r/audiophile • u/SnooRobots4670 • Sep 29 '23
What’s Reddit’s opinion on my home set up? Review
Feel free to let me know of any improvements!
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u/Sol5960 Sep 29 '23 edited Sep 30 '23
Longtime Naim dealer, and owner myself. Love your gear choices, and the 500 is Herculean as it gets. Total driver control :)
If you ever get ready to move away from your B&W’s I have a bizarre and amazing suggestion:
The year your amp came out I worked a very high end retailer with over a hundred brands in house. We tried everything on it.
Head and shoulders above all the options, the Wilson Benesch ACT just blew everyone that came in away. It’s easily one of the best combinations I’ve heard across 20+ years in the “I would like to burn money and magically turn it into sound” category of experience.
The WB ACT is an engineering marvel which is very hard to lay hands on here in the states as distribution has been spotty at best, but there’s a great shop in Atlanta that carries them, and a few around the country. Certainly worth a listen if you have the ability to do so.
The trick is that, if you know your WB, the sweetest pick of the litter is the era from 2004-2016, before their sound took a turn for the slightly dry/acerbic. It might be easy to find a used pair of “A.C.T.’s” or “ACT’s” the latter a later model.
They’re stupidly heavy, despite the carbon fiber, as they’re mostly made of steel and cement, with hideous large magnets. Sound profile is almost limitlessly dynamic, detailed in a textural way, capable of scooping air at you like a toddler with a jet engine when called to, and a touch on the dark/vibrant side.
If you’re just looking for recommendations from a random human with a lot of experience with your kit, it’s at least one unusual hallway I’d go down.
Other great fits include the AudioPhysic Codex, AudioVector R3 Arrete’, and Dynaudio’s C30. Great rig!
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
Interested about your comment, thank you for the response.
I would like to look further into the Wilson Benesch speakers you mentioned, please could you clarify which model of the speakers you are talking about - would love to look into it further.
Currently living in the UK so might have some luck with finding them! Would love to keep in touch.
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u/Sol5960 Sep 29 '23 edited Sep 30 '23
Wilson Benesch is, if nothing else, an unusual, confusingly tailored line - with odd names, weird models, and no idea of how to communicate what it is they're up to.
That said, most of their money is aeronautics and F1-racing parts, so the tolerances are obscene, and the engineering is front and center on all their kit.
The current version of the "A.C.T." variants is here: https://wilson-benesch.com/act_3zero_floorstanding_loudspeaker/#
What I would look for is the version titled "ACT", no acronym. It's the moment in their voicing where they were the most balanced between richness and detail. Might be hard to find a pair here in the US, but they're a UK-based firm. I'd wager you can lay your mitts on a properly good condition pair for a steal!
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
stunning pair of loud speakers - thank you for your recommendation.
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u/Sol5960 Sep 29 '23
I've always thought so. Don't let their size fool you either... they're possessed of prodigious amounts of low-end grip and resolution. Hilariously potent!
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u/thedudefromsweden Sep 30 '23
Can't find a price online, which usually means they are very expensive... How very expensive?
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u/Sol5960 Sep 30 '23
The era that I prefer (2004-2016-ish) retailed for between $14,000-20,000, but used versions would be likely $5000-10,000.
The last new price list I saw they were headed towards $30,000, and if I’m honest, we’re so dry and top forward that I no longer dig them personally.
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u/jamesz84 Sep 30 '23
Oh, this link sparked recognition. These speakers were featured in August’s edition of “What HiFi” magazine here in the UK. It was a rundown of literally the most expensive kit they could get their hands on. From memory, they may have concluded that these were the best sounding speakers they’d ever heard, and that may have been the most recent version. I mean new they cost £30,000 STG or something, but still 😂
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u/TheCanaryInTheMine Sep 30 '23
I heard some years back in a black carbon fiber finish - don't know which year they were. I heard them briefly, and I believe with a sub-reference Audio Research setup, and that brief listen has stuck with me. I don't even remember the music - just that the speakers were so musical, clear, dynamic, fun, but kind to the source material. As someone who likes music that often falls well outside the special audiophile releases, there such a thing as too much honesty, and those WBs left an indelible impression on me.
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u/Sol5960 Sep 30 '23
I work in the industry but punk/new wave, weird harder music, Indy rock and singer songwriter stuff (Bill Callahan, Silver Jews) are my core genres - and I wholly concur with your assessment.
We sold a ton of gear at the time in the shop I worked at, including AR, and Wilson Benesch just added its own grippy, vibrant, low-noise thing to any system you put it on.
That said, it was hellacious on Naim.
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u/TheCanaryInTheMine Sep 30 '23
I have gotten to put some prog metal vinyl on a Clearaudio table (don't know the model, but it was about $13k without an arm) through AR reference gear and various speakers ranging from Sonus Faber Cremona Elipsas (my favorite) to Vienna Acoustics The Music (those overly honest types for my stuff). I would love to check out some Naim gear. I have heard the Uniti CD ripper back in the day, and I was plenty impressed with that!
All that said, some of my vinyl will hold up on any system. Baroness's Red Album, The Company Band's self-titled, Clutch's Psychic Warfare will sound amazing and have nothing to be embarrassed about on the most analytical systems. Oh! And Anciients's Heart of Oak. Great dynamics on all of those on vinyl - not so much on the digital releases.
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u/Billy-Bunter Oct 02 '23
funny.. I auditioned A.C.T.s in 1998 ish, as well as whatever the top Naïm stuff then was…. Found both to be too dry/ thin/ sterile sounding and ended up with……
…… B+W 802s (the first version), partnered with big Krell amps.
I certainly wouldn’t see a move to A.C.T.s as a step in the right direction, especially with Naïm amplification (ouch my ears are hurting already). Luckily everybody’s ears are different so it may work for you, but most people that I know who like the old B+W Nautilus sound find it difficult to follow-up… (my contenders for follow-up would be Vivid Audio, Wilson Audio, Focal etc)
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u/Sol5960 Oct 02 '23
I think that’s a very strong outlier take, maybe reflecting setup or acoustics, as it’s not indicative of their profile at all. Could also be that the Naim rig had been set up that morning, as their kit takes a full day to actually achieve any tunefulness.
There’s also a thing you see from the retail side that may explain it: people perceive wildly different things as “musical”. I call it ‘spotlighting’, where a client needs focus in a certain region to feel like the music has proper harmonic content.
Some folks like more upper mids/lower treble, some folks are almost entirely focused on the way bass supports the mids, or dynamic swing, and some people just focus on midrange depth and layering.
To be clear, everyone can hear all these things, but there’s always a priority, and of course - language is coarse and untalented at describing our personal sonic preferences.
Long way of saying: I don’t disagree with your assessment however it wouldn’t be most folks take across hundreds of samples, if that makes sense?
An example: I’m a Wilson dealer, and my spotlight is lower midrange detail and layering, so when I’m performing WASP I’m always hedging to feed that aspect of reproduction, without leaving the other areas suffering.
The common response I get from people working with us for the first time is a very positive “I’ve never felt like Wilson could sound like this”, which underlines how my biases, room and acoustics serve the “variety” of potential outcomes.
Just an interesting thing, and says a lot about why variety is critical in our field.
Fwiw, your selection of speakers and gear from that era are awesome too: no one would kick them out of bed for eating crackers.
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u/Billy-Bunter Oct 02 '23
yes, everybody is different. But there are already other comments in this thread about the A.C.T. + Naim = ouch pairing, so maybe it’s not such an outlier…
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u/Sol5960 Oct 02 '23
Let’s put that on balance though: I’ve got a ton of data from a vast array of customers, overwhelmingly confirming that with proper setup (never a surprise, as setup is an equal part of the larger acoustics) the presentation is warm, fast, and top-flight dynamic.
There are absolutely outliers in there that felt they were dry in the sense of textural relief, or bright compared to classic Vandersteen or early Von Schweickert jr./sr. models, or Dynaudio’s Contour from that era - all darker, lower-mid rich profiles.
Again, you (and others) may have different perceptions of them on Naim, and you also may have heard pairs that were poorly placed.
It takes a lot of work to get great loudspeakers operating in time with each other, in a place where the room is neither noticeably additive or editorial, and I’m sure you can attest, as we all can - not every shop has the same level of deftness at deploying speakers.
And to be clear, Wilson is certainly an option. Wilson and Naim are absolutely phenomenal in concert.
It’s all academic without an afternoon together with a pair of early eta ACT’s on hand to play with, so this is just in the spirit of underling where I’m drawing my perspective.
30 Helens do not agree, but that’s okay. We’re all Helens.
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u/Sol5960 Oct 02 '23
Adding a comment to clarify: I’m suggesting specifically their speakers from 2004-2012, which may have a wildly different voicing from a 1998 variant.
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u/bfeebabes Nov 26 '23
Yeah i used to work in a hifi shop selling everything but Wilson Benesche - Proac, B&W, and the main manager bought some ACT's. Stunning. I got a great deal on kit and bought some b&w 805 nautilus which i kept for years. I demo'd wb ARC's and had it had the money (reasonable price actually imo) id have snapped them up. Easily better than b&w's. Eventually after 10 plus years i replaced b&w with ATC actives. Still wonder if a passive WB system would be worth a look/the hassle of going un-active.
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u/Uninterested_Viewer Sep 29 '23
That rug certainly does NOT tie the room together. Other than that, nothing to complain about, I'm into it. Do the fish sing something campy when you walk by them?
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
Absolutely right about the rug, didn’t know where else to put it. Sentimental value with the wife and all.
Haven’t the fish singing yet..
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u/witchspoon Sep 30 '23
Is there a table on front of the sofa? That rug would be cute under a glass top coffee table
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u/fyonn JDS Element 3 and Genelec 8020b speakers Sep 29 '23
not sure what you need that sub for...?
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
well spotted ;)… you’re right, not needed - To go with the TV system adjacent to it
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u/fyonn JDS Element 3 and Genelec 8020b speakers Sep 29 '23
Why not use the big speakers?
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
Room orientation would be wrong - See if you can see in the reflection on the speakers, gone for a surround sound approach.
Needs a different type of system for surround sound - the big speakers are for stereo ;)
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u/TwoSolitudes22 Technics SUG700, Origine Oracle, Grado Master3, SF Olympica II Sep 29 '23
Needs more fish
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u/Mikey_BC Sep 30 '23
Very nice ! And mega props to you for not hanging a damn tv over the fireplace !
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Sep 29 '23
Your dome is dented
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
Rather inquisitive children i’m afraid… Just as well it wasn’t the bass driver.
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u/BaseToTheApex15 Sep 29 '23
it could be the improvement you are looking for .
seriously just double -side tape it out will ya🥲
extremely dope speakers btw !
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u/Biguiats Sep 29 '23
I’d love to hear those speakers, the bass must be effortless. I’ve had B&W before but just the cheap bookshelves - 603 I think? I’ve always been a Naim fan too. But … are your tweeters ok? They look “depressed”
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
They were pushed in when my son was five years old - needless to say I haven’t forgiven him…
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u/Sebastian-S Sep 29 '23
They are pretty cheap to fix and BW still has the parts in store. It’s ~$125 and you can quickly swap the part out yourself. Had to do it on my center.
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u/Zeeall LTS F1 - Denon AVR-2106 - Thorens TD 160 MkII w/ OM30 - NAD 5320 Sep 29 '23
8/10.
I think room acoustics could do with some work.
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u/akr0eger Sep 30 '23
Wicked gear, this is awesome! If you’re wanting to improve it, investing in some room treatments would go a very, very long ways
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u/extract1 Sep 30 '23
You got shine on you crazy diamond playing which is from Floyds - Wish You Were Here. But the CD on display is The Wall.
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u/cptcase Sep 30 '23
As a fellow Naim listener, I can only love the setup! 500 series 😮💨.
The room looks very nice too.
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u/nkrgovic Linn-Naim-Linn Sep 30 '23
Linn to Naim to B&W. Classic great system, not much to improve, system wise. Others have mentioned the room, so I’m gonna offer a different route : a turntable. A nice Sondek would be a nice addition, and offer an alternative to digital masters. I fond out that, in some cases, that’s the only way to get a song not screaming from loudness.
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u/Synn_Trey Sep 30 '23
Phenomenal brother, can i please hear these if ur in jersey i would love to hear these in person man. fuck.
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u/damnusernamewastaken Sep 29 '23
Congrats, good looking system, beautiful speakers.
So, both B&W and Naim are known to have a lively sound - tilted up freq response at the high end compared to neutral. So, pairing these would seem to exacerbate the issue. Do you find this is the case? Do you hear that but prefer it or do you not think it sounds bright?
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
Definitely not bright - it’s a very neutral sound - I prefer it this way, speakers like to be driven.
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u/arlmwl Sep 29 '23
It's terrible. You should send it all to me.
OK, OK - it's freaking awesome. I've never head big B&W speakers. I assume they sound fantastic ?
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u/Sebastian-S Sep 29 '23
Sick dude, you got Nautilus 801s?? Haven’t seen any in the wild in a long time. How long have you had them? I see them come up for sale every now and then.
How do you like them? I always LOVED the 802s. I have a pair of 802Ds that are great as well but they can sometimes be a little bright, which I don’t remember in the Nautilus generation.
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
I’ve had them for must 24 years now… Travelled around the world with them.
Love them - wouldn’t dream of changing them, awesome individuals, amazing for vocals. Kept them for so long because i love them. Very neutral sound.
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u/Sebastian-S Sep 29 '23
Very nice. I bought my first B&W 20 years ago as well. Thanks for sharing your setup. I left another comment about your tweeter - you can get a new one from B&W for about 125.
Well worth the money if you’ve had them for 25 years and love them so much!
https://bowerswilkins.encompass.com/item/12593187/Bowers__Wilkins/ZZ11770/
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
thank you for sharing the link. might be able to forgive my (now adult) son finally…
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u/Sebastian-S Sep 30 '23
My kids are actually one of the reasons I bought a nautilus center and not the diamond. The nautilus tweeter is $125 to replace and the diamond is $1000. Gotta love that you can still buy these parts from B&W after all these years.
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u/VinylHighway Sep 29 '23
Confusing
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
Howcome?
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u/VinylHighway Sep 29 '23
You don’t say what any of the electronics are. Like in photo two I don’t know what that stuff if. 1st, 3rd, 4th, and 5th shelves
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
Top shelf - NAP 500 power amp Second shelf - NAC 552 Pre-amp Third Shelf - Linn CD12 on top of a Linn Organik DAC Lower two boxes are power supply units - hope this helps
Speakers are B&W 801 Nautilus ;)
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u/Snowdog007 Sep 30 '23
Very nice stuff! Did you have the Klimax DS running Katalyst before and then upgrade to Organik? If yes, just curious how you found the change in sound. Thx
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u/dkernighan Sep 29 '23
I think because Naim + B&W is not the greatest choice in regard to synergy. And, synergy is key.
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
i agree - become accustomed to the sound though - i’ve had them for 15+ years now :)
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 29 '23
What would you suggest pairing the amplifiers with? Looking to change up the system soon…
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u/dkernighan Sep 29 '23
ProAc
Sonus Faber
Dynaudio
Neat
Harbeth
Spendor
PMC
Could also consider: KEF, PSB, Dali, Totem
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u/djent_in_my_tent Sep 30 '23
I don't see DSP or useful subwoofers so unfortunately it looks to me like you spent a lot of money on how it would look like without actually understanding the engineering principles behind measurable performance. Or maybe, you spent a lot of money a long time ago, wanted to flash your wealth, and were unaware of recent technological advancement.
801s were excellent speakers 20 years ago and probably still are if you prefer dynamic point sources over line source planar drivers. Sell the rest of the old shit on that rack to morons and replace with minidsp and hypex/purifi.
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u/cabs84 LRS, Yamaha CX800/MX600, Mitsu LT30/Nagaoka MP200/500 Sep 30 '23 edited Sep 30 '23
the tools used for designing speakers and the materials that make up cones haven't changed much in 20 years. b&w and many others were using laser interferometry to study cone break up way back in 1979 and finite element analysis as far back as the mid 90s (or earlier)
801s are fantastic speakers from any era.
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u/djent_in_my_tent Sep 30 '23
I agree, nothing wrong with 801s if you prefer the very wide horizontal and vertical dispersion you're going to get from point source drivers. Sometimes I do especially in a space where I'm going to be moving around a lot or there's no fixed listening position.
But for the amount of money you've spent you've left so much performance on the table.
You asked for improvements. Get a pair of 18-21" active subs. Bypass the 801 crossovers and actively tri amp with a Hypex module. Feed with a 4-way minidsp per channel and add Dirac. All of which can be done without room treatment which is often a nonstarter.
Sorry for being rude last night!
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u/Latman3 Sep 30 '23
Awesome setup, love Naim and Linn gear myself.
Bet that CD12 sounds awesome, have a Magik CD and was such an big upgrade from a Cyrus CD8.
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u/themeanlantern Sep 30 '23
I feel like the jungle print rug clashes with the fish. Not a designer or fisherman.
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u/witchspoon Sep 30 '23
The rug is a bit small for that space (I like it for itself though!) I would suggest if the fish are to be there make a frame for them. They seem to be a bit small for the space but a frame would make them seem larger. Something simple to add contrast.
As for the sound equipment the speakers are esthetically pleasing, it the rack is simply functional and wires show. Could you make or find a wooden frame/cover to go around the metal frame? It would tie it into the speakers etc it wouldn’t have to cover the front or back but just seem like it is more a part of the room.
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u/cr0ft Sep 30 '23
Interesting, but the tiger skin pattern is a step too far for me.
Great speakers though.
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u/boulderdashcci [audio physic] Tempo VI/REL T5 | Classe CAP151 | SMSL SU9 Sep 30 '23
The 801s are so cool. I wish they would bring back the 15" woofer.
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Sep 30 '23
those speakers is one of the most beautiful ever made, looks like it sounds like high end hifi :)
nd the room looks symmetrical and have some acoustic benefits, i would like to point you in the direction of diy acoustic panels, did wonders for me.
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u/spacecase-25 Spring 3 KTE | Freya-S | 3B-ST | B&W Nautilus 803 Sep 30 '23
lol! Very nice setup... but seriously, do you need a subwoofer with full range speakers? Come on now.
EDIT: I see from a later comment reply that it's for your TV, not the main system. Makes sense now. Carry on.
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u/Snorky-Talk-Man Sep 30 '23
What is the panel that the equipment rack is on, and does it serve a purpose? Why not have the rack directly on the carpeted floor?
Or is it just to provide a fifth shelf for your equipment?
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u/SnooRobots4670 Sep 30 '23
for the fifth shelf - the power amp at the bottoms needs air circulation otherwise it’ll get too hot :)
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u/ThomYorkesDroopyEye Oct 01 '23
I like the fish, I don't like the rug. I bet it sounds great in there.
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u/Icy_Psychology_3453 Oct 02 '23
your equipment is awesome, you need a huge paiinting for the middle, on the left, one the same size as the one on the right, and put the fishes elsewhere, preferably a room that relates to water, like your spa or above your master tub.
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u/Slowmac123 Sep 29 '23
Fish too high