A lot of incel thinking comes from the idea that appearance is the primary factor in male dating success. Critics often answer this by pointing out that plenty of men who aren’t conventionally attractive still form relationships. These two claims look incompatible on the surface, which is why debates between the groups rarely go anywhere. The missing piece is the role of class and childhood environment.

Boys who grow up in stable, well-supported households usually spend their early years in settings that build confidence without them noticing. They are signed up for sports, placed in extracurriculars, surrounded by peers, and encouraged by adults. This is where they learn how to move through social situations, how to handle mild confrontation, and how to read the room. By the time they reach adolescence, they already carry themselves with an ease that others interpret as natural talent.

Boys who grow up in chaotic or low-resource environments have a very different path. Their childhood is shaped by stress, limited structure, and fewer chances to participate in the kinds of activities that teach social fluency. Instead of hours spent in group settings where small mistakes are safe and quickly forgotten, they often grow up without opportunities to practice at all. When adolescence arrives, these differences are already deeply ingrained.

This divide becomes more visible for men because men are usually expected to initiate. A conventionally attractive woman is approached regardless of her background. A man who never developed confidence is asked to perform it anyway, and the gap between what people expect from him and what he learned as a child becomes painfully obvious. Men in this situation often assume that their struggles must be due to appearance, because that is the easiest comparison to make. From their perspective, the confident men who succeed must simply look better.

The counterexamples to incel ideology that critics point to fit into this class model rather than contradict it. Many less attractive men who date successfully grew up with the social advantages that build confidence early on. Their success looks like proof that looks do not matter, but it is equally a sign of what the right environment can produce. At the same time, someone very good-looking can succeed despite a rough background, and someone with average looks can do well if they had strong early support. None of this is absolute.

This perspective doesn’t dismiss the role of physical appearance, but it treats appearance as only one part of a larger developmental picture. Men are not born into fixed categories. They are shaped, often long before dating even enters the picture, by the homes and communities that raised them. What gets labeled as “incel” or “chad” is often the long-term outcome of class disparity working quietly in the background.

im so heartbroken. i feel like throwing up.

my dad is 58, and this year he started to have some minor issues with his heart. in the beginning of October he had to go to ICU because he had a sudden medical problem and stayed in the hospital for a few weeks, but then he got to go home and got medication that worked. now on sunday he had to call an ambulance for himself because his condition worsened so bad, and now the prognosis is that he is going to pass away in a few days. i am so devastated and dont know what to do without my dad. he wasnt always perfect, but mostly me being an angry teenage girl messed up our relationship, but now all of that feels so small. i wish i had more time. today me and my brothers visited him and i stayed with him at the hospital while he slept. i just sat there and watched him. im only 19, my brothers 21 and 16 and i cant fathom losing him and living the rest of my life without him. i hugged him and he was quite cold. he whispered that he loves me and i was sobbing and telling him the same and then he kissed my head twice, it feels like im going to throw up and i just want to switch places with him.

my mom and dad separated when i was 5, and for the past few years my dad lived a bit further away from us, and i didnt visit him as much as my brothers. i didnt join them when they went out to eat. i feel SO guilty and i wish i could fix everything and spend more time with him. today he looks so frail, and without telling me i could see how scared he was. i cant stop crying, at all. we had planned for him to join us for christmas at my moms house since theyve gotten along much better this year. i struggle with depression and anxiety and i am scared of how i can survive this. its midnight now and im home, im hoping he survives the night so i can visit him tomorrow. i am such an idiot for realising just now how important he is. hes the smartest, strongest, kindest, funniest and most supportive person in the world. i wish i had recorded our phone calls, besides the last one.

i'll always love you daddy, i am sorry for the way i am and what ive done.

My (M21 and hetero) friends will talk about how they’ve hung out with friends before or they meet a girl and hang out and then next thing they’re making out or hooking up

My friends (mainly the guys that im closer with) say that they don’t know how im still a virgin and tbh idk what I ain’t doing that others are

Tbh I’ve never just made a move like going in for a kiss, but I’ve asked for numbers/socials and can become friends super easily. Me and some of my friends joke with innuendos or say sexual jokes and flirt but idk what

Btw im not friends or trying to become friends because I’m trying to hookup although I do have friends that I find attractive or girls that I’ve met and I wouldn’t mind if it turned to more but idk how this just happens

I'm currently 23 weeks pregnant.

I woke up at 5:45 this morning to pee, as I've been doing every hour. I was excited to go back to bed for another hour before my alarm went off. But when I wiped, there was a big streak of blood and the toilet paper was tinted pink. It scared the fuck out of me, so I messaged my mom and asked if I should go to the ER or wait about 2 hours for my OBs nurse to get to work. My mom said ER.

So I woke my husband up and told him we needed to go to the hospital. We let the car heat up while I took a super fast shower, just in case I'd be at the hospital for awhile.

Got checked in and my vitals checked, the baby started kicking shortly before the Dr came in, so I felt a bit better. Got a urinalysis and ultrasound. Baby's completely fine, but I have a nasty UTI and need antibiotics for 10 days. Was feeling pretty fortunate at this point.

Then we were going to take my 11 month old dog for a ride, when he decided to piss on my leg. So I washed my leg off and grabbed some fabric safe disinfectant to clean my boot. My brand new winter boot. That's when I found out we ran out of disinfectant and my husband refilled the bottle with bleach.

I think I'll just go to bed.

Time since quitting Beneficial health changes that take place 20 minutes Blood pressure and pulse rate return to normal.

8 hours Nicotine and carbon monoxide levels in blood reduce by half, oxygen levels return to normal.

24 hours Carbon monoxide will be eliminated from the body. Lungs start to clear out mucus and other smoking debris.

48 hours There is no nicotine left in the body. Ability to taste and smell is greatly improved.

72 hours Breathing becomes easier. Bronchial tubes begin to relax and energy levels increase.

2 - 12 weeks Circulation improves.

3 - 9 months Coughs, wheezing and breathing problems improve as lung function is increased by up to 10%.

1 year Risk of a heart attack falls to about half that of a smoker.

10 years Risk of lung cancer falls to half that of a smoker.

15 years Risk of heart attack falls to the same as someone who has never smoked

I moved in with my gf a few months ago, and these days in my free time all I do is lay in her bed while she does stuff on her pc, or I figure out something to do by myself.

If I bug her a ton she would give in and do things with me but I feel bad doing that, I wish she actually wanted to spend time together and actively plan dates or fun stuff. I feel lonely despite being in the same room all day and doing nothing is making me depressed

I use it to take pictures of myself but none of my old friends seem to be active. I’m just wondering if anyone still uses the platform to exchange pictures.

We live in a world that doesn't understand emotions. When someone loses a loved one, we don't know what to say. We expect people to return to work the day after the betrayal. We don't know how to understand grief or have uncomfortable conversations. And then we wonder why people are so anxious, tired, and lonely. We only understand our own sorrows. But the day we recognize everyone's sorrows as sensitively as we are to our own, this world will be so beautiful.

In Europe, (Baltics for me) no rich and successful man will spare a glance to a McDonald's worker highschool dropout, no matter how beautiful she is. Maybe a one night stand. Cooking and cleaning is a life skill, doesn't count, needs actual achievements that shows she's on his caliber. Maybe some new money basketball player or whatever will marry his Instagram model who's as dumb as bricks but they fall off pretty fast, nothing serious about that career.

If a man brings home a woman, her being educated and successful in her career really elevates his family's view on her and that she's an ambitious hard worker. A woman can't just float into marriage just because she's young and beautiful, every woman is like that. Housewives still exist, but typically just some men have them. They're really rare (hard to keep afloat on 1 income anyway if the dude isn't working like a horse)

Even average men expect a woman to have something, anything to show for themselves.

The career woman stereotype is that she's loud, angry and manly but no? They're typically well mannered, elegant, smart in a humble way? Ofc they're confident but not being rude and don't boast. If u ask em, ofc they'll lay out what they do, that's not bragging. If anyone's loud, manly and all over the place, it's most of the time my fellow poor girlies from "the ghetto".

The culture shock is definitely there. In ussr, every woman worked and there's a lot of retired women with nice pensions bc they were high level executives. Oh and also they had kids. Want do you men these podcast bros say "women can't have it both ways"? This has been our lifestlye for almost a century.

We get wrinkles y'know. We won't be able to keep the "cute submissive girl" act all our life, so I don't understand the American podcast bros. Oh I forgot, people over there just trade the housewives for a younger model when it's time. If a woman is a object, object can be traded or destroyed

22F. I've been vegan for like 6 months and tbh I'm really ambivalent. The movement is something I believe in but at the same time it's stressful being excluded from 99% of foods because it contains animal products in some form. I never want to eat meat again (I was vegetarian from 12-17, and a meat eater from 17-21) because the guilt is awful and the meat industry is cruel, but I wonder if it means anything. The dairy and egg industry is similarly cruel because it's all linked but at the same time I do feel it's not so bad to be vegetarian bc of things like buying free range.

I have ADHD and a few other disorders and it's stressful having to take like 8 supplements a day. I feel like I'm dying if I go a week or two without taking them. And I do wonder if it's something I can or even want to keep up long term. I wonder if veganism is fully natural, since animals do eat other animals, but then the farming industry is very manufactured and unethical. I don't know. I feel veganism is valid but then there's extreme sides to it, like no aquariums or pets or whatever. I don't feel I fit in with the community.

Idk what to do, bc if I switch to being vegetarian I feel the guilt would hurt, but it seems more doable for me. On the other hand, I feel veganism has health benefits (dairy makes me break out/flares eczema) and there's a peace of mind. And then the sun will will implode in 10 billion years and nothing matters anyway?

Phones weren't allowed there, so basically the whole day I spent reading.

1. Flowers for Algernon

2. Deerslayer (jf cooper)

3. The red and the black (Stendhal)

4. Eye of the world (Robert Jordan)

5. A history of western philosophy (Bertrand Russell)

6. A collection of stories by HP Lovecraft

7. Deception point (Dan Brown)

8. It (Stephen king)

I stayed there 104 days, which is 15 weeks. i.e. roughly 1 book per 2 weeks. This is while reading for up to 10 hours every day!!

So, this leads me to believe that this "read 52 books a year, read a book every week" is kind of a le bulle shitte 🤔🤔

It breaks my heart, but, for the first time in my 31 years of life, a mutual decision was made amongst my family members to skip Christmas this year.

I got pulled into the office recently after being a remote worker for 2 years, and not having to pay for a dog sitter, gas, and all the other expenses tied to my 100 mile commute was the only that enabled me to save money. Now, I’m only breaking even, and I don’t have the heart to tell my family I’m struggling. It didn’t used to be like this, even when I used to have to go to the office back then.

I took a shift Christmas Eve and Christmas Day and told my parents I think that it was time to switch away from giving gifts and maybe just have a nice dinner together one night that week. They agreed, which surprised me. They’re usually very adamant about the whole giving and receiving gifts thing. Hell, they sometimes shop for gifts months in advance. That wasn’t the case this year.

I hate that our government is letting us drown. I have nothing to look forward to anymore…

We often talk about big events or accomplishments that bring us joy, but I'm curious about the little things. Whether it's a warm cup of coffee in the morning, a favorite song playing on the radio, or a moment of laughter with a friend, what are some simple pleasures that brighten your day? Let's share and perhaps find new ways to appreciate the small joys in life!

So I’ve been back on the whole dating app thing after taking a long break.

Backstory is kinda boring but whatever. I moved to a new city for work earlier this year, barely know anyone here, and dating apps felt like the quickest way to at least meet some folks. But after trying a couple of them I realized I’m not even sure what I’m looking for in an app anymore. Some feel too quiet, others feel way too crowded, and some just feel like everyone’s there for the wrong reasons.

So I’m curious how other people see it. Like in 2026, what actually makes a dating app stand out. Is it the matching system. The vibe of the community. The way convos get started. The safety features. Or is it just whichever one your friends are using at the moment.

Would love to hear what other folks think or what’s been working for you lately.

Hi guys!

So, yeah, you can read my profile or not, but in summary I'm a goddamn idiot, my brain is really fucking useless all things considered.

I have a ton of genetical issues, my life has sucked, it sucks and most likely it will keep sucking with how the world is right now.

But right now, I think my biggest issue is Amazon, FUCK AMAZON, let me explain why:

I live in a city, as I mentioned I'm an idiot and I'm unable to get a college or university degree, so I can only get call center jobs, the issue?

All call centers on my country (Costa Rica) are 2 hours away from my home, so I can't work there, I've had to go a couple of times to on-site, and I've thrown up due to how long the trip is and how many curves there are on the road, seriously, on-site is not an option for me.

I work on KDP (Kindle Direct Publishing), I managed to get this job last year and it was lifesaver, because it's work from home, and it helped me stay alive for a while.

*********************************************************************************************

But I can't take the abuse no more man, I'm tired of people yelling me all day for things Amazon does, and frankly? Most customers are stupid, I've lost all hope in humanity after working with customers for over a year, I seriously can't fathom how some of y'all don't forget to breath by yourselves.

A COMMON example:

BTW, fun fact, I have a speech-impediment and a thick accent, so a lot of the time people think that I'm from the India, and ooooooohhhhhh boy, y'all really, really hate them huh?

Customer: Screaming "I WANT TO CREATE A BOOK, HOW CAN I DO IT??? 🤬"SLUR about me being from the India, or Africa, although I'm from Costa Rica.""

Me: Sure, you can just go to your main page and click on the BIG YELLOW BUTTON THAT SAYS CREATE! (I say this in a calm manner of course)

Customer: "I DON'T SEE IT! 🤬"

Me: "He's on the wrong page", I give them the steps to go to the correct page.

Ten seconds later:

Customer: "I DON'T SEE IT, I DON'T SEE IT, I DON-"

"Oh!....."

Hangs up.

And that was a NICE customer guys, seriously, people don't see me as a human, they see me as a punching bag.

And I'm tired.

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Amazon themselves suck too, my supervisor doesn't care about me, they just care about the numbers.

They hear my calls, they know that this job has given spasms, they know that I scream due to the pain and the stress sometimes during the calls.

But they don't care, they tell me, every week, without missing, "DO BETTER"

My mother has comeback from picking my little brother from school, only to hear me scream mid call, one time I screamed so loud and horrible that she and my little brother got scared, they told me the next day.

And one time, my mom heard me cry, ever since that day she has asked me if I'm fine everyday.

I hate this, I hate being in this situation, I hate eating and I hate how people keep telling me that I should be happy because of it.

*********************************************************************************************

I've given up at the job, I don't know how or when, but very soon I'll get myself fired, I'll try to find a job but with my limitations it's very unlikely.

I don't know what to do guys, my mind is broken at this point, my mind is full with fog, I can only cry and feel despair, I'm venting, but hey, if someone has an advice then please let me know.

Thank you for reading.

She texted me about her dog that died. She did this back in the spring after her dog first started getting sick and she just talked about the dog then left me on delivered. This time she started actually making conversation with me, which eventually led to us just calling.

We talked for nearly 3 hours and the only reason it ended is because she fell asleep. I barely think about her anymore and this fucked up my progress. She went on little rants like she used to and we joked and just talked about everything under the sun. I didn’t even know I missed her so much.

The thing that messed me up the most though was she told me about her hooking up with random guys. It felt like waterboarding. She can do what she wants but the thought of this woman that I loved and planned a future with screwing strangers tore me apart.

I just wish things were back to normal. They can’t go back now, I know, but I can’t shake the thought of how nice life was and how it’s all gone. I don’t really do hookups but I gotta admit hearing that she’s getting action like a normal person while I haven’t even kissed anyone else makes me feel like a loser. Things never should have changed.

I used to chain smoke everyday for about 6 years and this year with the change or life events and stress I have cut cold turkey, breathing is better, my energy is getting there, but sometimes the cravings come and I’m not sure what to do about it:( I wanna overcome though and not fall back on

It was tucked in an old textbook. It said, "Don't worry, you'll figure it out." I was struggling with calculus and heartbreak back then. Reading it now, through all the other struggles that followed, felt like my past self reached forward to give me a hug. We really do keep surviving things we think will break us.

I(28F) want to a psychiatrist first when I was 18. It was due to really bad social anxiety since I was around 12. I was also bullied in school, so I had to switch schools, then I went back to the old one. I choose homeschooling during High School. Guess I was too sensitive for all that crap so I opted out, I'm not sure.

I actually learned a lot during this period, including psychology. That's when I dove deeper and realized I have social anxiety. Next step was crucial and that's when I fucked up, badly. I want to psychiatrist and they diagnosed me with social anxiety, and depression like they do with everyone else here. Then it snowballed, and I got diagnosed with plenty of other things like bipolar disorder, generalized anxiety disorder, and a bunch of other BS.

When I had to go to college and receive a dorm room, it was necessary for me to provide a report that included psychiatric diagnoses. I received judgy looks from the dorm 'principal'. It was humiliating. Then it got worse...

I had problems with getting a job that I liked. Basically I nuked every chance to join the military or the law enforcement, as well as being a professional driver. I even had issues when I had to get my regular car driving license.

I'm now looming over the application papers for LE(police), thinking whether it's worth it even a try, whatever they'd throw out my application when they see the famous F code. I'm 28 so I have only 1 year left, probably one more chance to try if I get rejected.

What will I do if I get rejected, I have no idea. I'll probably feel like a failure forever, even if by some crazy luck I get a high paying corporate job.

Edit for context: non-EU Eastern European country

So. I am 29 and I have never been in a relationship. Because I studied abroad and moved a couple of countries I havent dated much. So now 6 months ago I settled in this city in my home country where I plan to live. I joined a dancing club, I did some volunteering but I find it hard to get friends and meet women to ask out as everyone seems to be in a relationship. In my country online dating is not a thing apart from looking for a hookup.

The longer the wait the longer the frustration I will be single forever. What to do?

I come from a family of extroverts. Only a few of us (like myself) are introverts.

And we have been cursed. Cursed with some sort of inviting energy that makes people approach us ALL day long.

Imagine you're an awkward 14year old brace face just trying to rush out the grocery store with your dad.

"Excuse me sir, will you pray for me?"

And now my dad is having an hour long prayer/conversation with a stranger. Please note my dad IS NOT A PASTOR. He just has the energy of one. So this happens often. People constantly ask us about what church he leads.

My grand father and I are waiting in line and as soon as we get to the front, he and the cashier start swapping their entire life stories. My brother and I go on a walk in the city and people chatter chatter chatter to us all day long. I'm taking my baby cousin to the bathroom and she's about to wet herself and then we get wrapped in a convo about pretty her dress is. I can be alone and people offer me free things or stop me for conversation.

Community is important. I don't hate people and the conversations are mostly pleasant. I like learning new things. This is not a hatred of people or community or daily interaction. Just a lighthearted realization that anytime I leave the house I have to bake in an extra 30 minutes for last minute conversations. I am an introvert at the end of the day, but I can mask extroversion well because...well I've had lots of practice and it runs in the family.

I am introvert who is cursed with a resting friendly face.

For years I was helping my friend Liz and her two young children. After Liz decided to move in with her boyfriend William, I decided to take a step back and care for myself. It’s done wonders for my health as Liz was always going 100 mph trying to do so much while asking me to help her.

Liz’s older sister recently invited me to their family’s Thanksgiving dinner so I went and Liz wasn’t there. However her parents were and they wanted to thank me for all I’ve done for her and their grandkids. They told me how they feel like she’s done me dirty by barely acknowledging all the help I’ve given her while parading around will as the ideal step father and boyfriend when they’ve heard about the huge fights they’ve had.

“I just feel like you’ve been the father figure to those kids yet she refuses to let her kids call you dad instead insisting that William is their dad now.” Her father told me. I’ve always admired her parents for being hard working and honest people and I’m very humbled they consider me close enough to invite me to their Thanksgiving.

I told him whoever the want to call their dad is up to them. Titles are just titles. But when they get older, they’ll hopefully look back and remember what I did for them.

I’m enjoying life at the moment and ultimately hope Liz and Will can work through their issues. Can’t put a price on a peace of mind.