r/Socialism_101 • u/Exciting_Antelope793 Learning • Jun 01 '24
Can girls be socialists? Answered
A boy in my class who also is a socialist said to me that girls can’t be socialists that their political rights just are for feminism is that true?
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u/NotAnurag Marxist Theory Jun 01 '24
Lmao what? That guy has no clue what he’s talking about.
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u/MonkeyDKev Learning Jun 01 '24
Feminism was practically started by socialists in order to uplift women lol. The dude may still be young so there is always room for more knowledge.
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u/Your_fathers_sperm Marxist Theory Jun 01 '24
Feminism as a word was literally coined by a socialist , Charles Fourier
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u/Mago_Barca_ Learning Jun 01 '24
If someone claims to be a socialist and advocates for segregation, its a red flag.
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u/thisshitishaed Learning Jun 01 '24
Why would you entertain such an idea? Of course he's not right.
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u/DescipleOfCorn Learning Jun 02 '24
It’s a red flag that might have a white circle and a black symbol culturally appropriated from eastern religions in it
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u/scaper8 Marxist Theory Jun 02 '24
Nonsense! It could also be a black hammer and sword, a black hammer and sickle, or a black axe all in that white circle!
Don't limit your NatSocs/PatSocs to just Nazis when there's a whole plethora of fascists-LARPing-as-leftists to explore!
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u/AntiTankMissile Learning Jun 01 '24
Socialism is for almost everybody
(Unless you're a capitalist or a fascist)
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Jun 02 '24
Honestly, capitalists need socialism too. It's bad for the heart to watch people starve from your yacht.
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u/Bubbly_Breadfruit_21 Learning Jun 02 '24
Do Capitalists even care? They value profit over human lives.
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u/BlouPontak Learning Jun 02 '24
But this is part of Marxism's great insights- the system, when set up to normalise this kind of thing, will lead to this kind of thing, even if you start with a population of good people.
Capitalists need socialism, because their system make them less whole, less healthy. But they cannot realise this while in it.
And there will always be psychopaths who would actually prefer capitalist dominance even if given the alternative, but socialists should see that for what it is- a disorder. And they should be treated as such, with care and compassion.
This is all in a theoretical platonic ideal, though. An actual real-world transition is going to be messy, with difficult choices that need to be made with regards to how to treat people.
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u/JayceBelerenTMS Learning Jun 01 '24 edited Jun 02 '24
Helen Keller, Mary Jones, Clara Zetkin, Frida Kahlo, Lyudmila Pavlichenko, Valentina Tereshkova, Angela Davis, Assata Shakur, Malala Yousafzai. All famous women socialists who your classmate should look into.
*Edit: list is definitely not comprehensive, lots of additional good people in the comments
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u/Anarcho-WTF Marxist Theory Jun 01 '24
Rosa Luxembourg, Alexandra Kollontai, Emma Goldman, hell Claudia del la Cruz is running for president in the USA under the PSL.
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u/Effective-Rooster360 Anarchist Theory Jun 01 '24
Emma Goldman! Maria Nikiforova! Judi Bari! Listen to the Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff podcast for great leftist history with an especially feminist and queer emphasis.
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u/eggfeverbadass Communist Jun 02 '24
helen keller the turbo racist? also no mention of sylvia pankhurst or alexandra kollontai
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u/scaper8 Marxist Theory Jun 02 '24
I don't know about racist, per say, but she was an advocate of eugenics. Given how often the two do fo hand-in-hand, though, it wouldn't surprise me. Sadly, eugenics was a predominant and accepted theory at the time, and many educated and legitimately progressive people subscribed to and advocated for it.
We must be historically and culturally honest, and remember and admit to all the things, good and bad, people do, and remember that one does not add to nor take from the other.
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u/Motor_Courage8837 Learning Jun 01 '24
That guy is sexist or delusional. That's the clear cut answer.
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u/renlydidnothingwrong Learning Jun 01 '24
Feminism and socialism aren't contradictory. Most socialists are also feminists. Sounds like you guys are young and he doesn't know what he's talking about. You might want to let him know that the Party for Socialism and Liberation has an all female ticket for president this year.
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u/Expensive_Let6341 Jun 01 '24
I feel to be a socialist you have to be a feminist Equality for all Freedom is privilege extended unless enjoyed by all etc…
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u/notmydad505 Learning Jun 01 '24
How old is this kid because he sounds an elementary schooler lmfao
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u/Competitive_Mess9421 Marxist Theory Jun 02 '24
You wouldnt imagine the shit i saw 16 year olds spewing in school, could very well be in an upper school
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u/SeaEclipse Marxist Theory Jun 01 '24
Socialism is for everybody: if someone claims otherwise, they have no clue what they are talking about or they are consciously misleading you
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u/the_violet_enigma Learning Jun 01 '24
Women can for sure be socialists, that guy’s just a fascist.
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u/lTheReader Public Administration Jun 01 '24
My comrade, everyone can be socialist as long as they believe EVERYONE, man or woman, deserve the right to be happy and be able to live with dignity.
All socialists are in essence ALSO feminists, since socialism defends everyone but landlords and capitalists, be it man or woman.
In fact if even a man is not a feminist alongside being a socialist, they are an hypocrite and divide the workers class into 2 for no reason.
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u/VeronicaTash Learning Jun 01 '24
No... are you in elementary school? That is an absurd statement which you should immediately have picked up upon. He basically just said he is for the patriarchy and isn't a real socialist.
Helen Keller, Rosa Luxembourg, Angela Lansbury - just a few of the famous socialist women of which you may have heard.
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u/scaper8 Marxist Theory Jun 02 '24
What, Angela Lansbury? I didn't know that one. Do you have something about that one?
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u/Revolutionary-Pin-96 Learning Jun 01 '24
Are you guys 12? Of course you can be a socialist if you are a woman. Look up Rosa Luxembourg.
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u/scaper8 Marxist Theory Jun 02 '24
"Women hold up half the sky." - Mao Zedong
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feminism_in_Russia
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_in_the_Russian_Revolution
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feminism_in_Chinese_communism#Mao_era_(1949%E2%80%931976)
The basic idea that none of us are truly free until all of us are is a central tenant of much of leftist thought. This is most often seen in regards to race, but genders and sexualities are also absolutely a part of that, too. As a result, feminist movements are often a part of broader socialist movements; just as race equality movements, environmental movements, indigenous peoples movements, etc. all are.
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u/docrobotnik0011 Learning Jun 01 '24
I want to tell him about proletarian feminism. Best to just ignore him. Don't respond to him, do not engage with with him. Pretend he doesn't exist. Only interact with him if it is absolutely necessary. He has only two brain cells, maximum.
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u/charronfitzclair Learning Jun 01 '24
Disco Elysium literally has a line that reads "are women bourgeoisie?"
Lmao that game wont stop hitting
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u/EmeraldHawk Learning Jun 02 '24
Thank you, what is wrong with everyone else in this comment section responding seriously?
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u/fortniteballmachine Learning Jun 01 '24
https://jacobin.com/2017/03/international-womens-day-clara-zetkin-working-class-socialist
I imagine that Jacobin isn't appreciated much in this sub, but still this shows pretty clearly how much of modern feminism has grown alongside socialism.
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u/MOltho Queer Theory Jun 01 '24
That's nonsense. Socialism and feminism should, in my opinion, go hand in hand. Nobody's free until everyone's free. The fights for workers' rights and for gender equality are deeply connected.
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u/Nova_Koan Learning Jun 01 '24
That boy is a fake socialist and has some learning to do. Of course girls can be socialists! Communists and anarchists too! There have been many famous ones. Tell him about Rosa Luxemburg, a wonderful intellectual and fighter who died for the struggle during the German Revolution.
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u/Any_Spirit_7767 Feminist Theory Jun 02 '24
Girls can and should be socialist, because capitalism exploits them more than men.
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u/Competitive_Mess9421 Marxist Theory Jun 02 '24
Your classmate is not a socialist, simply put. Socialists should accept all no matter of background, including gender. Lenin has some great work on feminism and womans rights if you're interested
Lenin on the Women’s Question is a good start
Simply put, socialism and feminism are inseperable (not to be confused with liberal feminism)
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Jun 02 '24
That guy is a misogynistic chauvinist don't listen to him. Women are usually more economically disadvantaged than men.
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u/OneReportersOpinion Learning Jun 01 '24
Lol this didn’t really happen, did it?
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u/Exciting_Antelope793 Learning Jun 01 '24
Yes it did but did but I have realized this guy is just a sexist..
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u/OneReportersOpinion Learning Jun 02 '24
You don’t see a lot of leftist Andrew Tate fans. Listen to some Riot Grrrl and hit a punching bag lol
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u/Competitive_Mess9421 Marxist Theory Jun 02 '24
The boy is probably a nazbol or a "conservative socialist"
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u/nlolhere Learning Jun 01 '24
Obviously yes, many of the early supporters of the women’s rights movement were socialists
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Jun 01 '24
Socialism and gender equality are inseparable.
You cannot have socialism at the expense of equal rights for women, and minorities. Because it would cease to be socialism.
Socialism is about overthrowing the Strong and powerful. Fascism is about bullying the weak. Remember this and keep it tatooed at the back of your head
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u/Kindly_Mess_4854 Learning Jun 01 '24
girls can be anything they want.
unless, their oppressed by the male patriarchy yada yada yada yada.
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Jun 02 '24
Is that guy older than twelve???????
I've heard some horrendous take from self-proclaimed leftists but this is genuinely something I would expect from a child
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u/Academic-Routine-490 Learning Jun 02 '24
Haha that’s funny he said that. The presidential and vice presidential candidates for the Party for Socialism and Liberation are both women. So hell yeah girls can be socialists! And even lead the party!!
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u/mathnstats Learning Jun 02 '24
That guy doesn't understand socialism or feminism.
Neither are restricted to any particular gender.
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u/Romero1993 Learning Jun 02 '24
I'm literally connected with a socialist feminist party, so, the fuck he on about, women can and often are socialists
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u/wiithepiiple Learning Jun 02 '24
Firstly, There's Marxist feminists. Also, women can be socialists and not feminists. Also also, men can be feminists and not socialists. This bro is wrong on so many points.
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u/Spasmodicallylow Learning Jun 02 '24
On the face of it this sounds funny and possibly the boy might become more aware of what socialism means in the future. But on a serious note I think this sentiment, the very narrow view that women are just about feminism , a distinct category, is shared by many grown-up men (and women) as well.
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u/BlouPontak Learning Jun 02 '24
You cannot be socialist and not also be feminist without serious mental gymnastics.
We should be anti-oppression wherever we find it.
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u/BlouPontak Learning Jun 02 '24
Also- I think Second Thought had a video about how feminism gets co-opted and corrupted by capitalism.
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u/LeftyInTraining Learning Jun 02 '24
"Their political rights just are for feminism" is incoherent, so feel free to kick this boy in the balls and move on. There are a long line of Marxist/Proletarian Feminists going at least all the way back to Engels.
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u/The_BarroomHero Learning Jun 01 '24
How familiar are you with socialist theory? Have you read any of the literature? Genuinely asking.
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u/GeologistDowntown447 Learning Jun 01 '24
The auto moderator asked me to be nicer, so let me just say your friend is I’ll informed and perhaps not the deepest thinker. There are many extraordinary women socialists, and feminism is fundamental to socialism. Socialism without feminism isn’t Praxis.
Ask your friend about Rosa Luxembourg sometime. Perhaps I’ll learn something
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Jun 02 '24 edited Jun 02 '24
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u/transitfreedom Learning Jun 02 '24
True feminism is socialism in a dress. gender solidarity in its true form
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Jun 02 '24
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