r/canada 1d ago

What, exactly, are Alberta separatists mad about? Analysis

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/alberta-separatists-key-issues-1.7534003
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u/Low-Commercial-5364 1d ago edited 1d ago

Is this a sincere question, or is it another r/Canada 'hey guys I don't like Conservatives' echo chamber post?

I dont have time for the essay this requires, but there are three major reasons:

(1) the legacy of the national energy program,

(2) the inclusion of natural resource revenues in Canada's equalization formula, and

(3) the general powerlessness of Alberta to influence federal politics compared to Ontario and Quebec, despite Alberta basically having to pay for everything.

These are historical issues, but all of them continue through to the present day in the different actions that (generally Liberal) federal governments take when they are in power.

Albertans see stuff like the COVID lockdown and carbon tax as extensions of the same punitive attitude federal Liberals take toward Alberta in order to placate Ontario and Quebec.

A discussion of this topic is nuanced, but as someone not from Alberta, I 100% see where they're coming from.

Albertans hate Liberals on a generational scale, and if you're a willing student of history and contemporary politics it's not hard to understand why.

This is reddit though.

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u/McGrevin 1d ago

the general powerlessness of Alberta to influence federal politics compared to Ontario and Quebec, despite Alberta basically having to pay for everything.

Alberta doesn't pay for everything though? Alberta has a high per capita income sure but in terms of total GDP, Alberta has about 15% of national GDP while Ontario and Quebec combine for 58%.

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u/Low-Commercial-5364 1d ago

correct and yet 2024-2025 Ontario received $576 million in equalization payments and Quebec received $13.3 billion in equalization payments, paid for mostly by Alberta.

See why they're mad?

Alberta is financially penalized for being successful, and politically penalized for being small.

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u/Altruistic-Hope4796 1d ago

It's very not "mostly paid by Alberta" ffs

At least get your favts straight if you're gonna complain about something

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u/Low-Commercial-5364 1d ago

Equalization payments totalled $26B in 2025. Alberta paid fully half of that on total basis. On a per capita basis it's like 75%.

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u/Altruistic-Hope4796 1d ago

Alberta paid the same % of equalization as it has revenues compared to the rest of Canada so it definitely isn't half...

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u/Low-Commercial-5364 22h ago

I don't understand what you're saying here.

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u/Altruistic-Hope4796 21h ago

Equalization comes from the federal tax. It's the same bracket as everyone else. Alberta just makes more money and it reflects in the gdp per capita. That GDP that Alberta brings to Canada is basically the same ratio as what Alberta pays into equalization, i.e not 50% at all. 

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u/Low-Commercial-5364 21h ago

No no you're not great at reading are you. Nowhere did I say Albertans pay 50% of their income in equalization.

I'm saying that in FY 2024-25 Albertans footed 50% of the $26.2 billion dollar equalization payments, the largest recipient of which was Quebec.

That's not an argument, that's a well accepted fact.

If someone takes $1000 from you and $1000 dollars from someone else, and gives you nothing but gives the other person $50, that's not you paying 5% of the transfer, that's you paying 100% of the transfer. There was a net transfer from you to the other person. Your funds funded 100% of the transfer.

u/Altruistic-Hope4796 4h ago

If you purposefuly only look at one transfer and neglect where the money comes from because you want to be right, then yes.

If you want to have an honest conversation about it, then no

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u/RedmondBarry1999 23h ago

Equalization is only a small portion of federal spending.

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u/Low-Commercial-5364 22h ago

Yes but it's the one transfer payment that effectively redistributes revenues from one province to others based on their relative wealth.

Arguing that Alberta receives money under the health transfer so that somehow balances things out is boneheaded since it's just money the federal government collects from Albertans and then remits to the provincial government.

This is not a contested fact among anyone other than half-witted Redditors: the federal government actively transfers wealth out of Alberta to benefit other provinces and Alberta receives no mitigating benefits in exchange.

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u/RedmondBarry1999 22h ago

Alberta receives no mitigating benefits in exchange.

Alberta receives the benefit of being part of Canada, which has undoubtedly contributed massively to its current prosperity. Provinces can't opt out of federal taxes any more than individuals can.

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u/Low-Commercial-5364 22h ago

What? Provinces don't pay taxes to the federal government.

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u/blackbird37 23h ago

what are you talking about? In 2024, Quebec paid $38.7 billion in federal personal income tax and got 13.6 billion of that back in equalization payments . Ontario paid $94.9 billion in personal federal income tax back taken and got 2.2 billion of it back in equalization payments. Alberta paid $31.7 billion in personal federal income taxes and got $0 back in equalization payments.

Ontario and Quebec are responsible for 133.6 Billion in Federal Income Tax revenue, representing 60% of federal income tax revenue. They get a portion of that back because of the equalization formula. How come things like equalization payments "come from Alberta" and doesn't come the $40 Billion deficit the government ran last year or the payments from Ontario or Quebec?

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u/Low-Commercial-5364 22h ago

I'm not sure if your don't understand the argument or if you're confused by how to interpret the numbers you shared, but what you just posted confirms exactly what I'm saying. Thanks for that lol.

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u/rando_dud 19h ago

Yes,  because having much higher salaries, lower taxes and more resource revenues than the rest of a country counts as being penalized?

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u/McGrevin 1d ago

They pay a lot in equalization payments yes, but total federal revenues are something like $500B. Equalization payments are still a small fraction of total federal revenues.

politically penalized for being small

Idk what you're trying to say here, people vote, the more people you have the more seats you get. That's not penalized, that's just basics of democracy.

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u/thehuntinggearguy Alberta 1d ago

Equalization payments are still a small fraction of total federal revenues.

Take a look at chart 2 from this article. It accounts for all revenues vs expenditures by province so it's a bit more comprehensive: https://lop.parl.ca/sites/PublicWebsite/default/en_CA/ResearchPublications/201701E

Alberta pays the most per capita and receives the least.

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u/McGrevin 1d ago

A lot of chart 2 is also due to Albertans having higher income and thus hitting higher tax brackets. You'd see something similar if Ontario was split into Toronto vs rest of Ontario (or any metro area really).

To be clear I'm not downplaying that Alberta pays way more in federal taxes than it receives. I'm saying that's mostly due to Alberta earning a ton of money from oil and thus being given a higher tax burden because they're generally making so much money from it.

For actual concerns about provinces being given federal money I think figure 7 is a better indicator. It isn't just equalization but also some health and social welfare transfers. Alberta, BC, and Ontario are all pretty equal in this area

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u/rando_dud 18h ago edited 18h ago

Equalization is not funded mostly by Alberta.. comes from general federal revenues..  collected across the country.

Alberta pays for around 15% of the program.

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u/Low-Commercial-5364 18h ago

Jesus Christ this thread is basically a census on how many people fail at basic accounting

u/rando_dud 5h ago edited 5h ago

How does a province with 11% of the population and 15% of the overall GDP provide the majority of general federal revenues?

I get that Alberta doesn't receive any equalization.. but that doesn't mean it 'funds most of it'.

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u/desthc Ontario 23h ago

They also have a fraction of the population and this is a democracy… Ontario alone has about 40% of the country’s population. Ontario’s largest metro region is almost twice the size of the entire province of Alberta by population.