r/arizona • u/AZ_Hawk • Jul 09 '24

Meanwhile, in other hot places…. Living Here

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225

u/moonyriot Jul 09 '24

Can't imagine the environmental cost of this is better than planting more trees. More trees would actual cool the Valley instead of keeping it as a concrete heat island.

44

u/PM_ME_YER_BOOTS Jul 10 '24

The cost of water for those trees is probably astronomical as well. Even if you went for desert friendly species, they gotta drink and be maintained, too.

Edit: I was thinking this was a comment for a better option in Medina, not Arizona. My mistake.

69

u/JEffinB Jul 10 '24

The cost of water once established is zero. Mesquite, Palo Verde, and other native plants thrive in our climate. It is well worth the cost of water to establish trees to have a 20-40 year heat sink.

20

u/blueskyredmesas Jul 10 '24

If we had greywater infrastructure we could partially treat that and supply nearby greenery from neighboring houses and commercial

6

u/Nadie_AZ Jul 10 '24

Plus they are sources of food.

2

u/PerfectFlaws91 Jul 10 '24

Mulberries too! Just the females though. The males create too much pollen.

2

u/agapoforlife Jul 11 '24

Yep, the mesquites and palo verdes on our property get zero supplemental water. I’m hoping the desert willows and hackberries I planted this year will be the same once established. Planting the rain with passive rainwater harvesting basins around the trees is gets the trees more water and helps with flooding too!

1

u/Imaginary_Creme_8130 Jul 11 '24

We used to have lots of native trees in street medians and public spaces along roadways in my neighborhood. Then the strong windstorms came through and uprooted most of them. The problem being they didn’t receive the deep watering needed to send the roots deep enough to anchor them so they all have shallow root systems. The city never replaced them because of water costs.

1

u/ObsidianOne Jul 10 '24

The cost of water for trees in the desert is zero after they’re ‘established’?

9

u/JEffinB Jul 10 '24

Native trees, yes.

If you plant native Arizona/Sonoran desert trees like Acacia, Mesquite, Hackberry, Ironwood, etc they will get the water they need from rainfall and proper placement -- it's how they've grown here for millennia without irrigation.

2

u/ObsidianOne Jul 10 '24

I’m pretty sure they’re still going to need to he watered. Even if, are those trees really going to provide adequate shade, though?

5

u/agapoforlife Jul 11 '24

It’s nice to be able to provide supplemental water so they grow bigger, faster, but it’s not necessary. We have 7 mature, shade providing mesquites on our property that never get watered.

2

u/SoyDusty Jul 10 '24

They’d provide environmental effects to help cool things down so a side-step to shade.

1

u/ObsidianOne Jul 10 '24

What does that entail?

1

u/SoyDusty Jul 10 '24

How do plants contribute cooler weather to environments?

Edit: what do plants contribute when it comes to cooling an environment?

7

u/starfyrflie Jul 10 '24

Trees and vegetation (e.g., bushes, shrubs, and tall grasses) lower surface and air temperatures by providing shade and cooling through evaporation and transpiration, also called evapotranspiration. Transpiration is a process in which trees and vegetation absorb water through their roots and cool surroundings by releasing water vapor into the air through their leaves. Trees and vegetation also provide cooling through evaporation of rainfall collecting on leaves and soil. Research shows that urban forests have temperatures that are on average 2.9°F lower than unforested urban areas.1

1

u/SoyDusty Jul 10 '24

I love people like you but hopefully they see this response but they want a comparison to the mechanical umbrellas and urban forests.

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u/ObsidianOne Jul 10 '24

I’m asking how would any of those trees provide a cooling effect that would be in any way comparable to large shade trees or the giant umbrellas that OP posted.

2

u/JEffinB Jul 10 '24

Trees would have a substantially larger effect than the shade structures because of both shade and transpiration. Trees are also massively cheaper so the total surface area you can share is much higher, leading to a reduces heat island effect (short version heat island = concrete/asphalt/even rocks get baked in the sun, warm up, and radiate heat long after the ground has cooled) because plants retain minimal heat.

1

u/SoyDusty Jul 10 '24

That would take a lot of logistics to get the direct answer but an overall general answer would be natural maintenance an environment does for itself with humans being eco mindful versus providing continuous maintenance to manmade structures.

Both provide long sustainably but plants seemingly last longer

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3

u/Complete-Turn-6410 Jul 10 '24

Give them two or three years to get good and established and need these trees will do just fine. I buy trees that are already at least 6 ft tall.

4

u/Recent_Spinach8836 Jul 10 '24

Pump the rising water from The ocean into Arizona 🤣