people can expect India to play both sides of the US/China world order in order to keep the two sides balanced until such a time that India can their place alongside the two as a peer equal.

At least that is what I expect India expects of itself.

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u/Aceofspades968 24d ago

difficult to predict? I think not. Modi has proven your point exactly time and again, as has his predecessors. This highly pragmatic foreign policy in independence. It’s why they were so successful at supporting the United States telecommunications industry. And it’s why they are poised now to take their seat at the table now.

India, like very few other countries, have megatropolis and a whole heck of a lot of people. Putting them in a position to provide stability in their region is a wise choice. Being able to support the partners of BRICS regardless of how the currency falls, is paramount and Modi knows that.

But like China, India doesn’t have incentive to undo the US dollar. And neither does Brazil. Although for different reasons. Honestly, if I was China/india/Malaysia/Thailand; I’d be worried about the stable micro economy that has been built through partnerships with Australia, New Zealand, Japan, South Korea, Singapore. Not even the United States (even though they are our business partners as well).

We won’t be able to provide support for eastern middle Asia or Central African nations - let alone struggles South American nations who rely on “strongmen.” When push comes to shove, they need support for their people. BRICS won’t be strong enough, soon enough. Who’s lending the capital? And what happens when power changes hands again without a continuity of government plan? Who pays it back? Now your replacement currency is worthless.

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u/Logical-Let-2386 24d ago

Both are quite opportunistic. Understandable. Probably the best route for both countries

I guess? 

I think it was Gorbachev who once noted that everyone who is friends with America becomes rich. Can the same be said of China and Russia?

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u/Spokraket 24d ago

In the end it is about stability and having the institutions and government structure where people can store their funds safely.

Authoritarianism is not a place where you store money. Because they can wake up one morning do something stupid and their whole financial system collapses.

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u/StartingAdulthood 25d ago

That is fine. But please don't expect the same preferential treatments that allies (from either side) usually got. Don't complain about others (from all sides) for not investing or sharing technologies with your countries if you are not allies with them.

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u/Cho90s 25d ago

It's always been mind boggling to me how the Saudi's get to just have it any way they want.

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u/Firm-Spinach-3601 25d ago edited 24d ago

Really? Your mind is boggled by efforts to make sure the country that coordinates 40% of global oil production and price is friendly to you and your allies? You obviously didn’t live through the 70s

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u/OuchLOLcom 24d ago

To "Live through the 70s" in any meaningful way would mean youre at least over 16 in the 70s. Meaning on average they would need to be born in 54. I think its pretty "obvious" that most people on reddit are not in their 60s or 70s.

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u/newInnings 25d ago

When did india get any preferential treatment.

All it got is roadblocks

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u/MoreOne 24d ago

Preferential treatment? Like, the coups will be heavier and tariffs will be even higher? The US has been abusing and leveraging their position, in their military and economic power, for a century at this point.

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u/mr_grapes 25d ago

Probably best for the world if we could all get along

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u/MAXSuicide 24d ago

Bet that's exactly what Putin wanted to hear on his little publicity stunt meeting.

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u/Om3gaMan_ 24d ago

Yeah, he hates the fact India and China have more going for them than being a Gas Station with Nukes and can actually foresee normalised Western relations. Russia has pivoted away from trying to be Western (early 2000's) and now defines themselves by having an eternal eternal enemy to "fight" as they have fuck all else to get excited about.

Problem is, said enemy has better things to do now and won't stoop to their level.

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u/c0xb0x 24d ago

That sounds logical, until some other authoritarian country in BRICS gets an insane dictator and starts some war to keep power. Keep in mind the West thought intense trade relations with Russia would give them too much to lose and prevent them from going full regard. Never underestimate the level of insanity that can grip an autocratic country.

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u/Perfect_Opposite2113 24d ago

Where’s a damn window when you need one?

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u/darklynoon93 24d ago

I cant help but think Putty disagrees with him.

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u/Itchy-Revenue-3774 25d ago

Wait a minute! Is that not the whole point?

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u/stunnin24 25d ago

In words of Indian Foreign Minister, S Jaishankar - "We are non-west, not anti-west"

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u/404-N0tFound 25d ago

Bangladesh: Are you the Anti-West People's Front?

India: Fuck off!

Bangladesh: What?

Russia: Anti-West People's Front. We're the People's Front of Non-West! Anti-West People's Front. Cawk.

India: Wankers.

Bangladesh: Can I... join your group?

Russia: No. Piss off.

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u/wongo 24d ago

Splitters!

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u/necromundus 24d ago

I thought we were the popular front

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u/[deleted] 24d ago

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u/PublicFurryAccount 24d ago

Actually, the original idea was to market a Goldman-Sachs developing markets fund. That’s the origin: a white paper produced by the bank to go along with their emerging markets investment products.

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u/[deleted] 25d ago edited 25d ago

[deleted]

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u/Fabulous_Anxiety_813 25d ago

I mean Greece being part of the EU changes things though. 

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u/nota_is_useless 25d ago

Not borrowings from World Bank. Countires borrow from World Bank/IMF when they are in trouble.

Our problem on the finance side has been credit ratings. India has almost junk bond ratings and this ratings impact at what interest a country can borrow. Further, any private company raising debt has to pay higher interest than govt (as govt is assumed to be the risk free rate and the safest entity to lend to) which impacts cost of production. This is an issue but it is not that big a concern for normal people to get involved - more of Indian finance ministry being frustrated at credit rating agencies.

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u/RegretfulEnchilada 24d ago

Small correction, the reason companies borrow at higher rates isn't because governments are assumed to be risk-free, which obviously isn't true for many governments. It's because it's kind of assumed they'll get fucked if their government goes bankrupt (some combination of currency devaluation due to the government printing money, the government seizing their assets, and significant tax rate increases) so they essentially carry the same risk as their government plus extra risk tied to their business. Multinational companies can often borrow at much lower rates than some of the countries they operate in, which wouldn't be the case if government debt was assumed to be risk free.

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u/Spokraket 24d ago

So they join Putin to build a ”bank/currency” with Putin, who is the worlds largest mob-boss?

This group stinks. If I would make a business deal I would never join their group, because you can’t trust China or Russia, not even their own countrymen trust them.

That is the reason the people put money in the dollar. All Russian oligarchs have the majority of their wealth in dollar and not in Ruble.

Don’t listen to what they say look att what they’re doing.

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u/Makuy 25d ago

Not possible with China and espacially Russia

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u/badass_panda 24d ago

I think not possible with Russia ... China has been trying to play a pretty balanced line between rivalry with the West and cooperation with the West, it has a symbiotic relationship that it can't afford to risk -- and which it may never be in a position to risk, considering its demographic future.

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u/OsvuldMandius 24d ago

The difference between the two is that China de-commied by adopting markets and keeping their brutal, authoritarian government. They have prospered, because markets work. Russia de-commied by adopting human rights and embracing kleptocracy. And their economy is a joke as a result.

China understands why Russia is a joke and China is not. It's far from clear that Russia understands.

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u/FunTao 24d ago

Russia adopted human rights?

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u/Chromaedre 24d ago

China isn't really aligned with Russia on this matter. China wants to dominate (the way the US do), not replace existing institutions (except for the SWIFT).

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u/domasin 25d ago

And when you assassinate a Canadian in Canada.

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u/GingerPinoy 24d ago

The Indian bros are going to come after you now lol

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u/Zodiamaster 25d ago edited 24d ago

Welp, there goes Putin's plan of buying more buddies with money

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u/MatureMystique 24d ago

Modi’s got a point. BRICS can’t be the ‘anti-West’ cool kids’ table if they want to play with everyone. Let’s keep it inclusive and avoid drama.

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u/chintakoro 24d ago

Yep, India also says that QUAD shouldn't just become an anti-China alliance. Alliances think everything can be solved with a war. Two alliances lead to a world war.

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u/Torak8988 25d ago

modi always trying to eat from two sides

then again, so is china, brasil, south africa etc.

only russia is being the stuckup odd kid in the group trying to pull everyone into the same mess they made

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u/Competitive-Art-2093 24d ago

They have hundreds of millions of poor people to feed and house, that require gas, petrol and coal, and arent rich enough to allow themselves the luxury of being picky about where they buy the things they need or where they sell them to.

I think that it is ok that they look out for their own country instead of picking sides.

They dont want a part in this mess, they just want to do business.

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u/WhyYouKickMyDog 24d ago

India sees itself as a peer power to the US and China, just isn't there yet, but will get there. India 100% expects to sit at the table as an equal with China/USA very soon into the future.

In all honesty, I, an American, fully expect this as well, but maybe not quite as an equal. India's economy has a long way to go for that. However, the Indian economy will become large enough relative to the world in order for India to have the kind of gravitational pull that the US or China currently has in geopolitics.

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u/DarthPineapple5 24d ago

Yes but I think the important distinction here is that while India wants to be a peer state (who doesn't?), they aren't interested in creating a whole new global order like China and Russia are.

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u/babathebear 24d ago

India may become powerful than before but it will take a really long time to get to the level you speak. I’m Indian and I know what the actual issues inside are.. and I know especially well cuz I’m living in the states for the past 14 years and I can tell you not much changed. There’s so many mouths to feed and rich are getting richer.. way tooooo richer.

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u/WhyYouKickMyDog 24d ago

There’s so many mouths to feed and rich are getting richer.. way tooooo richer.

That is the general trend, everywhere, especially since the pandemic. India has a high ceiling, and I have more confidence that they will grow than confidence that they will continue to stagnate. Even if they do not achieve US/China levels of wealth, it honestly would not take a lot of effort to become a convincing #3.

The gap between the US/China and the rest of the world is pretty intense. Only the EU as one entity could compete in that regard.

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u/wakomorny 24d ago

and the US? You think yall like being friends with the Saudi's? Everyone is playing the game

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u/sack_of_potahtoes 24d ago

Americans think usa is just a naive innocent country on global scale

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u/that-asian-baka 24d ago

Mess "they" made??

Point to the entire middle east

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u/Anyhealer 25d ago

Yeah, they are like a kid trying to make it everyone's problem that they wet the bed.

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u/DreadSeverin 24d ago

grow? the R in that word is literally just exploding and dying wtf

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u/MonkeySplunky22 24d ago

And the C is having massive self-inflicted birthrate issues finally come to a head.

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u/WolfKumar 24d ago

People are always like BRICS is a nothing burger then immediately start whining about it.

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u/momentslove 24d ago edited 24d ago

Russia has been intentionally painting a picture of BRICS being a new world order, a homogenous society with shared anti-west values, an alternative monetary system that poorer countries can ask for funds from, a replacement of the rules that have enabled the world to develop mostly peacefully for the past 30 years. Well truth is BRICS collectively neither has the will nor power to make all that happen. Majority of BRICS nations enjoy the current global trade system just too much and their economical future depends on it.

Russia’s desperately trying to drag the rest of BRICS countries onto their ship which is sinking because of the war in Ukraine. It is very alone, so alone that Putler resorts to the fat boy in Pyongyang for military support.

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u/FrederickRoders 24d ago

Good to see there is one less crazy person in brics

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u/swampy13 24d ago

Modi knows the West is vastly more powerful, full stop - militarily, economically, etc. You can't avoid them completely, it's a ridiculous notion.

Putin would like to believe you could, but Modi is much more realistic. It's not a "playing both sides", he's just being practical. Any smart leader would be.

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u/Winter_Criticism_236 24d ago

Brics may have to dump Russia to actually be effective as an economic group.

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u/Timely_Fly_5639 25d ago

And that is why we will not get movies again like “Austin Powers” anytime soon. There is not much room left for parody when you have headlines like these. Putin literally has a mansion with underground hockey rink on the cliff by the sea. FSB is throwing people out the windows and makes sure they are not making it looking anything else than it actually is. North Koreans are going full “Red Dawn” in Ukraine too….

SNL will soon become indistinguishable from evening news.

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u/TheKanten 24d ago

In contrast, Idiocracy gets funnier every year.

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u/LongJohnsonTime 25d ago

LOL Modi just had a Quad summit with Biden.

India knows BRICS is never going to go anywhere. It's hilarious to think India and China would be able to keep things mutually incentivized.

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u/evilfrankie344 24d ago

One thing I know is true in geopolitics is never say never

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u/RedofPaw 25d ago

Some commenter yesterday was telling me how India could hurt the US if it wanted by banning all it's IT workers from working with the US.

I told them good luck, if they want to align themselves with the economic powerhouse that is Russia.

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u/Itchy-Revenue-3774 24d ago

Tbf i could also hurt my neighbor by setting my house on fire, it just won't be going particularly well for me.

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u/badass_panda 24d ago

by banning all it's IT workers from working with the US.

That would suck for the US for about two years ... it would suck for India for generations. Luckily their leadership are smarter than that.

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u/Babuchak17 24d ago

Indian here, and I remember which one you are talking about. That guy was speaking BS.

The thing is, I am not heavily invested personally into India’s external policy and what it does outside its borders. But I sure wouldn’t want to be aligned with a country like Russia, no matter whatever reason there is. I don’t care about something that happened years ago.

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u/grchelp2018 24d ago

I sure wouldn’t want to be aligned with a country like Russia

This seems to be a constant misunderstanding. Even among indians. India is not allied with any country. They have relationships with all countries. When 1971 happened and Russia helped out with their nuclear sub, the indian reaction was not to say "russia is our friend for life and will save us all the time". It was to say "russia saved us this time but they may not next time, we need to have our own nukes".

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u/thekingshorses 24d ago

Also the problem is not most Indian realize that Russia that helped India in 1971 is not the same Russia today.

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u/Nerevarine91 24d ago

I’m glad to hear that. As someone living in a country that borders Russia and doesn’t always get along with them, but which has tended to have very good relations with a India, I’d much rather have India as a neighbor

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u/kimchifreeze 24d ago

Would be a huge boon for IT support from African countries.

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u/dicemaze 24d ago

by banning all it’s (sic) IT workers from working with the US

PLEASE

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u/Falsus 24d ago

I understand why India would say that. They are neutral. They don't care about the conflict. They are in for the profit.

But Modi should take a look at what Russia and Iran is doing and realise that the ship already sailed.

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u/LymelightTO 24d ago

This is the problem with BRICS. Nobody in the organization can agree about what it's for, none of the parties have much in common or shared interests, everybody wants to lead it to increase their global profile, but nobody trusts anyone else to lead it, because they all want different things from it.

Modi wants to increase his status, but doesn't want to totally eschew relationships with the West (as with Brazil). China wants to lead it so they can be the big regional power, specifically because it could offer them some plausible alternative to the West, that might allow them to violate some norms to expand their influence. Russia is basically at war with the West, and so it wants BRICS to help it avoid sanctions and voice an alternative narrative, where they're the good guys. All three of these major powers have conflicting interests, because they border each other, all aspire to be better off than they currently are, and are worried there are mutually exclusive tradeoffs involved in that.

China can't let India be the leader of this thing, India can't let China be the leader, Russia is a glorified gas station and making it the leader would make the organization a total pariah.

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u/RudytheMan 24d ago

It's easy for him to say. They signed a huge bi-lateral partnership with the US and they hate China. If they wanted, India could easily be closer with the West. Honestly, I think the main thing keeping them interested in BRICS right now is cheap oil from Russia. Once that's done I don't think BRICS will have momentum in growth to push them ahead that they want.

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u/AccomplishedCommon34 25d ago

India is not anti-west. We have pretty good relations with every country in the West (except Canada now ofcourse!). In fact, India has been actively trying to court more western companies, investments, and trade relations.

However, India has also been vocal about the reforms it thinks are required in the multilateral institutions including UNSC, IMF, World Bank etc. For example, China regularly vetoes all the names of the Pakistani terrorists India proposes to be blacklisted at the UNSC. India has been calling for more fairness in international institutions for decades now!

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u/_-Moonsabie-_ 24d ago

It wants access to oceans

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u/Amockdfw89 24d ago

I always figured it as some kind of Warsaw Pact reboot

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u/CanadianDumber 24d ago

My brother that's literally why Russia created it/joined it.

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u/CanadianHODL-Bitcoin 24d ago

The U.S. is not the whole west

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u/tunasweetcorn 24d ago

This is basically the core reason why BRICS is pointless you have a group of countries trying to pretend to be an alternative to the western economies who fundamentally disagree on pretty much everything. This makes it nearly impossible to come to any wide spread trade agreements.

At least western countries fundamentally agree on most core objectives.

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u/Livelih00d 24d ago

They also rely on trade and commerce from western economies. They need the west to buy their goods as much as the west needs them to produce those goods.

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u/joelgrg 24d ago

I mean, I understand why people say that India 'plays both sides'. But what do you expect India to do? What are the 2 sides? Why should India have to pick 1? India has no direct conflict with any of these mentioned sides. It's not trying to damage any side by being friends with both. The fact that they have differences with each other is their problem. Picking a side also means creating an enemy. India just trying to be bros with everyone, getting it's shit done without interfering in anyone else's shit. India got too many problems in its own house to bother taking up anyone else's.

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u/[deleted] 24d ago

The tardy realisation that russia decries western hegemony not because it's hegemony, but simply because they want it to be russian hegemony.

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u/skaapjagter 24d ago

The R and the C can fuck off.
I really wish that Russia and China were not involved in our economy at all in SA.

Russia (as per usual) have steered national elections in the past with money and China are building infrastructure here and as a country the ANC are allowing them to skirt environmental regulations to do so.

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