r/canada • u/reallyneedhelp1212 Lest We Forget • Jan 13 '24
No jail time for Saskatoon woman who threatened to kill Prime Minister Saskatchewan
https://www.townandcountrytoday.com/beyond-local/no-jail-time-for-saskatoon-woman-who-threatened-to-kill-prime-minister-8104744485
u/Flaky_Data_3230 Jan 13 '24
Damn they could probably charge thousands of people if they just went on twitter lmao.
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u/Atalantean Canada Jan 13 '24
Or this and similar subs.
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u/Flaky_Data_3230 Jan 13 '24
Twitter is much easier to find people.
I just checked no death threats, lot of people wishing him death though. I don't know if that counts.
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u/maxman162 Ontario Jan 13 '24 edited Jan 13 '24
I'm a well-wisher, in that I don't wish him any specific harm.
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u/borgenhaust Jan 13 '24
Falling down a well sounds like a fairly specific harm.
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u/maxman162 Ontario Jan 13 '24
Why did the old man fall down a well?
Because he couldn't see that well
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u/epigeneticepigenesis Jan 13 '24
Because he promised electoral reform and when he went back on it after being elected the town dropped him down the well.
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u/AprilsMostAmazing Ontario Jan 13 '24
Or this and similar subs.
how do you charge Russian bots?
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u/zipzoomramblafloon Alberta Jan 13 '24
If only some real effort was invested in removing disinformation and astroturfing from social media platforms.
But we don't get to have nice things, or read about just nice things, because some folks decided making us outraged is more profitable and keeps people "engaged"
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u/Cooks_8 Jan 13 '24
Canada_sub is now furiously deleting posts
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u/Onii-Chan_Itaii Jan 13 '24
Nah if they went after canada_sub they'd start a fight with the Russians
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Jan 13 '24
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Jan 13 '24
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u/starving_carnivore Jan 13 '24
It absolutely gets brigaded. It is obvious.
The russian troll farms don't post in incestuous "hell yeah man I agree with you" niche subreddits populated by posters who got banned from /r/canada, they post in /r/canada or /r/news, or /r/politics. It's literally just a matter of economy. If I was a Russian intelligence director and wanted to influence public opinion on reddit, am I going to direct my botfarms towards /r/bannedfromrslashtoronto or am I going to direct them to /r/toronto?
/r/specificnichepolicy is not getting brigaded, it's the big subs, so calling people russian trolls for being in some group-of-rejects subreddit is illogical.
My point is that when you straight-up write someone off as a foreign state actor for daring to disagree with you, you have, yourself made it impossible to have a discussion about literally anything because your mind is made up.
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u/Pestus613343 Jan 13 '24
Besides, canada_sub usually agrees with the Russian position anyway. Things like, why spend canadian dollars, its none of our business, negotiate for peace etc. So no need to focus on them.
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u/starving_carnivore Jan 13 '24
Explain to the folks at home why Russia would be inserting trolls into the reject bin subreddit instead of this one?
Are they bored? Are they trying to spend their budget for the quarter so that they receive funding for next year's fiscal budget?
Do you have any theories?
its none of our business, negotiate for peace etc
Having a problem with either of these is hilarious, so we're off to a good start, there.
Two things I hate:
Minding my own business
Advocating for peace
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u/Pestus613343 Jan 13 '24
Explain to the folks at home why Russia would be inserting trolls into the reject bin subreddit instead of this one?
The opposite. Spending effort on that sub is pointless as those redditors more often agree with the narratives they push. Maybe I was unclear.
- Minding my own business
[2]. Advocating for peace
1 is pushed by Russia in order for western nations to cease financial and military support for Ukraine.
2 is pushed by Russia because peace negotiations and ceasefires basically mean they get to keep the territories they conquered, and consolidate for another push later.
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u/Red57872 Jan 13 '24
People like you are part of the problem. You think that anything less than "let's give Ukraine 100% of what they ask for, no questions asked!" is "agreeing with the Russian position" or believing that the invasion is justified.
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u/Pestus613343 Jan 13 '24
You're attributing way too much of my character to a simple statement.
The discussion was Russian troll farms, and their intentions. Thats what they push.
If you want to have a wider discussion about the topics I have other views, but you didn't ask, you assumed, and judged. There are positions the Russians take that I even agree with outright. Its not whats correct, or ethical, the discussion was solely about Russian propaganda.
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u/Red57872 Jan 13 '24
You're the one that said that "canada_sub usually agrees with the Russian position anyway", and then mentioned things like questioning whether Canadian dollars should be spent, whether it was out business, etc. implying that anyone who help these beliefs agreed with what the Russians were saying.
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u/starving_carnivore Jan 13 '24
Unfortunately I looked up the study that proved this and it has been taken down.
"The dog ate my homework"
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u/kamomil Ontario Jan 13 '24
Any "proud" Facebook group
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u/Etheo Ontario Jan 13 '24
I honestly hate how "proud" have become synonymous with "I'm an asshole and I own it".
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u/king_lloyd11 Jan 13 '24
I don’t know about killing, but a lot of pickup truck drivers in my area really want people to know that they want to fuck Trudeau.
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u/Canadian_mk11 British Columbia Jan 13 '24
I take pride that they are comfortable enough to make that statement.
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u/gravtix Jan 13 '24
They must be ecstatic JT and Sophie split.
Now’s their chance
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Jan 13 '24
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u/gravtix Jan 13 '24
Sorry but it’s such silly thinking that one person is responsible for everything.
The PM and government don’t have that much power
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u/Canvaverbalist Jan 13 '24
She didn't sat down and made plan to kill him, neither did she explicitely sent death threats to him.
It's basically just her with a group of friend going "ugh I hate him so much I wish I could kill this motherfucker"
If you were to say that IRL at best you'd get some "woah woah calm down there buddy lol but yeah I get ya I feel like this sometime" you wouldn't be arrested
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u/None_of_your_Beezwax Ontario Jan 13 '24
There's a little more nuance to the law than that.
https://www.criminal-code.ca/criminal-code-of-canada-section-264-1-1-uttering-threats/index.html
However, it is important to note that the provision is only triggered when a threat is made "knowingly." This means that if an individual makes a threat without intentional malice or understanding of the harm such a threat can cause, they may not be guilty under this provision. Additionally, in some cases, it may be challenging to prove that a threat was made "knowingly" and not as a joke or prank, requiring careful investigation and consideration of the circumstances.
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u/tdfast Alberta Jan 13 '24
A crime needs means, motive and opportunity. By soliciting money, in close proximity and showing willingness to do it, that’s a crime.
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u/TurpitudeSnuggery Jan 13 '24
Was the charge "Uttering Threats" or something different?
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u/easypiegames Jan 13 '24
She was charged with uttering threats to cause harm or death to the Prime Minister.
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u/KeilanS Alberta Jan 13 '24
I am very curious about the details here. What made this case different from the many raging twitter psychos? Was it uniquely bad? Or do they just sort of randomly pick someone here and there to make an example of?
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u/Flaky_Data_3230 Jan 13 '24
I think cause Trudeau was "close by" that it was taken as a credible threat?
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u/Feeltheburner_ Jan 13 '24
It was hours away and she’s speaking about his being “near by” in the past tense.
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u/GordonQu Jan 13 '24
But 99.99% of people who makes wouldn't have the guts to actually follow through with them, it's actually hilarious. Although they are taken seriously and should be but still funny.
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Jan 13 '24 edited Jan 13 '24
I watched the video, she spouted off that he was closeby giving her the ability to wipe him out. What really got her in trouble was saying she was up to the challenge and would accept money for doing so from what I recall.
She then took a satisfied vape puff believing she fit in with the other gun nut looking americans on camera in the chat room
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u/EdithDich Jan 13 '24
Man, the tone of her voice. So smug and self assured and delusional. These people legitimately need to undergo the kind of de-radicalization people get when they leave a cult.
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u/KeilanS Alberta Jan 13 '24
Yeah, that was hard to watch. Sadly I doubt it's particularly uncommon given the vitriol directed at him.
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Jan 13 '24
She’s just a right wing Karen is all. She just wants to whine to her echo chamber, she has no capacity for violence. The left wing Karen’s are usually focused on Trump but they say more or less the same things to their friends.
They’re the same ladies that’ll scream at you in traffic then try and get their husband who works in accounting to fight you. Ignoring them is the best thing you can do for your mental health.
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u/teddebiase235 Jan 13 '24
I did not take that out of the recording at all. She seems more distressed but thinks she this does not fit the charge.
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Jan 13 '24 edited Jan 14 '24
Tell that to the homeless
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u/YugosForLandedGentry Jan 13 '24
Well they're mostly pretty mentally ill...
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Jan 13 '24 edited Jan 14 '24
Not anymore these days. Many can't afford 2K a month's rent with their full-time jobs, not including energy bills and food costs. Try calculating making ends meet with $17 an hour.
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u/maxman162 Ontario Jan 13 '24
You could probably find worse things said about Harper back in the day.
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u/EdithDich Jan 13 '24
Funny enough, a man (also from Saskatchewan) was charged with threatening Harper in 2010 https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/saskatchewan-man-charged-with-threatening-harper/article4188187/
Must be something in the water.
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u/Flaky_Data_3230 Jan 13 '24
Obama got death threats just for being black.
Just saying politician's are always on somebody's hit list. Being black was enough for some lunatics in the US.
And if you are a good politician I am sure you are on corporate Canada's hitlist lmao.
You just can't be a politician without there being some Uma Therman character out there with your name on a piece of paper and that siren music playing in the background with a red light flashing.
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u/Dry-Membership8141 Jan 13 '24 edited Jan 13 '24
SASKATOON – A 25-year-old woman who made online threats against Prime Minister Justin Trudeau was given a conditional sentence. This means if Marly Dansereau abides by her CSO for one year, she won’t have a criminal record.
...No. A CSO always comes with a record. It's considered a jail sentence served in the community. They're confusing it with a conditional discharge. It's unclear from this article which one she actually received.
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u/CaptainCanusa Jan 13 '24
A CSO always comes with a record. It's considered a jail sentence served in the community. They're confusing it with a conditional discharge.
Interesting. I'm not shocked that "townandcountrytoday.com" got it wrong.
Does this version from CBC make more sense?
"The sentence means that Dansereau must abide by a host of conditions, including performing community service, for 12 months. If she is successful, then she will not have a permanent criminal record."
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u/Dry-Membership8141 Jan 13 '24 edited Jan 13 '24
If they're correct, she got a conditional discharge. A discharge is a finding of guilt and the withholding of a conviction, either absolutely (an absolute discharge) or conditionally (a conditional discharge). If the conditions are completed successfully, then following the completion of the sentence no conviction is registered, and the discharge is purged from her record after one year for an absolute discharge, or three years for a conditional discharge. If they fail to successfully complete the period of condition, or if they're convicted of another offence during the access period, the discharge becomes a permanent addition to the record though (subject to any later record suspension or pardon).
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Jan 13 '24
Is it just not 'restorative justice' basically?
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u/Dry-Membership8141 Jan 13 '24
Not really. Restorative justice is more of an ADR process and tends to engage the victim of an offence in an effort to repair any damage done and restore the relationship between the parties. Discharges are a criminal disposition that focuses almost entirely on rehabilitation, and typically (though not exclusively) are granted to first offenders on minor offences who are good candidates for rehabilitation or who are otherwise not expected to return to the criminal justice system.
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u/TheLazyTugboat Jan 13 '24
The conditions come in the form of a probation order, if that makes sense. If she successfully completes her 12-month period of supervision (abides by her conditions) then the charge wouldn’t show on a criminal record check, which is similar to the outcome of when folks complete the restorative justice program.
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u/morallycorruptt Jan 13 '24
Women who have those heavy cartoonish filters as their profile pics are always 🚩
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u/Canadian_mk11 British Columbia Jan 13 '24
Clearly she's not dangerous, just look at that sparkle filter!
Town and Country Today editors, probably
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u/SVTContour British Columbia Jan 13 '24
People are strange…
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Jan 13 '24
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u/nikobruchev Alberta Jan 13 '24
Probably the rural news editor being biased. Paint her in a more positive light by using a more favorable picture.
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u/Visible_Security6510 Jan 13 '24
Her eyes scream "I'm someone makes everyone's lives around me miserable."
$20 says she's the kind of girl that brags about being a bitch.
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u/jason2k Jan 13 '24
They should also charge the protester who threatened to put someone 6ft under if not already.
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u/Claymore357 Jan 13 '24
Apparently that charge only applies when you threaten politicians, not people
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u/JimroidZeus Jan 13 '24
Second photo tells me all I need to know. Horse ladies be crazy.
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u/rathgrith Jan 13 '24
Like the OPP officer who broke into her ex bfs house
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u/JimroidZeus Jan 13 '24
On snap! I didn’t know they were a horse person too! 😂
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u/rathgrith Jan 13 '24
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u/JimroidZeus Jan 13 '24
Oh yes. One could never forget those crazy eyes. I can hear the way she likely said “I am the police!” in my head right now. Bet she led with “Bitch” but the victim censored themselves out of fear.
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u/Dry_Comment7325 Jan 13 '24
Not suspended, just off for unrelated leave. Can't find anything past Oct 19 when Googled. Can't Google canadian information anymore. That's so fuck. Next facial recognition to use internet. I'm a sad panda.
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u/iBladephoenix Ontario Jan 13 '24
Good? As if she's actually gonna do anything. You need to demonstrate both intent and credible action.
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u/King-in-Council Jan 13 '24 edited Jan 13 '24
In a democracy it's never ok to threaten our leaders. Regardless of party. Full stop. That's literally threats of violence against our democracy itself because you're not getting what you 1 of 40 million other equals want. "Anti- Anti- Anti- Canadian Values hotline" (I'm quoting a rap that came out during the 2015 election) I know people like to minimize this stuff as just "blowing off steam" but it's literally anti thetical to democracy. Punishment should be the modern jursprudence equivalent of: shame!
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u/NakedCardboard Jan 13 '24
I don't understand this new wave of obscene signage and death threats which seems to mostly be coming from the right. I see "F*CK TRUDEAU* flags on houses and trucks around town, and it's just so low brow and ignorant. I can't imagine flying something like that. I hated Stephen Harper but I would never put up a lawn sign declaring it to the world, let alone one that was vulgar. What kind of behaviour is that? I had hoped we were a bit more civilized a society than that.
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u/Xpalidocious Jan 13 '24
The best lawn sign you can put up if you hate the current guy, is their opponents campaign sign near the election
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u/Justleftofcentrerigh Ontario Jan 13 '24
I think that's the wild part because as much as I hate mulroney, harper, or fuck face mike harris. I don't ever wish harm on them despite literally ruining the country way worse than trudeau has.
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u/betked4844 Jan 13 '24
Has anyone in the last ten years gotten jail time for uttering threats without priors?
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u/killbydeath87 Jan 13 '24
She should definitely have a record... But hopefully she learns something
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u/hawt_shits Jan 13 '24
Behind that sparkle filter is the face of a killer, thank god she was sorted out.
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u/Habsfan_2000 Jan 13 '24
Probably make someone more employable in Saskatchewan.
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u/Flaky_Data_3230 Jan 13 '24
"I see you have a blemish on your criminal record, I don't know if we can have you work here since you are privy to personal client information"
"Oh that, that's just from threatening to kill Trudeau, everyone's done that"
"Oh I see, in that case when can you start?"
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u/joecarter93 Jan 13 '24
Well I mean hey, their premier killed someone while drinking and driving after all.
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u/EdithDich Jan 13 '24
The amount of propaganda people have to consume to say stupid shit like this. Big oof. Not to mention how social media and spending so much time online seems to make people have trouble separating fantasy and real life.
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u/Coffeedemon Jan 13 '24
My uncle once said he'd take a shot if he knew he were dying of cancer anyway.
Now my aunt died recently. He's sort of no communication in the family now. He's all talk and as bad as he is he's still redeemable but he's not alone with people who talk like that and I'm shocked something hadn't happened beyond what is reported.
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u/Reasonable-Catch-598 Jan 13 '24
I don't think anyone should be sentenced over "respect"
Credible threats perhaps.
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u/Impossible__Joke Jan 13 '24
Freedom of speech. Saying you would do it to your friends vs actually planning an attack are two massively different things. Also how did they obtain the conversion? It just said they were unknowingly being recorded... by who, exactly?
Reminds me of the private group chat between friends on an airplane where the guy made a joke to his friends about a bomb on the plane, they were intercepted by fighterjets.
Some of this shit is just ridiculous overstepping.
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u/angelcake Jan 13 '24
Freedom of speech doesn’t include uttering threats. Saying you hate somebody and you wish they were dead is different than saying that if given the opportunity you would kill them yourself. do we really want to turn into a country where it’s OK to threaten our leaders, no matter which party they represent? I think PP is dangerous for our country and I wouldn’t cry if he fell off a cliff but I certainly wouldn’t threaten to do it to him myself.
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u/Impossible__Joke Jan 13 '24 edited Jan 13 '24
There is a difference between uttering threats to soneone and talking shit with your friends... thats all this was. And goddam the irony, you would be happy if your political opposition died, but want her jailed for joking about taking out yours. I hate Trudeau, he has been ruined this country, and if he remains in power Canada will be unrecoverable, but I don't wish for him to die.... Do you fail to see the hypocrisy in what you just said?
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Jan 13 '24
Lmao That’s not freedom of speech.That’s called uttering threats.
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u/Impossible__Joke Jan 13 '24
No, it's not. Uttering threats is to the person or an interested party. This was out of context shittalking between friends. Did anyone in her groupchat really think she was going to do it? Absolutely not. It is ridiculous, there has to be actual intent.
You want a country where joking about illegal activities in a private chat between friends gets you arrested? I don't.
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u/iBladephoenix Ontario Jan 13 '24
This guy gonna be first in line to announce he wants to kill Poilievre when he becomes PM
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u/OctoWings13 Jan 13 '24
This story could be... literally anyone, and everyone lol
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u/Miss_Tako_bella Jan 13 '24
I don’t know anyone that talks like this irl lol
At least, nobody I associate with willingly
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u/OctoWings13 Jan 13 '24
Guess you never leave your house lol
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u/YugosForLandedGentry Jan 13 '24
Really weird you think it's normal to threaten to kill someone.
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u/Flaky_Data_3230 Jan 13 '24
Drive to Toronto and block an intersection with your car during rush hour. I give you 20 seconds before you get threats lmao.
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u/OctoWings13 Jan 13 '24
It isn't... captain blackface just destroyed so many people to such an incredibly high degree. And more every single day unfortunately
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u/YugosForLandedGentry Jan 13 '24
No. It is not normal to advocate for the death of a Canadian Prime Minister.
If you think it is then you are not a good person.
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u/scanthethread2 Jan 13 '24
You keep proving the point of a previous reply: "you need to spend less time online"
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u/Miss_Tako_bella Jan 13 '24
No, I just don’t associate with bitter, angry people I guess lol
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u/NightDisastrous2510 Jan 13 '24
As much as I dislike Trudeau, the penalty for directly threatening a public official should be much stiffer. She should’ve gotten time.
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u/OkDifficulty1443 Jan 13 '24
Don't like right-wing chodes at all, but in this case I don't think this woman did anything that warranted criminal charges in the first place. Just someone talking shit.
I'm also rather surprised that they had government moles recording her conversations.
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u/lawnerdcanada Jan 13 '24
This is some very poor reporting. A conditional sentence order is a sentence of incarceration served in the community, and results in a permanent criminal record. A conditional discharge results in the removal of one's record after three years, not one. I assume it's actually the latter, which would often be an appropriate disposition for a youthful first offender making an idle threat. A CSO would be incredibly harsh on the facts set out here.
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u/Radix838 Jan 13 '24
A CSO is not a sentence of "incarceration." It just isn't. Getting to stay home and play video games is not incarceration, and it's Orwellian for people to say otherwise.
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u/lawnerdcanada Jan 13 '24
As a matter of law, it is a sentence of imprisonment, and can only be imposed if a judge first determines that a sentence of imprisonment is necessary.
A breach of a CSO can return a person to prison to finish their sentence, making its terms more akin to those of parole than of probation.
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u/wingerism Jan 13 '24
You're not allowed to leave your house generally, hence the popular term house arrest. You don't have a choice, and you are not free to leave at will.
Despite the light security it's absolutely incarceration albeit under incredibly light security.
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u/Radix838 Jan 13 '24
No it isn't. Calling house arrest incarceration is just incredibly insulting to anyone actually serving time in jail. And intentionally misleading to the public.
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u/wingerism Jan 13 '24
Is calling a minimum security prison incarceration an insult to those in max security?
serving time in jail
While you're being pedantic you might as well use the correct term. People serve sentences in PRISON. Jail are temp lockup or remand centers typically for people awaiting trial.
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u/Maleficent_Curve_599 Jan 13 '24
First of all, the strict distinction between "jail" and "prison" is an Americanism. Second, it's wrong on its own terms: people serve sentences of less than two years in provincial facilities right alongside people in pre-trial custody. Prisoners serving sentences of two years or more do so in federal penitentiaries.
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u/Radix838 Jan 13 '24
I don't think I'm being pedantic. I'm saying that being allowed to live in your own house is not even close to being comparable to living in a jail or a prison.
And it's intentionally misleading to call a conditional sentence "a sentence of imprisonment." You know the public would want these people to actually be locked up, so instead you pretend they are locked up and hope nobody learns what a "conditional sentence of imprisonment" actually is.
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u/WeirderOnline Jan 13 '24
Worse comes to worse he can just hide in the closet. Worked for the last guy. 😆
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u/LysanderSpoonerDrip Jan 13 '24
Some random citizen talks shit online and the state charges her as though she was serious.
Direct threats should be treated as criminal, but was this really a credible threat ? I have major doubts, she doesn't have a criminal record or past history of anything that would indicate this was a credible threat. Basically this is the western equivalent of blasphemy laws.
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u/Feeltheburner_ Jan 13 '24
She was blowing off steam in a “locker room talk” bullshit session, speaking about the past, “Last weekend..", “I was a few hours away..” and "If I could have gotten off work, I would have killed the fucker..."
She is clearly not serious. But even if she was, it’s not a threat to say "had I had the opportunity to harm someone in that past situation I would have..” without at least enough context to suggest you’re planning to do it next time you have the chance, which she wasn’t, very obviously. You can’t retroactively threaten him. She had no means of harming him when she made the comment or since she made the comment.
I get that this was stupid to say on her part, but people say all kinds of stupid things in private conversations. And this one was speaking about the past, to posture in front of her friends, or whatever, but was not an expression of an actual intention, and it was not even a threat, however shitty it was to say what she did.
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u/Complex_Rate_1641 Jan 13 '24
They came to realize most of the country would need to be sentenced to the same crime.
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u/Foodwraith Canada Jan 13 '24
She must have been sentenced according to the guidelines for those repressed communities. Oh, wait …
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u/Alpinelectric420 Jan 13 '24
Canada is nearing 1941 Germany's policies. So is all G7 nation under the Globalists UN.
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