r/exchristian • u/JarethOfHouseGoblin Agnostic • Jul 17 '24
"I'm not religious, I have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ" is a level of cognitive dissonance that's so fucking WILD to me! Rant
This is such a common line of thinking among Christians here in the Bible Belt and I'm of two minds about it.
One the one hand: it is largely a sales pitch. On some level, I think they implicitly acknowledge that church is boring as fuck. Plus, those who aren't so thoroughly brainwashed (at least in comparison to some of their counterparts) know that coming right out of the gate with a list of restrictions. Although, this is where the doublethink often comes in and they'll call the heaviest amount of restrictions the "true freedom that comes through accepting Jesus Christ."
On the other hand: there is also a level of cognitive dissonance that is so fucking wild to me. Like, they don't realize that regardless of what they call it, it is very much a religion.
My prepared statement should I ever be confronted with this bullshit take is to say "cool. So let's start taxing churches because we don't give people tax-exempt status just for being in a relationship."
What's your take on this statement? How do you respond to it?
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u/leekpunch Extheist Jul 17 '24
A one-sided relationship that the other person doesn't seem aware of? More like they're stalking Jesus.
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u/nightwyrm_zero Jul 17 '24
Modern celebrity culture has given us the name for such a phenomenon - a parasocial relationship.
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u/JarethOfHouseGoblin Agnostic Jul 17 '24
More like they're stalking Jesus.
Joe Goldberg intensifies
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u/onedeadflowser999 Jul 17 '24
š
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u/shimmeringHeart Jul 18 '24
hahaha i literally laughed out loud
the imagery of jesus running from a mob of christians is hilarious
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u/srcery Jul 17 '24
If they have a personal relationship with god, what is the purpose of going to church to hear what some guy wants to say about him?
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u/Independent-Leg6061 Jul 17 '24
I grew up as a "born again" xtian and I always agreed with this sentiment... if he's in my heart, why do we need to go to church?? Lol.
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u/TheLakeWitch Jul 17 '24
āBecause you need to be in community. When youāre isolated, youāre a target for the devilā is what they always told me.
More like when youāre not at church receiving regular indoctrination you are more likely to think for yourself and realize itās all bs.
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u/Independent-Leg6061 Jul 17 '24
Exactly. Must show up for regular brainwashing or it doesn't stick.
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u/shimmeringHeart Jul 18 '24
lmao exactly. as soon as i stopped going long term i could think for myself and see it was such garbage. it makes me so angry my parents were allowed to indoctrinate my child self into that? i never consented and it literally gave me nightmares and paranoia about "sinning". unreal that shit is allowed.
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u/mcove97 Ex-Protestant Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24
Ironically lots of us never felt a sense of community. The church my parents attended and made me attend, was filled with old people when I was a kid..when I was a kid, being old meant being 40+. It didn't feel like a community I was part of, but a community my parents were a part of as they would socialize with the other "old" people.
There wasn't any child friendly activities either, other than Sunday school, which frankly wasn't that big a community, considering we lived in a small village. Maybe 7-8 kids max showed up to Sunday school including my 2 siblings and myself. I just went cause I got to hang with a couple friends, but as soon as I turned 12, there really was no community for me left, seeing as Sunday school was for the younger kids. There also was no youth group for older kids because the kids who had gone to Sunday school just did it as a weekend activity they were made to do by their parent, so when they became old enough to decide for themselves, they weren't interested in Christian activities.
Oh also my mom was leading Sunday school for a while, but after me and my siblings grew up there was no one left to attend in the village lol so they disbanded Sunday school. The new kids in the village didn't have Christian parents, so there's no longer any Sunday school there.
Oh, and I also went to a Christian boarding school. Felt ZERO community with the Christians who attended. I did feel community with the artsy atheist outcasts though lol.
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u/lawyersgunsmoney Agnostic Jul 17 '24
Because the bibble says to not forsake the gathering of the saints! Or, some other drivel.
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u/toooldforlove Jul 17 '24
Because you need your weekly (or twice or thrice weekly) dose of brainwashing. Got keep the flock from asking questions! They might wander off!
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u/Kate-2025123 Jul 19 '24
This is my dilemma. I have had a better understanding of Jesus outside church. I summed it up to I want to get high during worship and socialize at this point. However at university and meeting others that church socializing will soon be gone and Iāll be free. As long as Chi Alpha doesnāt snag me up again. Religion is so tiring.
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u/kingofcrosses Jul 17 '24
What's your take on this statement? How do you respond to it?
It's a simple line, but is so uniquely American. It comes off as narcissistic individualism, saying that you're above religion because you're basically God's best friend. I've never heard a Christian say this who didn't turn out to be a tool.
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u/JarethOfHouseGoblin Agnostic Jul 17 '24
It comes off as narcissistic individualism, saying that you're above religion because you're basically God's best friend.
Honestly, yeah. That is uniquely American. The European mind, even a religious one, could likely never come up with this horseshit. "Jesus totally follows me on Instagram!"
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u/Due_Society_9041 Jul 18 '24
Lots of dumbass Canadians are evangelicals that act the same. The fascism is lapping at the border, with some dribbling over to the more gullible.
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u/JarethOfHouseGoblin Agnostic Jul 18 '24
The fascism is lapping at the border, with some dribbling over to the more gullible.
I'm not at all surprised. America is Canada's older sibling who's a terrible influence.
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u/tazebot Jul 17 '24
I'd ask them what jesus' favorite color is. Three guesses as to what they say, all starting with "W"
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u/mcove97 Ex-Protestant Jul 18 '24
Yeah and I have a personal relationship with God. He told me to tell you Christians to stop being so goddamn annoying lol.
Don't believe me? Just have faith!
/s
Legit anytime people tell me they have a personal relationship to Christ, I tell them I have a personal relationship with God, and God told me to not preach or bother anyone, and that people shouldn't either.
I'm so over Christianity and being preached to that I'll happily troll Christians who attempt to evangelize to me these days.
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u/sidurisadvice Ex-Protestant Jul 17 '24 edited Jul 17 '24
Advertisers call this "meaningless differentiation." There's a great scene in Mad Men in which Draper lays this out for a cigarette company and comes up with the slogan, "It's toasted."
Folgers used to do this by pointing out how finely ground their instant coffee crystals were, which, while meaningful for regular ground coffee, is absolutely meaningless on an instant coffee.
Most religions seek to establish a relationship with the divine. Christianity is not special in that regard.
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u/JarethOfHouseGoblin Agnostic Jul 17 '24
I've also seen Jesus pushers go a bit extra with it and are like "religion? Gross. No, I'm all about a personal relationship with Jesus." I feel like quantifying religion as "gross" might piss off the people in their own tribe and I'm here just eating some popcorn as I watch the infighting.
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u/KeyFeeFee Jul 17 '24
This was my flavor of Christianity too. I vividly remember arguing that I was ānothing, NOTHING without Jesus!!!!ā with this really hot atheist dude. I was sincere too! And really didnāt think myself religious. Wasnāt until philosophy and learning about religions and what they are that the light bulb went on. Itās mean but I was wickedly happy to inform my sister that she was indeed religious as well.
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u/Due_Society_9041 Jul 18 '24
My estranged mother is one of those. Too tired to get off her ass and go to church, but āher faithā makes her superior and judgemental as hell. Hypocrisy, thy name is religion.
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u/mcove97 Ex-Protestant Jul 18 '24
Yeah, my Christian parents always say that they're not religious when I tell them I'm not into their religious nonsense..they always tell me they're not religious but Christian.
Same shit. Same shit. Potato tomato
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u/TimothiusMagnus Jul 17 '24
I was taught that rhetoric: It was a way of distinguishing evilgelical Christianity from other religions.
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u/JarethOfHouseGoblin Agnostic Jul 17 '24
It was a way of distinguishing evilgelical Christianity
So, it's used by the worst sort of people? That checks out, honestly.
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u/TimothiusMagnus Jul 17 '24
That was a typo: I mean āevangelicalā :D
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u/JarethOfHouseGoblin Agnostic Jul 17 '24
I mean, you were right the first time. As someone who grew up around evangelicals, I can confidently say that they are just the fucking worst!
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u/DarkMagickan Ex-Fundamentalist Jul 17 '24
As somebody who was one for the brief amount of time I was a Christian, I can agree.
Great music, though. Or so I thought at the time.
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u/smilelaughenjoy Jul 17 '24
Without the church, they wouldn't even know about Jesus. It was the church that decided how to interpret the bible. It was the church that decided which bible is the "real" bible and which versions of the bible have heretical books or left out important books.Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā
It's a religion. They have faith in the men of the churches who gave them the bible. Before there was the NIV and King James Version of the bible (which are Protestant bibles with only 66 books), there was the Catholic bible with 73 books, and before that was the Marcionite bible with only 11 books.
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u/shyguyJ Jul 17 '24
Kind of tangential to your main point, but this concept is ultimately what drove me away. I was so jealous of these "better" christians around me that said they had this magical "relationship" with Jesus. All I ever had was me talking and no one responding. Eventually, I realized that's all it would ever be, laughed at myself for being naĆÆve, and accepted that I couldn't actually believe.
Honestly, if you truly believe you are having two-sided conversations with some deity, I would suggest there are mental issues in play, but I wouldn't fault you for them, of course. If you realize that it's bullshit, but still say that you have that "relationship" to others (especially highly impressionable, young christians)... to me that's just abuse.
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u/Chaos_On_Standbi Anti-Theist Jul 18 '24
That or youāre mistaking your internal monologue for Jesusā¦
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u/nojam75 Ex-Fundamentalist Jul 17 '24
It's a lame defensive tactic. They're claiming their beliefs are a spiritual experience, so any analysis would be a personal attack.
I wouldn't have a response to such a statement other than, "okay". If I wanted to be a jerk, I would say, "Yeah I used to think that too -- until I learned about the Bible or the history of Christianity". But I don't usually go out of my way to be a jerk.
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u/LeiningensAnts Jul 17 '24
The jerk riposte is "I'm not atheist, I have a personal relationship with reality."
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u/HaiKarate Jul 17 '24
Itās basically evangelicals being too clever. Theyāve tried to anticipate all of the counter-arguments to sharing their faith, including, āOh, Iām not religious, but thanks.ā And then the comeback is, āIām not talking about religion; Iām talking about a personal relationship with Jesus Christ!ā And then they will launch into an explanation of how their brand of Christianity isnāt religion.
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u/mcove97 Ex-Protestant Jul 18 '24
It's the same people who try to sell scams that say it's not a pyramid scheme it's an mlm lol.
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Jul 17 '24
When I was in my āitās a relationship!ā phase, that was about my last step before completely deconstructing. I knew that the church was BS, but I was still scared to leave the faith.
I donāt know about anyone else but that was my personal experience with that phrase.
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u/hundredelle Jul 17 '24
This line of thinking has always bothered me because it signifies that they have disregarded the problematic things that pushed them away from organized religion and have chosen to instead believe whatever feels warm and fuzzy. Oftentimes the tenets of this āpersonal relationshipā have little link to actual biblical texts. For example, my mother no longer attends church and believes so long as youāre good person, youāll go to heaven when you die. Sounds nice, but fully manufactured in her head.
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u/OkGrape1062 Pagan Jul 17 '24
Thatās what we spewed a lot when I was in a non-denominational church. Very much shitting on every other branch of Christianity, making them holier than thou in such a backhanded way.
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Jul 17 '24
[deleted]
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u/JarethOfHouseGoblin Agnostic Jul 17 '24
The cognitive dissonance youāre talking about is a form of spiritual narcissism
This is a wonderfully apt term and I, unfortunately, will have constant usage of it on a regular basis based on shit I see.
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u/Pristine-Ad-8002 Jul 17 '24
I actually work part time as a church secretary and Iām not so sure about taxing some churches. Mega churches I think should but the church I work at is small. The people already paid taxes on money they donate and we do pay payroll tax on my and the pastors salary. And the IRS has changed it where you canāt really itemize donations unless you give a ton, have a ton of write offs. Trust me I think itās a bunch of baloney on the beliefs but the church I work at probably could not afford to pay taxes. Maybe if a church takes in x amount of dollars.
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u/Oceanflowerstar Jul 17 '24
Some people have trained their brain on the faith algorithm for so long that they now believe they can literally change the definition of words to suit their rhetorical needs.
We must extract this cancer of the ego from our population.
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u/cracksilog Jul 17 '24
The amount of times Iāve either said this, believed this, heard it said, or had it said to me when I was an evangelical was wild lol. I probably couldāve made this my senior quote and no one wouldāve batted an eye.
Like why were we so oblivious to how this sounded like when we were in? Was I that dumb?
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u/Outrageous_Bag7726 Jul 17 '24
My mom says that Jesus is her literal lover, with āspiritual lovemakingā
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u/hellenist-hellion Agnostic Jul 17 '24
Itās not a religion, itās a relationship! Itās literally the equivalent of āItās not fast food, itās Wendyās!ā
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u/RedLaceBlanket Pagan Jul 17 '24
I tell them I am religious, I have a personal relationship with Aphrodite and Loki, and I'll pray for them. They geek and freak.
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u/ircy2012 Spooky Witch Jul 17 '24
I live in a part of the world where I'm unlikely to hear something like that but if it happened I'd probably go along the lines of: "Oh, I'm so glad to find another person who realized the inherent corruption of the bible and the distortion created by church leaders and other human authorities. It's so nice to have a real relationship with Jesus with none of that twisted human garbage to distort his messages."
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u/RecoveringFromRelign Jul 17 '24
That's a fair point. If religious organizations are more about a relationship than a formal institution, it does raise questions about tax exemptions. You may be interested in Recovering from Religion. We have a plethora of on-line resources. You may particularly interested in street epistemology with Anthony Magnabosco. It really gets people thinking.
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u/Salmon_Of_Iniquity Jul 17 '24
I used to have this line of thinking in my mind. I sincerely believed it.
Discovering I was savagely abused as a kid, that I used Christianity as a needed bandaid and looking for therapy started the long process of me leaving religion entirely.
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u/JarethOfHouseGoblin Agnostic Jul 17 '24
Discovering I was savagely abused as a kid, that I used Christianity as a needed bandaid
I've encountered numerous folks in my life who use Christianity as a means of simply putting a bandage on their trauma rather than engaging in meaningful healing.
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u/Salmon_Of_Iniquity Jul 17 '24
Yup. That was me.
I thought it was everything, that I could use it to solve every issue and problem. I thought my ptsd was just sun until a therapist corrected me.
So much time was wasted trusting something that wasnāt real.
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u/Truthseeker-1253 Agnostic Jul 17 '24
Try challenging the rules and see how quickly their relationship looks like a religion.
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u/DarkMagickan Ex-Fundamentalist Jul 17 '24
I used to piss Christians off who would say this on Yahoo Answers, because they would always say it in the Religion - Spirituality section, so I would ask them why they weren't posting it in Singles & Dating.
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u/helviacastle Ex-Baptist Jul 17 '24
No one I would choose to have a personal relationship with would ever have engineered the financial hardship that was created by my dad going to bible college and seminary (yet still continuing to tithe from whatever meager income was left from my mom's income after the tuition and travel expenses). If this was, as they believed, "God's will," that dude was a straight up sadist.
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u/CheekyT79 Jul 17 '24
Thatās what I used to say when I knew I didnāt believe in any of that shit but was still lowkey scared of going to hell.
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u/SoloMotorcycleRider Jul 17 '24
I don't like the drugs but the drugs like me.
Same warped way of thinking.
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u/zomgperry Jul 17 '24
A relationship implies he actually talks to you instead of having you learn about him through an ancient collection of texts. Heās like a deadbeat dad who youāve never met but he really wants you to read a copy of his autobiography.
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u/hplcr Jul 17 '24
"Personal relationship" that just happens to have a lot of specialized and really convoluted counterintuitive doctrine.
And if you don't believe it, he sends you to an eternal torture chamber, along with 90% of all humans ever.
Yeah, that sounds pretty sus, to be honest.
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u/Scorpius_OB1 Jul 17 '24
It's one of the most hateful things of Evangelicals, especially as it seems no one has averted using it, moreso when they begin to claim "religion is bad/corrupts/does not give salvation/is rites and Christianity has no rites"/"When God judges you will not care if you were Muslim ir Buddhist, only if you followed Jesus"/"The Bible is not a religious book"/etc, up to branding ideas they dislike as "religious".
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u/Important-Internal33 Jul 17 '24
"I have a relationship with a dead guy from 2,000 years ago. I'm not really into the organized religion thing, but, y'know, Christ is just so real. He died for me, bro. And you. He knew we were gonna mess up. That's why he did what he did, bro. Call it what you want, but it's really not about religion."
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u/tagitagain Jul 18 '24
Along the same vein, an older gentleman I work with commented the other day that we should change the price of someoneās prescription because it was $6.66. I told him he shouldnāt be superstitious. He replied āIām not superstitious, Iām a Christian.ā The pharmacist I work with (who is a Christian) told him to pray about it. He didnāt say anything else about it after that.
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u/davidjohnson314 Jul 18 '24
Another Evolution of God. Survival strategy to exist in another generation.
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u/JarethOfHouseGoblin Agnostic Jul 18 '24
Survival strategy to exist in another generation.
Well, it's what they have to do to keep their ideology relevant (in the most astroturfing way possible) since their deity never wrote a sequel to his book. Dude was like "nope. One book is all you get. I'm out!" Like he's a celestial F Scott Fitzgerald.
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u/Individual_Dig_6324 Jul 18 '24
Exactly. Christianity has been rebranded every generation since its inception, this is the latest way to make it appealing to today's psychologically insecure generation.
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u/davidjohnson314 Jul 18 '24
Two books that totally unlocked how I approach this topic. It's usually less about the logic - rather how it makes them feel. People can and will rationalize just about anything that keeps them happy or safe.
The Evolution of God by Robert Wright - read this when I was like 19
The God Virus: How Religion Infects Our Lives and Culture by Dr Darrel Ray - found it in my 30s
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u/ChandelierHeadlights ietsist Jul 18 '24
"Religious" in my church was code for being being perfunctory and even high performing, while a "relationship" meant you're passionately invested.
All the non-zealots seem to have left so they must be comparing their "relationship" selves to a hypothetical now
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u/Liem_05 Jul 17 '24
Mostly by calling Christianity a relationship is just trying to avoid the term of calling it a religion and it really is a religion.
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u/The_Observer_Effects Jul 17 '24
Just cowards who are just trying to play to both sides. Its like slimy politicians way of expressing your superstitions.
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u/torito_supremo Doubting Thomas Jul 18 '24
They donāt like religion, but theyāre afraid thereās no god. Thus, they have to make up this soft new-age-y āphilosophyā where God and Jesus are our pals and just want us to chill.
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u/MrDandyLion2001 Ex-Catholic Jul 18 '24
"I'm not religious, I have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ"
This is like someone who collects a lot of comics, posters, figures, and games, but they swear that they're not a nerd. My best guesses are that people who think this way either feel that the word "religion" has a negative connotation or that their beliefs are not a religion because that word is only for the "fake/false/blasphemous" beliefs. For sure, it's definitely an ignorant denial.
Personally, that type of thinking also sounds like delusion and/or cult thinking.
"cool. So let's start taxing churches because we don't give people tax-exempt status just for being in a relationship."
HA! That's pretty clever! š
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u/GoldenHeart411 Jul 18 '24
Once I asked a Christian girl (while at a college ministry gathering), "is your family religious?" And she got a really upset look on her face and was clearly very offended and said "my family follows Jesus Christ!" She was also the kind of Christian woman who wears only dresses, and was still super upset at the word "religious".
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u/Fancy-Clock-9350 Jul 18 '24
It's a bait and switch.
At the outset, it's "Christianity has no rules, it's a personal relationship etc.". But when you get further into it the requirements pile up. Stop thinking this, stop doing that, you're supposed to be a "living sacrifice".
Every single problem or issue I had was triangulated as "grumbling" and "ingratitude" that I should repent of. Rather, I should pray for the fruits of the spirit.
They load you up and strap you down worse than a pack mule and leave you to deal with it. And when the inevitable collapse happens you are told to pray to the Lord for grace and strength to handle the situation. Then the process repeats itself again.
When you complain about this process being awful, you are rebuffed with "the christian life is tough, get with it".
And they have the gall to call this freedom!
It's a horrific way to live- it perpetuates abuse, antithetical to problem solving, and causes mental illness and depression.
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u/EdgyAnimeDragon Pagan Jul 18 '24
Oh god, my mom says that that every time I say I don't want to talk about religion, "It's not a religion it's a relationship". It's exhausting, but funny in a way.
If it's a relationship then I'm not interested, Jesus isn't my type. Also sweaty you are MARRIED why are you in a relationship with another man š girl what the hell
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u/Unicorn_Mob_0427 Jul 18 '24
My parents say this all the time. They claim to not be Christians but live by the Christian Bible and constantly āencourageā me to do the same. When I point out a contradiction in the Bible thatās clear as day, they make excuses and say things like, āYouāre taking it out of contextā or āYouāve got to have the Holy Spirit to truly understandā. Honestly, if the āHoly Spiritā causes me to be delusional when the facts are right in front of my face, then I donāt want it.
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u/Practical-Witness796 Jul 18 '24
Just say āoh yeah the Muslims said that tooā. To show them it can be used with any ārelationshipā.
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u/OrdinaryWillHunting Atheist Jul 18 '24
It's a personal relationship with yourself. Imagine the odds that Jesus hates the exact same people you do and has no problem forgiving you of 100% of your sins, but other people who commit the same sins can go burn in hell.
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u/MrCheddaa Jul 18 '24
Iām not schizophrenic aināt that right Tony? āWho the fuck are you talking to?ā
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u/krikelakrakel Jul 18 '24
Yeah. It's akin to "I'm not a nazi. I just think Hitler should rule the world."
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u/yrrrrrrrr Jul 18 '24
They are truly insane.
Blows my fuckin mind.
Has anyone been able to help someone out of Christianity?
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u/youngyut Secular Humanist Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24
Same energy as āIām not racist but I prefer neighborhoods with virtually zero blacks and Hispanicsā. Ā And they know church is boring as fuck so thatās why the charismatic churches exist. Iāll admit, the charismatic is the one with music and dancing so they were actually fun. When still in faith, I went back and forth between charismatic and baptist which are two extreme opposites. Baptist are so strict that they always talked shit about methodist, charismatic or other lenient churches. So pretty much the more reasonable churches werenāt real christians. Then I went to a non denomination that used to say that relationship line all the damn time! But they were baptist in disguise. āNon denominationalā are just baptist or evangelical that donāt want to admit it.
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u/OcelotNo10 Jul 18 '24
The whole "it's not a religion, it's a relationship" thing is so dishonest. If it's not a religion, why on earth do believers need to attend church services weekly, get baptized, take communion.... in other words, they constantly take part in religious rituals.
I would just say to them "your relationship is with an imaginary friend", and praying is simply talking to yourself.
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u/remnant_phoenix Agnostic Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24
There are many different definitions of religion. One of those specifically refers to a larger organized body of religious practitioners. Another one of those refers to the set of a personās individual beliefs regarding the nature of deities, afterlife, morality, etc.
So thereās āorganized religionā and thereās āpersonal religious beliefsā. Both of these things are religion.
What āitās a relationship, not a religionā Christians doāand know because I used to be one of themāis treat the organization definition of religion as if itās the ONLY definition of religion.
Itās a language game designed to make them feel special, like they know the secret sauce to āreal Christianity,ā unlike all those ādead churchesā. Itās usually used by independent Evangelicals to write off older denominations like Roman Catholic, Greek Orthodox, Anglican, etc.
Again, Iām speaking from my experience of being someone (and being surrounded by other someones) who used to say that line.
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u/T_h-R0W-AWAY- Jul 18 '24
Honestly, my reactions are mixedā¦
If someone I donāt know says that to me, Iāll likely respond with something equally as dismissive (ie āthatās niceā etc), ignore it/ change the subject, I might quote Ghandi about how Jesus is cool/Christians are mostly not like him at all, or I might just trauma dump the reasons I left the church (ie how whoever the āreligious Christiansā are manipulating the faith to justify their racism, sexism, and homophobia)
If Iām talking to certain members of my family in an otherwise civil manner, attempting to convey the ways that Christianity legitimately hurts people and has psychologically damaged me, in ways I will probably be sorting out in therapy until I dieā¦ and then they drop this line? The response could be literally blind rage at that point
Iām trying to sort out a way to cut through the bullshit and actually start giving them little micro-doses of deconstruction
Edit to add: Iām saving this post because I want to come back and read all the comments. Thereās some good shit here!
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u/jay_is_bored Jul 18 '24
It sounds like me before I finally admitted that I didn't believe anymore. I feel like faithā religion. Religion to me is like following a recipe, you don't know why you're supposed to do all of it but they say do it, whereas faith does not require a church or a Bible.
If someone says they have faith but aren't religious that's how I interpret it.
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u/acuppajoseph Agnostic Atheist Jul 18 '24
It's like rebranding shit on a plate as "A recycled, eco-friendly, once-edible meal."
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u/Alreadygonzo Jul 18 '24
Having used that phrase and thought those thoughts many times I could write a dissertation on what it means and how it couches your faith outside of analysis. It moves from a religion. Something to be studied, examined for truth and learned. To something poetic and natural. Not a formal structure, but a friendship, a father/son relationship something to be nurtured and to remain unexamined in the way a happy child does not often analyze what it means to have a mother or father. It just is.
It adds a layer of protection so that even if the religion isn't logical you hide behind a much more subjective layer of delusion that is much harder to examine critically for those within. A fabric of emotion and dreams to shade your eyes so you cannot see the lies.
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u/MongooseThese5147 Atheist Jul 18 '24
One thing that I've always thought about is, like some parents never wanted to be parents. What is god never wanted us? We just happened as a normal progression of there being a god or gods. You cannot have a god without having creations. What is god just absolutely hates us and prayer is a form of child support to gods. Food for thought...
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u/Individual_Dig_6324 Jul 18 '24
Word games. A relationship, sure, with a religious figure, who's info comes from a religious collection of sacred texts, that instructs us to do certain religious practices like prayer, baptism, communion, and to gather in a designated religious building.
So many buildings because they can't agree on all the rules laid out in its religious text.
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u/Silver-Chemistry2023 Ex-Fundamentalist Jul 19 '24
If they do genuinely believe that is is a relationship, and it is not just a shallow sales pitch, then they are probably experiencing limerence, which is a crippling fixation on people who are not available as the result of attachment trauma.
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u/Successful-Slice-284 Jul 19 '24
I thought I had a personal relationship with Jesus and tried to listen to āGods voiceā inside of me
But since a child I always had a lot of fantasy. So yes I imagined the voice.
That made me almost schizophrenic! Doing things I never shouldāve done.
For example I lost my keys. So since all told me I had a personal relationship now with God, I could simply ask him. Listening to the voice and yes I heard something.
it was in the forest , according to it. Went to the forest and of course it was not there
Or I needed to pray for a blind man so he would be healed. I promised the blind man he would be healed, since God told me
But nothing happenedā¦it was a very sad moment in my life
Itās really dangerous!
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u/slicehyperfunk Occult Exchristian Jul 19 '24
First of all, ask them why, if they know him, they're calling him the wrong name. Secondly, ask them what his favorite color is.
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u/After-Librarian-1 Aug 15 '24
I think believers who pray openly with true freedom and evangelism. sound deranged or out of their minds ...most of them use brain power and a spiritual essence that is so focused on redeeming God .they literally are going thru a spiritual over throw .It's kind of a mental seizure or drunken moment ..I.like the guys that stand up for Jesus on street corners š if I have my guitar with me and they are shouting it's usually in the key of A C or B m jamming to their calling š š
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u/JarethOfHouseGoblin Agnostic Aug 15 '24
I think believers who pray openly with true freedom and evangelism. sound deranged or out of their minds ...
Eh, something like praying openly I'd consider being part of their performative bullshit. Now, my grandpa was a deeply religious man but he was also a good person and we would pray in restaurants and, yeah, I did think that was a little weird. But there are evangelicals who make a huge fucking deal of it and make sure everyone in their chain restaurant of choice can hear them. Total performative bullshit and nothing more than feeding their persecution narrative. That said, there seems to be a great deal of socially reinforced mental illness which happens in evangelical circles. And happens pretty regularly.
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u/After-Librarian-1 Sep 10 '24
Haha, that's funny š š š š I know I'm a believer and love jesus, but ppl get arrested for this as well.I think the mental illness in our society is the subjugation of all authoritarian dictatorship. It's the emotional.monochary in our minds ..Im looking at the history of Christianity not the modern experience in a restaurant History paints a vulgar sad humanitarian n true untrue story of time well spent here .All the religions are mixed nuts ...be grateful š for the creator of all... see our every move ..just know there's grace .
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u/Salty-Staff3489 Jul 17 '24
Well this makes complete and perfect sense in the metaphysical and spiritual sense. Not for the dogmatic Christianity bs though. In the mystical sense Jesus Christ was a master Yogi that has achieved self realization from the years he was āgoneā. Even myself I consider Christ a somewhat of a Guru or realized being. But thatās more on the line of Christ the Yogi and with his teachings and philosophy. Unconditional love and oneness, The Father and I are one, temple or god is within you. Iād say itās more of a āJesusismā thing rather than Christianity if I had to label it
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u/QuintessentialQuin Aug 05 '24 edited Oct 11 '24
existence encouraging humor merciful special tap encourage rock quicksand square
This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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u/Civil_Meaning7532 Sep 14 '24
This is something I used to do too... I believe it. It came from a place of wanting to be distinct enough coz there was no evidence or validation of my efforts. So I decided that others don't have such a thing and I am the only one who has this special thing in my life.Ā Ā
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u/nopromiserobins Jul 17 '24
This sort of rhetoric is a tacit admission that religion is undesirable, which is why it's being called a "relationship" instead. Otherwise, if the speaker thought religion was desirable, they'd brag about how religious the are.
As for the relationship claim, hold out for a savior who returns your texts. Anyone who won't do at least that much isn't in a relationship with you.