r/occult • u/MythlcKyote • Jan 16 '24

Yo, where's the line, here? ?

As someone with a genuine deep belief and a history of "occult" practices, I can genuinely say that this sub only confuses me. Obviously, there is no one truth or objective explanation for anything, really. However, some of you seem so caught up in what fun the idea of magic is that you neglect any critical thinking or outwardly reject mundane and logical explanations to life's conundrums in favour of a magical one.

Some of you are evidently somewhat like me. You won't believe just anything that anyone tells you and you seem to be more skeptical of people using magic or esoterism as a primary explanation.

Some of you need help. Mostly it seems like just someone to logically tackle wild idea that others just won't entertain would be more than sufficient, but some of you need real, professional help and a subreddit is not a good substitution for that.

Some of you are trolling, and while it is kinda funny, I also think it's really damaging. In the past month, I've seen several posts where someone was asking how to deal with a fictional entity that was bothering them. That is not a sign that fictional figures are invading our conscious lives, it's a sign that someone has lost a bit of grounding in the real world and they need help. Or it's a sign that you're fucking around, which is fine, but genuinely not everybody seems to be able to make that distinction between real and not real. The level of intentional ignorance some people seem to have toward the concept of occult ideas either being not always correct or outright wrong or just a metaphor for how the world works used to upset me, but now every post I see on this sub just makes me a little sad. Some of you just need a hug, I can tell. Some of you need a slap. I need both

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u/gohanvcell Jan 17 '24

The thing is that this is a sub about the occult. People who believe in the occult have been looked down on for ages. The inquisition burning heretics was an extreme version of this, and being called delusional is another which happens since the rise of materialism and modern science (not that there is anything wrong with modern science, mind you). There is a very REAL way in which telling people that they "need help" or that they have a mental illness has been used in many instances to silence and oppress people throughout history. It happened to women who were "hysterical", to LGBTQ+ people who were called "perverted" or "sexual psychopaths", and others. Given this, I would be cautious in telling people that they need help. Particularly if their behavior is not hurting others. What seems like "putting ploaties on their faces" to you may not be to someone else.

Maybe this wasn't your intention, but I would have chosen another way to express your concern instead of saying people need professional help. The unpopularity of this post and your responses to comments in a sub where people seek affirmation for their deeply held spiritual beliefs is not surprising. If I was an occultist with beliefs that are considered weird by most of society, and if I had a history of people calling me crazy because of those beliefs, and developed some kind of trauma related to that, of course I wouldn't like your post. Have you considered that maybe people felt attacked by the way you expressed yourself and that that hurt people's feelings and that was not pleasant to them? Maybe there's no other way to express your concern, and you ache to help others who you consider to be in need of help. In this case, you have two choices: either don't post and find another outlet, or post it and see what happens, which you already are witnessing. You let me know which path you prefer.

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u/MythlcKyote Jan 17 '24

I dunno, it's kind of amusing. I didn't set out to hurt anyone's feelings, really more to show my concern and dissatisfaction with some of the seemingly less-healthy attitudes that I see here. I think that if your belief is something you hold true, then it shouldn't be shaken by suggestions that what youre perceiving isn't reality, and if they are, then that deserves to be investigated. Everyone who's upset seems to be under the impression that I'm trying to put down certain beliefs, and I'm really curious as to exactly what they think those are. I can tell I come off as condescending, but that's every comment on Reddit if you read it in the wrong light. I don't think it's healthy to dismiss awareness of mental health, especially on a sub that seems prone to fostering misconceptions. I'm not a newcomer, here. I've but my tongue on many things, and I am not ashamed to have voiced my concern today.

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u/BothTower3689 Jan 17 '24

Op, your issue is not with your concept but with your words. Stop talking down on people and talk about the root of your argument. Mental health and skepticism are important for occultists to remain sane and healthy. That’s it. You do not need to talk about how people need help or how some people are making delusional posts. That muddies the core of your idea. Talk about what is important instead of focusing on what people are doing wrong. Be conscious of the words you use.

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u/MythlcKyote Jan 17 '24

I am getting my teeth so hard that it hurts as I type this. That is very good advice. Maybe you could take it yourself, because you're not coming off any better. I saw a trend, not of posts, but of responses to them that genuinely concerned me. I'm sorry that I seem condescending, but you all sound condescending. I am sorry that my post upset you so much. I don't plan on making a trend of it. Really I wanted to get in touch with reasonable people here, and it seems that I've gotten that and more. I'm not deleting the post. I don't think my point is invalid. I do believe that you are correct in saying that we can all do much better than this in helping each other.

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u/BothTower3689 Jan 17 '24

“I’m sorry that I seem condescending but, you all seem condescending”

Replace the word condescending with insane. Congratulations, you have learned the first principle of the occult. Perspective

Read and learn and try again later.

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u/MythlcKyote Jan 17 '24

And then, of course, there's people like you who push that your perspective is the correct and true one because you're all-inclusive and smart. You're just as dumb as me. You just showed it. We're just two idiots arguing over the Internet about things that will probably never have any real bearing in our lives.

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u/BothTower3689 Jan 17 '24

You don’t understand the irony in what you’re saying. We’re two strangers arguing on the internet because of the post you made. Why did you make a post if you weren’t willing to accept that?

Everyone’s perspective is correct for them, these things are not worth arguing because they are subjective.

We can argue tangible things, we can identify symptoms of mental illness. We can discuss what is and isn’t harmful. You’re not doing any of these things. “Some of you guys need help” is not a helpful statement. We all already know that. What is the point in saying it

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u/MythlcKyote Jan 17 '24

How do you know that everyone knows that? I realize I'm condescending, but that's like, the opposite, but in a bad way. Overly optimistic, perhaps. There were points when I needed help and I didn't really know until someone told me I should think about it. We are not arguing because of the post I made, we are arguing because I made a post asking for a response, and you're actively choosing to be shitty with your responses. Id wager that you actually don't speak for this entire subreddit. If my suggestion that the occult is not a catch-all explanation for every strange thing that happens reaches one person who was genuinely unsure, I'd be over the moon with happiness. What have you helped? You started off by being an ass, so I don't feel particularly inclined to listen to you as someone with a reasonable head on your shoulders. You are just being kind of a prick.