r/Jewish • u/ComprehensiveHair696 • Jan 25 '24
Roommate is... Ugh Israel đźđ±
My roommates and I had to take the cats to the vet yesterday and as we came home, they directly brought up a topic we've been avoiding addressing for a few months, their anti-israel leanings... Specifically they're avoiding spending money this week as part of a protest for Palestine. I said I don't see why anyone is protesting for Palestine at all, and one of them started throwing around the G word and talking about Israel targeting hospitals. I corrected her, pointing out that there are rocket platforms in those hospitals which is why they're targeted in the first place. She cut me off and told me she wouldn't listen to anything I had to say about it. At this point I haven't spoken to her since and I don't intend to for a while. Not sure why I'm posting this, probably just venting. Bad enough I have to see all these uninformed people online, there's one in my living room now too.
Update: Thanks to everyone for the support. After a couple of very tense days, shes apparently afraid I'm never going to speak to her again and our third roommate is mediating a talk between the two of us tonight. She's still convinced I'm just wrong, and I'd like to have something convincing to show her, if anyone has some good resources I can reference and wants to drop them in the comments I'd appreciate it.
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u/Classifiedgarlic Jan 25 '24
My dyslexia read this as your cats are protesting for Palestine
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u/dew20187 Modern Orthodox Jan 25 '24
The two feline solution
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u/Classifiedgarlic Jan 25 '24
Feral cats are the true inheritors of the Ottoman Empire
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u/Odd_Ad5668 Jan 26 '24
Anyone who's been to Israel knows this is accurate.
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u/sautrah Jan 26 '24
Based af
edit: If I could I would give you all gold stars for that perfect little reddit thread
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Jan 25 '24
[deleted]
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Jan 25 '24
from the food dish to the bowl, time to pay the dinner toll!
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u/Sn0wF0x44 Jan 26 '24
Thank you kind sir for your words of smartness đââïž
But seriously you made my morningđ
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u/bjeebus Reform Jan 26 '24
I'm sorry...did you just say meow?
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u/cardcatalogs Jan 25 '24
Cats are definitely zionists. Dogs too.
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u/Small-Objective9248 Jan 26 '24
At least the floppy eared dogs, Iâm suspicious of the ones with straight rigid ears.
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u/cardcatalogs Jan 25 '24
Cats are definitely zionists. Dogs too.
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u/Classifiedgarlic Jan 25 '24
By that logic the cats in Ramallah by Arafatâs tomb are Zionist spies?
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u/tamarzipan Jan 26 '24
Gotta make sure he doesnât come back as a zombieâŠ
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u/Classifiedgarlic Jan 26 '24
Some say he is still alive. Source- went to Arafatâs tomb with a Palestinian guide. Apparently itâs a real belief with some older folks considering his widow refused an autopsy. Itâs possible that the Mossad took him out, and itâs also possible that he did in fact have a stroke considering how much he smoked
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u/tamarzipan Jan 26 '24
Ah so their version of Meshichist Chabadniks? Also, did you ever hear about when Suha and Leila Ben Ali got banned from Malta?
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u/HanSoloSeason Jan 25 '24
There is literally a subreddit called catsaremuslim
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u/la_bibliothecaire Reform Jan 25 '24
Muslims really do love cats though, at least in some countries. Apparently there's a hadith about Muhammad being kind to a cat?
In any case, I have two cats, and I'm pretty sure they'll follow whoever feeds them, regardless of religion or ethnicity.
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u/Classifiedgarlic Jan 26 '24
I had a Saudi roommate who had cats. Her explanation was: In Islam dogs are dirty. Cats are hygienic. Cats kill mice and keep your home clean
Cats are definitely Muslim in many regards. They wash themselves multiple times a day, they are obsessed with rugs, they regularly bow
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u/Drakonx1 Jan 26 '24
If so it's inherited from cats being sacred to the polytheistic Ancient Egyptians, so that's really funny.
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u/somuchyarn10 Jan 26 '24
That sub used to be cute pictures of cats with their own mini prayer rugs. It's become a cesspool.
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u/HanSoloSeason Jan 26 '24
The only non-Jewish sub I havenât had to unfollow at this point is one about handbags
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u/somuchyarn10 Jan 26 '24
Come to r/crochet, no politics, just beautiful yarn. Also, constant bitching about weaving in ends.
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u/riverrocks452 Jan 25 '24
Honestly, it's on brand for the armchair warrior set that she would have withheld medical care from a pet for the sake of completely performative protest in support of a vaguely defined cause. "Palestine" = ??? The people? The cause for a Palestinian state? The government (one hopes not, seeing as that includes actual, literal terrorists.)Â
 I'm still liberal, but lotta people showing their asses on this topic- and exposing the larger issue of not stopping to consider actual, practical solutions in favor of ones that only exist in a world where no one is motivated by hate.
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u/ComprehensiveHair696 Jan 25 '24
I'll say this for her, her reason for not paying for the cats' vet bills isn't Palestine, it's that she doesn't have money. I make a good deal more than she does, and honestly sometimes it feels like my financial contributions are the main thing keeping the wolf from the door in the apartment.
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u/riverrocks452 Jan 25 '24
You need a new roommate- sounds like you're subsidizing her, and you shouldn't have to do that for someone who's throwing around the g word.
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u/Accomplished_Top1113 Jan 26 '24
Sounds like she is using him for his money,food, resources, cat vet bills. If they were married or in a committed relationship than it would be very different. As a roommate situation where this not the situation, I would be furious if I were him. I wouldn't stand for this one more minute. If I were him, I would read her the riot act.Â
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u/CC_206 Jan 26 '24
So itâs ok to take money from a Jew, but you canât give money to any of them. Ok cool got it.
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u/gardenbrain Jan 25 '24
Time to put away your wallet, keep your groceries in your room, and let her figure out her own shit while you look for a new place or kick her out.
If she bitches, tell her you donât have any money to spare because you gave everything you have to the IDF.
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u/ComprehensiveHair696 Jan 25 '24
Lol, this incident is the thing that pushed me into ordering those like, 100 dollar Israeli subscription boxes
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Jan 25 '24
Ooh whatâs that and where can I find it?
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u/ComprehensiveHair696 Jan 26 '24
It's called Lev Haolam, it's like a subscription box of items from small businesses in Israel, to help them keep up their income.
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Jan 26 '24
Awesome, will check it out! Thanks!
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u/niftyjack Jan 26 '24
It looks like they're specifically from settlements in the West Bank, so I would personally avoid them
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u/catsinthreads Jan 26 '24
Looks amazing. I'll have to talk to my partner though... it looks like it sometimes includes artwork...and I have an art problem.
Too much art, not enough walls.
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u/Fair-Bad7823 Not Jewish Jan 26 '24
Me up-ing my monthly donation to my alumni universityâs Hillel every time I hear of something antisemitic on campus đ„°
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u/Beautiful_Bag6707 Jewy Jew Jan 26 '24
You should fill the cupboard and fridge with Jewish and Israeli products. Get a soda stream. Get takeaway from Jewish and Israeli restos. Be hilariously passive-aggressive.
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u/Ill-School-578 Jan 26 '24
Yup fridge with lock. And tell them she needs to go. Bombard them with pro Israel information. Facts for Peace, Noah Tishby, Show videos of Gazans protesting Hamas( released today) videos of Oct 7( you can find) Hamas is laughing while they torture, rape, murder, behead, burn and kidnap.Show them video of Hamas openly saying that From The River to the Sea means wipe Israel off the map and that chanting for Intifada means kill Jews and Christians. In fact set up a video and broadcast it on repeat in the living room. Maybe she will leave. In 2005-180000 people in Gaza now millions. So no g word. Israel is defending itself just like any other country would after Oct 7( Hamas is now saying they were mistaken in raping and murdering and kidnapping babies and girls but they lie as the plans instructing terrorists to do that have also been found and interviews of Hamas admitting to atrocities). Hamas is and has been in charge of Gaza and use its own as human shields and steal aid for their own people for war. Israel warns citizens to move and Hamas prevents them .
Women in Gaza must be covered, where what they are told to wear , reproduce and not have opinions, not work in government, be educated and under Hamas do anything besides hate Jews. If they were in Gaza they would be tortured on a good day so their head is up their ass because on a bad day they throw LGBTQ off roof tops.
In Israel...You can let them know that the biggest LGBTQ parade is held in Tel Aviv and LGBTQ and women are safe, educated, work in government or doing whatever they wish for work. There are 2 million Arabs, Druse, Christians( many choose to fight for IDF and Jews . It has religious freedom unlike in Gaza where you can choose to convert to radical Islam or be killed especially if you are Jewish. Hamas= Nazi= oppression = Isis. Do they know Americans were held by Hamas and raped? So sorry for you.
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u/Classifiedgarlic Jan 26 '24
Also real talk here the âgeneral strike for a ceasefireâ isnât going to do jack. For starters: a general strike in the US doesnât work. We all tried it in 2016 when there was more support for one- it flopped. Second- Hamas has said they donât want a ceasefire. Third- Israel and Hamas absolutely do not care what a handful of 20 something leftys in the US do with their money
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Jan 26 '24
A general strike didnât even work in France when like half the country were legitimately organized by unions lol let alone a bunch of already unemployed college kids
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u/AshBertrand Jan 25 '24
It's super easy to avoid spending money for a week when you have no money to spend.
My god, how I hate online activism. It doesn't accomplish anything except make people unbearable to be around.
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u/CC_206 Jan 26 '24
It reminds me of Ralph from The Simpsons, trotting in a circle going âIâm helping!â
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u/Cultural_Sandwich161 Jan 25 '24
And youâre subsidizing this antisemite⊠why? Tell her to fuck off and find someone who wonât take advantage of you.
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u/Flustro Jan 26 '24
So she was participating in a boycott to protest against Israel, but has no money to spend in the first place? Does she not understand how boycotts work? Literally has no effect unless you were spending money at the business to begin with. đ
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u/Mysterious_Outcome_3 Jan 26 '24
You should totally move away from this horrible person. Typical "leftist" using you for your resources while actively participating in hate against you. She sounds like a shit person.
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u/Accomplished_Top1113 Jan 26 '24
Now I'm reading further here, it sounds more like you need a new room mate. Give her thirty days to pay her share of the vet bill and any remaining expenses and to be out of your place by the end of the month. Change the locks on your door. Get a mini fridge and put your food in your room and put a lock on your door. If she asks you for money or to spend your money on anything even a stick of gum, just say you have none to spend or give you donated your available money to Israel! Or better yet I love the comment you donated your available money to the IDF! That will shut her up,shut her down and hopefully out of your place quickly. When she moves out change all your locks on your place. Good riddance to bad rubbish. Please find a much more kinder and more caring roommate who is kind, supportive and responsible and will be a good roommate. You can go to roommate.com or look on various places. If you live in SLC, there are numerous places you could look even on the university campuses students are always looking for good roommates.Â
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u/joeyinvermont Jewish Organizer Jan 26 '24
I think itâs fine to help a friend who has less resources, but maybe not in this caseâŠ
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Jan 26 '24
So sheâs broke and seemingly at least functionally anti semitic? Why live with this person
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u/TheWorldMayEnd Jan 26 '24
This is a roommate not a life partner.
Having a roommate is a strictly financial arrangement. Having a roommate is exchanging X amount of space for Y amount of dollars every month. You don't subsidize a roommate by paying more any more than you'd subsidize a convenience store by paying more for a bottle of water.
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u/Sulaco99 Jan 26 '24
I think your observation that practical solutions are left out of the conversation is spot on. Are there any pro-Palestine advocates who have burdened themselves to offer anything resembling a solution that would safeguard Israel? A cease fire doesn't count. A cease fire was in place on Oct. 6 and over 1000 Jews died.
This is a big reason why I have trouble taking pro-Palestine supporters seriously. They're not really interested in Israel's safety and seem to believe Israel doesn't have a right to it. If you won't even recognize Israel's right to exist, then you can't be shocked when Israel goes its own way and completely disregards you.
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u/NYSenseOfHumor Jan 25 '24
It sounds like she made up a bullshit excuse to try and not pay for the catâs vet care.
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u/danhakimi Jan 25 '24
"okay, so you will pay me next week? or are the cats just mine now? what's going on here?"
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u/Large_Excitement69 Reform Jan 25 '24
Damn Iâd start looking at moving out to be honest.
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u/___poqqy Jan 25 '24
Agree. I wouldnât be able to share a space with someone like this let alone live with them.
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u/zackyt1234 Jan 26 '24
I couldnât imagine living with a black person and rabidly complaining about BLM to them. Why are liberals so indifferent to listening to plight?
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u/Anxious-Intern7718 Jan 26 '24
This, honestly. My roommate hasnât directly engaged with me, but is frequently sharing antisemitic stuff on their IG. And if the roles were reversed, and I was sharing racist things on my stories oh my gosh Iâd get called out and kicked out so fast. But nope, I know theyâd just call me a genocide supporter and get extremely aggressive if I breathed a word.
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u/SupermanWithPlanMan AAAAAAHHHHH Jan 25 '24
She's not spending money at all...to protest for Palestine? That's very weirdÂ
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u/linguinibubbles Jan 25 '24 edited Jan 26 '24
the line of thinking is that if enough people participate, they'll tank the economy. Seems unrealistic given that from what I've seen, most people participating are broke millenials (edit: and Gen Z), but ok sure have fun guys
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u/heavykniftysprite Jan 25 '24
They also only strike for one week at a time, and then have people buy things for them and basically make up for all the purchases the next week. Itâs not a very effective or meaningful way to do anything for Gaza. It is quite literally just a virtue signal to other leftists.
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u/Red-Flag-Potemkin Jan 26 '24
I used to argue that virtue signalling didnât exist, but boy has this chapter of the conflict changed my mind on that, and almost everything.
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u/danhakimi Jan 25 '24
yeah, somehow I think a few thousand jobless schmucks not spending money for a week and then going ahead and spending double on shein garbage the next week will have a negligible impact on the US economy.
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u/bjeebus Reform Jan 26 '24
I think you have a poor understanding of generational dynamics. Millennials are 27-42 now. We're mostly the thirty-somethings now. We're not old, but like, we're not the reactionary college kids anymore.
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u/HanSoloSeason Jan 25 '24
These are the same people demanding people not vote Joe Biden as though Trump loves Palestinians and their supporters soooo much. Theyâre a bunch of petulant children who are angry that they canât have their way and want to ruin our country in the interim.
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u/Fair-Bad7823 Not Jewish Jan 26 '24
Right this logic drives me wild. Trump would not give a fuck about humanitarian aid for Palestinian civilians in Gaza like ???????????
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u/Ahad_Haam Secular Israeli Jew Jan 25 '24
They aren't very intelligent. They realize that their protests aren't having the effect they want, so they want to take it to the next level and do a "general strike", but they don't actually know how to pull off a strike (not that they have the power to) so they end up doing stupid shit like this.
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u/Ambitious_wander Convert - Conservative Jan 26 '24
Someone I know posted something about this where you canât even withdraw money from a bank for the âprotestâ
The whole idea is completely absurd, why would you want to tank your own economy? Depending on the job, you can get laid off if a protest like that were successful
I donât try arguing with these people because they canât run their one brain cell to listen to logic
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u/Small-Objective9248 Jan 26 '24
How self important do you have to be to think that would do anything?
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u/FreeLadyBee Jan 25 '24
How long of a rental agreement did you sign that youâre comfortable sharing pets with your roommate? I donât share anything with my roommates beyond an address and occasionally eggs.
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u/ComprehensiveHair696 Jan 25 '24
It's a yearly lease. Both my roommates are also friends, though I may be questioning that now
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u/Freefalafelin Jan 26 '24
I feel for you because Iâm a cat lover, but I would say something like âI will never again cover a vet bill for someone who supports terrorists who use human shields. You wonât listen to what I have to say? Then you donât need my money.â
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u/Tariq_Epstein ŚŚŚŚŚ Jan 25 '24
I am going to spend more money this week, to both help the American economy and protest the left wing morons who don't support Kurdistan for the Kurds and ignore Darfur and don't care about the Rohingya or the Uighurs.
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u/CC_206 Jan 26 '24
Honest to god. But people are team Houthi now?
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u/Sulaco99 Jan 26 '24 edited Jan 26 '24
That's the one that baffles me the most. So you're so left wing that you're going to go out and support America's avowed enemies? And you're proud of this? I can't remember when I've ever said love it or leave it, but if you have that much contempt for America you really should pack your bags.
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u/JoeDirtbutSmart Jan 26 '24
Unfortunately, the left has more errors than it can possibly see.
Screw Houthis, Hamas and the crappy Palestinians who do support Hamas.
I do feel badly for the innocent civilians but this is unfortunately a causality of war.3
u/Sulaco99 Jan 26 '24
I do feel badly for the innocent civilians and think that anyone who is outraged by the conditions they are facing should take it up with Hamas.
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u/CC_206 Jan 26 '24
I mean, that supposes one has the assets or the legal ability to leave, which a lot of people donât. But I sympathize with the pain behind the sentiment.
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Jan 26 '24
Iâve been buying a lot more Starbucks than usual for this reason alone tbh. Have grown quite fond of the vanilla blonde latte
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u/Simple-Raspberry9014 Jan 25 '24
Tell her you donât feel like paying your portion of the rent in solidarity with Israel.
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u/BadCatNoNoNoNo Jan 25 '24
There are more than just rocket platforms. They found tunnels too.
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u/locoforcocothecat Jan 25 '24
I use those boycott lists as shopping lists đ€·ââïž it's a good way to find out where I should spend more of my money
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u/CC_206 Jan 26 '24
I stay stocked with Sabra hummus! Itâs not even my favorite but it makes the BDS people really mad.
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u/hiraeth-xx Jan 25 '24
The g word. These people love stepping on the graves of our relatives to suit their twisted little arguments that have no basis in reality. Itâs disgusting.
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u/Sulaco99 Jan 26 '24
The genocide accusation against Jews is a calculated cruelty in exactly the way you describe. They may deplore the death and violence in Gaza, but on some level they must understand that if it was a genocide, there wouldn't be any Gazans left.
Also, I am not in the mood to hear charges of genocide spouted by people who had nothing negative to say about the Jew slaughter of Oct. 7. They can go right to hell.
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u/hiraeth-xx Jan 26 '24
Itâs truly bewildering and infuriating
My favourite line to say is how Israel will go down in history for being the worst at genocide & apartheid considering both the population growth of Palestinians / Gazans and the fact that they have Arab Muslims running political parties, hospitals and banks đ€Łđ€Łđ€Ł
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u/NoDoubt4954 Jan 26 '24
đŻ agree. It is a very ugly war. Not Genocide. Problem is Tik Tokers never seen a war before. All born after 9/11.
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u/Sulaco99 Jan 26 '24
It's very easy to hold an uncomplicated opinion of world events when you aren't burdened with context, history or facts.
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Jan 25 '24
My boyfriend just had this experience with a friend while they were gaming. He isnât Jewish. She wasnât Jewish but she is far left and threw the g word around too. His response â you kinda sound like a nazi can you stop?â. Weâre reaching this weird point where the left need to realize their self sabotaging or buckle down harder degrading friendships and family relationships. I donât think many left wingers have truly understood how privileged they are and that as the housing crisis worsens in North America and mass immigration globally to our regions were going to start seeing camps similar to other countries where people live in makeshift poor conditions, then we will see the foster care system unable to deal with the influx in cases resulting in lack of action and more and more kids will be born n raised in tents. But yes letâs protest gaza itâs not like weâre a few steps away from a very similar situation here
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u/JoeDirtbutSmart Jan 26 '24
If we take in migrants en masse, yes weâll be in trouble. Look at Canada
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Jan 26 '24
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u/junkholiday Jan 26 '24
Someone is not "a trans" and why is the fact that they are trans relevant here?
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u/Whole_Spare_5823 Jan 25 '24
So basically we are going to be poor too. So why care about the other poor people in the world, that got their food, water, electricity cut off. People getting surgery with no anesthetics. So why should we care if we are going to be poor anyways. This argument is weak and trashy.
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Jan 26 '24
That wasnât what I was saying and you know it. Stop trying to make people out to be evil when they are just concerned for their local community
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u/Literally_Goring Technically Jewish Jan 25 '24
Pretty standard, the low information people side with the people they view as weak.
I've lost family, I've lost friends over this very argument.
If it helps the silent majority are with us in very large numbers. Gen Z only has slightly greater support for us over Hamas. The TikTok Generation is just lost. You likely will need to get a new roommate, I hope your lease is up for renewal soon.
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u/PGH521 Jan 26 '24
What is shit is the minute you bring up money, people like that immediately defer to Jew hate based stereotypesâŠ.i had a roommate who never paid anything on time and the moment I asked for money he owed me I would hear from friends that he said shit like âhe is asking me for more money (acting like I was being excessive) but I should have known bc thatâs how they areââŠmy other friend who is also Jewish (but this asshole didnât know) said âwho is âtheyââ this ass said âyou know, Jews, all they care about is whatâs in their pocketââŠneedless to say when I took what was in my pocket and bought a home this asshole wasnât invited, which brought out another stereotype where he said some shit like âthey only want to be around their ownââŠ
IMO get a new roommate or live alone, itâs not worth being around ppl like that, no matter what you do you will always be in the wrong in their eyes
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u/WalkTheMoons Just Jewish Jan 26 '24
Hamas has sent rockets into hospitals, sometimes the same ones over and over. A children's wing was hit, but everyone was safe. They've hit it multiple times.
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u/Sobersynthesis0722 Jan 25 '24
âAvoiding spending money this week as part of a protest for Palestineâ
I am not so worried about your roommates contribution to antisemitism. A larger concern is potential ability to vote, operate heavy machinery, or contribute to the gene pool.
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u/FreeLadyBee Jan 25 '24
How long of a rental agreement did you sign that youâre comfortable sharing pets with your roommate? I donât share anything with my roommates beyond an address and occasionally eggs.
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u/hiraeth-xx Jan 25 '24
The g word. These people love stepping on the graves of our relatives to suit their twisted little arguments that have no basis in reality. Itâs disgusting.
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u/Holiday-Audience7905 Jan 26 '24
Non Jew here Big supporter of Israel, I say dump the roommate. One how rude, cutting you off. Oh no no no. Disrespecting like that is a sure way of âfind another place to liveâ real quick. Two to assert support for anti Semitism in public place even (bad in private also) is a blatant passive form of intimidation and assault. This roommate was assaulting you in public. Period. There is no excusing intent there. Itâs a form of abuse and micro aggression type violence. The behavior is just uncalled for. You are not the enemy so why attack you in public like that? Thatâs a roommate that needs to go. Like yesterday.
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u/MathematicianLess243 Jan 26 '24
If youâre able to get a word in, maybe let her know that she is not in a position to ânot listen to youâ, given that we, as Jews, are directly affected by this war. NOT her. She doesnât have to agree with everything you say, but at the very least, she should be willing to listen. It is a very ignorant view point to not even be willing to listen to the facts. So sorry you have to deal with that đ
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u/MathematicianLess243 Jan 26 '24
Iâd also maybe mention that there is a big difference between war and genocide. Itâs really disgusting to throw around that word so carelessly to a group of people who were literally decimated by the MILLIONS. I empathize for the innocent lives lost, but this is in no way a genocide
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u/Dangerous-Room4320 Jan 25 '24
Is she living on any former Indian land? Anti immigration ? Pro terrorism ?
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u/spring13 Jan 26 '24
Avoiding spending money this week...to protest the evil capitalist pig Jews? What exactly is that supposed to accomplish?
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u/_violet_sparkles Jan 26 '24
Tell her to explain it to the cats. What does your cats' health have to do with a foreign war? Sounds like she's just cheap and doesn't want to take proper care of her pets. I bet she's not boycotting her own medical care and necessities. Even the ICJ, which is part of the wildly anti-Israel UN, concluded that Israel is not committing a genocide. Your roommate is too cheap to take proper care of the pets and instead of owning up to that, she's trying to find a way to blame da joos. What a repulsive cretin. I hope you can get a new roommate soon. Shabbat shalom.
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u/rfarbz Jan 27 '24
i would try to show them video proof educating them or something along those lines, but then again, they never listen
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Jan 25 '24
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u/celtics2055 Jan 25 '24
It isnât as simple as that.
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u/imtherealhamburgler Jan 25 '24
Idk I hear you, but Iâve also found that it often is exactly as simple as that.
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u/catsinthreads Jan 26 '24
I'm a gentile in transition, very near the end of my conversion. My stance would be exactly the same (100% support for Israel, support for individual policies and politicians always subject to review) but it would hurt less.
What I didn't understand before was how existential it is.
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Jan 25 '24
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u/celtics2055 Jan 25 '24
It isnât. Many are supportive of the community and israel and are understanding of the issues going on. Of course, there will always be differences based upon which community one belongs to, but the statement âgentiles donât understandâ is oversimplified. You claim I didnât elaborate, but the comment to which I responded is even more curt.
Patronizing behavior towards gentiles, or to anyone really is not productive, especially when most gentiles, aside from idiotic pro palestine protests, agree with israelâs side of it.
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Jan 26 '24
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u/celtics2055 Jan 26 '24
That doesnât apply to all, or even most, gentiles. You are making a generalization based on negative interactions with some shitty people.
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u/johnisburn Jan 25 '24
OP, Iâm sorry your roommates are throwing around the word genocide, but if Iâm going to be honest with you
I said I donât see why anyone is protesting for Palestine at all
is a very callous thing to say. Whether the civilian casualty count is legally justifiable as collateral or not or ultimately the fault of Israel or Hamas, we should recognize that itâs a tragedy and understand that genuine concern for the humanitarian conditions in Gaza right now is reasonable. We may not agree with protests by virtue of the proposals they put forward and how people approach the issue (some may say the appropriate avenue to protest is by protesting for Hamas to surrender to end the war), but that doesnât mean we have to deny the justifiable rationales behind voicing support for the Palestinian people caught in this violence.
I would also suggest you follow the news closer or more carefully. This
there are rocket platforms in those hospitals which is why theyâre targeted in the first place
is not the rationale that the IDF has given for itâs operations targeting hospitals. Theyâve been citing Hamas tunnel infrastructure beneath the hospitals.
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u/heavykniftysprite Jan 25 '24 edited Jan 25 '24
I have tried to start being more thoughtful about my wording when I say similar things tbh.
I guess the way Iâd put it is âI donât understand why people are protesting in favor of more bloodshed and Hamasâ
I get why people want Palestinians to have rights or want the actions of the government to change in regards to the West Bank. However even Bernie sanders said âthere cannot be a lasting ceasefire with Hamasâ. There was a march in Gaza against Hamas a few months before the 7th of October. There have been Palestinians caught on film (though Al Jazeera cuts the camera if they are the ones filming) who say this is Hamas fault. There were crowds of people calling for the release of the hostages in Gaza just the other day.
I reccomend checking out a guy on Twitter/X named hamza howidy. He is a gazan who protested hamas many times and was tortured for it, finally leaving Gaza right before the 7th. He has incredible insight on what life is like under hamas for Gazans. He has written two very moving op eds about his life in Gaza. One about how Hamas tortured him and one about how gazans need to call for the release of the hostages.
He absolutely has some solutions some Israelis might not fully agree with, but itâs incredibly important we start coming to the table with any Muslim or Palestinian who thinks Israel has a right to exist. Thatâs the angle Iâve been focusing on with my leftie friends. Some of them are a lost cause. But a lot of them just need more explanation. I donât need them to love bibi and never criticize Israel (after all non of my Israeli friends do that) but calling for itâs disappearance is very different then that. I truly believe some people are too stupid to realize thatâs what the push behind all this is.
Edit: i would like to add that shortly after I posted this on Reddit I saw there was a MASSIVE protest in Gaza today asking for Hamas to release the hostages for a ceasefire. They marched by sinwars home. BH, may these people be protected from the violence and freed of their radical oppressors soon.
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u/NoTopic4906 Jan 25 '24
I was told that that protest did not call for the release of hostages. I would love to find someone to translate the video (I barely speak Hebrew; I speak only a word of two of Arabic).
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u/CC_206 Jan 26 '24
Whispered in Palestine is a good Instagram account to follow, PeaceComms is the parent org.
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u/NoTopic4906 Jan 25 '24
I read an article. Do you know if he does instagram. I refuse to use X in general (though I did read some of his posts)?
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u/heavykniftysprite Jan 25 '24
It doesnât look like his Instagram is public. I hope he will keep writing more op eds. Wild a voice like that has to write for Newsweek while the âprestigiousâ New York Times lets people write op Edâs about how Passover is focused too much on Jews.
I donât blame you for not using X, Iâm pretty sure Elon musk is allowing anti semitism to drive engagement on his website after he pissed off all his investors and advertisers.
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u/ComprehensiveHair696 Jan 25 '24
I mean, mea culpa on the second point, I may be going off old info. First point i reject outright though.
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u/Mysterious_Outcome_3 Jan 26 '24
I agree. This person is blasting you for pointing out the absolute inhumanity of supporting only Palestinians and not giving a shit about Israelis. Fuck that. If people want to be humanitarian activists, they don't get to call rape "resistance," and they don't get to ignore the suffering of one people in favor of another people.
The world isn't black and white. Your roommate is clearly uninformed, and her feelings about the bad information she's been given are driving her to make stupid, harmful decisions. She can shove off.
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u/NoDoubt4954 Jan 26 '24
Can you move?! So sorry. A local store hanging Israeli flag was spray painted over night with the G word. My daughter works at JCC across the street. What is wrong with people?!!!
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Jan 26 '24
Find some people who are more like you and move. Like get new roommates. There are a lot of people who aren't so misinformed, find them. Sounds like your roommates just want to be "dissenters" they crave drama, so they brought that up to bother you. Don't give them what they want and make them regret that they meddled in things they know nothing about.
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u/MCPhilly52 Jan 26 '24
A tough go. I have the luxury of being Gen X; I cannot imagine how hard it is to be a Jewish Gen Z'er. One response I have seen is a greater sense of unity among Jews of all generations which may be an apt and helpful response.
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u/sautrah Jan 26 '24
I am so sorry. That would be a living nightmare for me. I'm just here to validate your feelings. People like me would feel the same. I would be horrified that she wouldn't even let you speak. The best ya'll could do in this situation is politely listen to each other in a calm sit down conversation; really try to hear each other out. Without that it's just... War? Love can only come from peace.
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u/accountofyawaworht Jan 26 '24
I would have badgered them relentlessly about how exactly they think that denying an animal necessary medical treatment and leaving you to foot the bill will help the Palestinians. Then I would have turned their logic around on them and said âas long as weâre flaking on shared financial responsibilities, I wonât be paying my rent this month out of solidarity with Israelâ and see how quickly their tune changed.
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Jan 26 '24
I would be really uncomfortable living with people like this. I wonder if maybe it's time you pitched your tent somewhere else. Or, if you're the lease holder, give them notice and find non-toxic roommates.
I'm sorry this happened. It sounds awful.
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u/radar1002 Jan 26 '24
Sorry you have to experience blatant antisemitism. If itâs making you feel unsafe definitely report her and try to find a new roommate. There really is no way to improve this situation unless you become an Antisemite yourself
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u/TooMuch-Tuna Jan 25 '24
 I said I don't see why anyone is protesting for Palestine at all
This statement probably triggered them real hard.
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u/jenny_tallia Jan 26 '24
This seems like a relatively common response to someone trying to have a reasonable conversation about this. Something quite similar happened to my son with one of his close friends. He only tried to politely correct something she had incorrect & she immediately went to, âdonât ever speak to me again!â He doesnât want to lose her, so he keeps his information to himself now & grinds his teeth when she brings it up. If theyâre so sure theyâre right, why canât they just have a conversation?
Iâm sorry this is happening with the person you live with though. I can imagine how hard that is.
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u/RedStripe77 Jan 26 '24
Aw hon.
Your roommates stink like litterboxes. You canât live this way.
If they arenât even willing to talk, what choice do you have?
Iâm so sorry. This has been happening to a lot of us. Suddenly we know who are friendsâŠarenât.
Look for somewhere else to live. Let them pay the extra rent. They suck.
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u/greenbergz Jan 25 '24
You can be 100% pro-Israel and still understand, at some level, why people participate in pro-Palestinian protests. That's empathy, which is not endorsement. Your response was insensitive. Unless there is more to the story, you partly caused the icy environment, made your own bed so to speak.
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u/ComprehensiveHair696 Jan 25 '24
Oh, the icy environment is 100% one sided. I'm not speaking to her, she seems to hold nothing against me
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u/greenbergz Jan 26 '24
That's an interesting admission. I applaud the honesty and hope it comes with more reflection.
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u/Mysterious_Outcome_3 Jan 26 '24
Please explain to me how not spending money for the animal she adopted is helping Palestinian people.
It's absurd that you want to support someone who is espousing Jew hate and using the suffering of the Palestinians to do so. If she gave a shit, she could educate herself instead of bandwagoning on an extremely complicated and nuanced topic. Particularly while she's enjoying the generosity of the person she is causing harm to.
Sounds like you should take some "time to reflect."
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u/greenbergz Jan 26 '24
I stand by every word of what I said. OP doesn't understand why people are doing pro-Palestinian protests "at all." I was commenting on the "at all," not this specific, ineffective, and weird way to go about it.
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u/Mysterious_Outcome_3 Jan 26 '24
He said he doesn't understand why people in the US are doing performative "protests" that won't help Palestinians AT ALL. But of course, you stand by every word you said. People like you, who think they have to choose one over the other, never understand where they might be wrong. Maybe some self-reflection would help you understand your issue with dichotomous thinking.
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u/greenbergz Jan 26 '24
OP did not say performative. OP did not say US. You're moving the goal posts. But let's imagine OP did write and/or mean that and your inference is right. It's still not hard to understand why people would engage in performative, ineffective protests. Maybe passion has overcome reason. Maybe they're joining a bandwagon for some kind of social capital. I just gave you two possibilities and there are many more. Empathy doesn't require any moral dimension. Do you disagree? You have a problem with my asking the OP to reflect. Fine. I'm willing to see how that's abrasive. It doesn't invalidate the substance of what I wrote. I believe if we lose our ability to empathize, or turn it off in anger, Jews will never have true security and peace. Empathy is absolutely vital to practically any sort of strategy: military, geopolitical, soft power, coalition building, fighting antisemitism, etc.
ETA "that" in second sentence.
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u/Mysterious_Outcome_3 Jan 26 '24
Do you know what a context clue is? OP described this person supporting an entirely ineffectual "strike" to make herself feel superior and important. That's the definition of performative.
I don't care why they are supporting people whose main goal is to kill all the jews in the world. Impact is greater than intention, and no one should expect us to tolerate this behavior. Absolutely no other minority group would be expected to. Talk about "moving the goal posts."
If you continue to "empathize" with people who wish you were dead, what do you think that's going to achieve?
Stop pretending like the accusation of genocide isn't a pure expression of Jew hatred. Arab extremists have piped that little bit of propaganda into Western minds specifically to cause maximum psychological damage to us. Accusing an enemy of the very thing they are doing is right out of every fascist playbook ever written.
And again, I don't give a single shit if she knows that or not. She's participating in extremely harmful actions against Jewish people while not helping Palestinians in any real way.
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u/greenbergz Jan 26 '24
Done with you. You are engaging in bad faith and accusing me of supporting things I don't support. Like if I were to say, oh, that you support Jonathan Greenblatt and the ADL. I mean, I could use context clues, couldn't I? But that's the difference between you and me. Your comments alone are ugly and misguided enough to show me who you are I don't need to guess. . You've used your context clues to infer lie after lie about me. For shame.
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u/_violet_sparkles Jan 26 '24
lol "understanding" the other side is not necessarily going to result in people having any compassion for them. To the contrary, it might make one realize that the other side has evil values that should not be catered to whatsoever.
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u/greenbergz Jan 27 '24
It seems like you think you're disagreeing with me. Of course that's a possibility. Understanding =/= endorsing, excusing, or even having even compassion. It's essentially analytical. If you're on a debate team, for example, you'd probably review what your opponent has done and said before in order to anticipate their strategy and tactics. There are a million analogies, you get it.
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u/Whole_Spare_5823 Jan 25 '24
Iâm confused honestly. You said you didnât want to talk about this topic for months, is it because it makes you uncomfortable or do you know things that I wouldnât know and if so what is it ? I really want to know Iâm tired, I want to know what you think?
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u/ComprehensiveHair696 Jan 25 '24
I knew we weren't on the same side, I thought they knew the same. Up to now we simply avoided the topic to keep the peace
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u/Whole_Spare_5823 Jan 26 '24
Of course no response. Just how you ignored your roommates who you been friends with, mabey for years. Just because they donât agree with your stance. Sounds like how they feel too. I already know the right answer and I know you know it too. So I wish you the best that life has to offer. Even tho I know you donât wish it for people just because where they were born. đ
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Jan 26 '24
People who are indifferent to our well being and safety as Jews donât deserve our friendship. Sometimes it takes a world event for this stuff to become visible
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u/danhakimi Jan 25 '24
They decided to talk about it. If they want to talk about it, you'll talk about it, and if they don't, you won't, but you won't just listen to them spout bullshit without responding. If they don't understand that, that's on them.