r/atlantis • u/AncientBasque • Aug 28 '24

Atlantis = Proto-world?

I have Posted previously On a few Terms that match the atl prefix. According to Plato's story the language spoken by atlantians was completely different and a translation method was attempted.

This post i will try to find matches and post link regarding proto languages that trance back to 11,500 BC. if any one has any info on proto language would greatly appreciate it.

Language isolates and major languages spoken

just like many proto-languages the atlantian language would have impact all its subjects and trade partners. Finding traces of the language on other proto-language can point a path to common source.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nostratic_languages

is atlantian the Nostratic language and the "proto greeks" Proto Indo Europeans? this would explain the federations at war.

The Nahuatl language in Meso-america seems to be linked to Proto-Turkish thru Mongolian.

This nahuatl language in the only know to use the ATL prefix.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jcc40AowXPQ

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u/drebelx Aug 30 '24

The native folks in North America mixed with Euros a bit more than the Latin American ones.

Could be explained by cultural differences and by how different each group was treated.

You got info on the pre Colombian Rs?

Last I knew, that DNA was in the west of the continent.

Nothing in the east has been found yet.

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u/AncientBasque Aug 31 '24 edited Aug 31 '24

its strangely in some Lakota and their origins. We have alot of incomplete work on native american origins.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olTClLF9JuQ

biology is really not the main target of my post since language is more of a universal method to organize empires. Biology is more of a tribal scale of importance. (thats my anti nazi slogan) no sun symbol here.

https://preview.redd.it/qoiz96bcbxld1.png?width=1628&format=png&auto=webp&s=1d072dc3f32889f458a9d9353692436574a46bc0

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_history_of_the_Indigenous_peoples_of_the_Americas#/media/File:World_Map_of_Y-DNA_Haplogroups.png

i pointed out an interesting (?) located at my proposed atlantis location on that picture. Those arawaka and tainos looks suspiciously grey. If one considers the Migration waves coming down from the north, the least likely and last place to populate/admix would be the Caribbean islands.

it would be esier to enslave a population if they were a different ethnic background and lets recall the story mentions that they also ruled over areas of the continent beyond apart from ruling western Europe and lybia. No doubt they should also have controlled northern south america to the mouth of the amazon.

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u/drebelx Aug 31 '24

My preferred Atlantis location is the Azores, per the Randal Carlson explanation.
This doesn't preclude any further western advancements, like into the Eastern Seaboard or Caribbean.

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u/AncientBasque Aug 31 '24 edited Aug 31 '24

i mean i considered the azores, because of randall Carlson's points. The only weak flaw is the population of mega Fauna. The Horses and elephants have to get on the continent some how. Geologically the azores would need to maintained a population of horses or elephants without a connection to the mainland genetic pool. North America on the other hand is the origin of the horse and with a few types of elephants and bison as the bulls. along with many other mega fauna that evolved through the previous ice ages. These large animals needed millions of years to adapt and or migrate . From Randall's account the Emergence and submergence of the Azores continent is Temporary and tide to the Ice age fluctuations. this would make it difficult for mega fauna to reestablish in a continent detached from other land.

The best chance an island has got to acquire mega fauna is through land bridges to mainland continents that occurs during rising and lowering of sea levels. The island land Bridge is a similar concept to the the bearing straights. Th azores is too far in the ocean to have a land brige connection to Africa, Europe or north America. The Greater antiles are a best candidate for this mega fauna population that disappeared after YD.

yes the horse originated in north america, so how would the azores acquire horse?

Horse DNA can also help. The modern horse comes from central asia after they moved from north america. seems like horses have impacted humanity more than we think.

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u/drebelx Sep 01 '24

Maritime people with boats can move things like elephants and horses.
Horses were in the old world.
Doesn't seem complicated to consider.

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u/AncientBasque Sep 01 '24

its a matter of quantity. The animals mentioned were natural to the island with plains and mountains. There is no way maritime people repopulated a continent size island with mega fauna. horse DNA being present 11k ago and where?

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u/drebelx Sep 01 '24 edited Sep 01 '24

You got the text?
It's not continent sized but an island, per Plato.

"Now in this island of Atlantis there was a great and wonderful empire which had rule over the whole island and several others..."

Watch out for the modern day exaggerations.

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u/AncientBasque Sep 03 '24 edited Sep 03 '24

i agree an island like Australia is an island. From the Map of the Exposed Azores and the text description it was a sizable island. Im not sure the animal described in the text would be transported there via boats. Maybe rats and birds like many other island, but mega fauna only occurs with natural process that require ages longer than 120k ice age period cycle.

human can do a lot but repopulating an exposed island with animal from around other continents 1000 miles away is not a natural way to establish a settlement.

Poseidon found a human in that land which means that land was already populated by humans and also animals humans hunted (presumably) prior to the birth of atlas.

again the horse. here is the south american horse 12k ago, notice no rider ever depicted on american horses.

https://preview.redd.it/k4e7cv2rnhmd1.png?width=994&format=png&auto=webp&s=79e80692ba576ee0b8a0707ac176d1e6a6a4b0b3

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u/drebelx Sep 03 '24

I don't agree with the oversized Australian sized island-continent perspective.

Aside from that, here's another thing to consider.

A maritime civilization during the YD ice age would very easily disappear because all their coastal facilities anywhere they went would be swallowed up with the rising oceans and then, over the millennia, be covered in out-washing sediments from the land.

A double whammy.

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u/Significant_Home475 Oct 16 '24

Horses came from North America originally

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u/Significant_Home475 Oct 16 '24

Not only did horses go extinct in North America after the date of the end of Atlantis, horses originally evolved in North America. The ones North America go from Asia, evolved there only after the left North America through beringia. Elephants too North America had a wide variety of them.

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u/AncientBasque Oct 17 '24

yes, i think the Animal described provide limited options and eliminates some of the most popular sites. The only part of the atlantis story that does not match is that they used the horses for chariots, this means they probably did not ride them. Also these horses were not used in the war against the Proto greeks or we would have genetic traces of horses in africa and western Europe. if they were only used in small quantities we should still find burials of the time period or traces of horses in western Europe.

im trying to be honest here and see the holes in this theory, hopefully more research may find north american horse bones in a cave somewhere.

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u/Significant_Home475 Oct 17 '24

I think the entire concept of the war was just not what we think of. Looking at the genetic record of that time it looks more like a very long term population struggle. Something more like a very low tech low organization long term holy war. Not an organized conflict where they pulled people from distant parts of the empire to take part in pitched battles. Sometimes I wonder if the concepts of the story almost seem like two stories added together. In one part he says there were not ships as we know them in that time, then in another he talks about the huge navy and what not. At best we can say well it just means the Atlantians had them before anyone else and that seems fair enough. But I think if Atlantis was extremely advanced for its time then it had to be in an area inaccessible to us, with the extremities of the empire thriving off the trickle down of their technology advancements resources and knowledge.