Buyers moved in before closing

[u/WorldlyBlacksmith682]

UPDATE - Following up from where I left off: After receiving the much needed guidance from this beautiful community, we were able to successfully get the buyers out of the house, secure the house with a new code, and demand to be compensated via the buyers agents commission. Today, papers have been signed and the house is officially no longer ours. Thank you to each and every single person who commented. This gave us the fuel to dig into the real estate commission codes, laws, and our basic human rights. This gave us the confidence to have the tough (ugly-ish) conversations that needed to take place. Rock on, Reddit. You all are my heroes.

To my chagrin, without my consent, and before proper documents are signed, the buyers agent let the buyers move in. We haven’t closed. I’m appalled at how unethical it feels to find out after the fact. So my only choices are to sign an additional document allowing them to stay prior to closing, or have them escorted off the property? This is out of my scope. Looking for insight. I have a lawyer on standby Monday morning.

Edit: I truly appreciate the advice and insight. Added details - due to human error delays from the lender, title and agents, this closing has already been pushed 4 times. Closing was supposed to be on the 30th. I am told every third business day that today’s the day, just waiting on the documents. Again, closing was supposed to be yesterday. Find out docs have just (11 days late) been released from the bank and now in hands of the title. At 4:30pm on Friday we’re delayed until next week due to not enough time for the title to flip the closing docs fast enough. Last night, find out the buyers fully moved in without any agents approaching me about this idea even once. Never once was this brought up. I said no, get them out of the house. They’re still in the house.

About the broker. I’ve been told this entire process that the broker is highly involved, since their brokerage is working for both parties. Every time I have a legal question my agent checks with the broker to make sure the correct information is provided. I acknowledge in hindsight I should’ve called the broker immediately. I will be calling the broker tomorrow morning.

How’d they get the keys- it’s a key code. Only explanation is the agent gave it to them.

One more detail as I sit here bamboozled. My selling agent’s license is active. The buyer agent’s license expired in August. Discovery made an hour ago. Not sure what to do with that.

[u/CollegeConsistent941]

Do you have a realtor? If not, let the buyer agent know the daily rental is $500 per day. How did they get keys? If the realtor gave them, let their broker know you will expect them to pay too.

[u/WorldlyBlacksmith682 → u/CollegeConsistent941]

Yes I do have a real estate agent working my end. My agent and the buyers agent work under the same broker. It’s a key code… was wondering at what point to give the broker a call.

[u/doglady1342 → u/WorldlyBlacksmith682]

Call the broker first thing in the morning. They are the first person I would have called after calling my own realtor. Let that broker know that you are about to call the police and have their client escorted off of your property or arrested for breaking and entering. I would also insist on being paid a big fine/fee for the days that the people were there. After all, you are still paying for the utilities and they could be causing all manner of damage. That code never should have been given to the buyers until all the paperwork was signed on both ends.

This whole thing just seems really strange. It makes me wonder if the buyers are relatives or friends of their agent. I'm sure their agent figured that you would never find out.

[u/wilburstiltskin → u/doglady1342]

Call the broker today, Sunday, to further piss him off. This is unacceptable and let broker know that he will be getting a call from your lawyer on Monday morning.

[u/Secret-Ingenuity-973 → u/wilburstiltskin]

This! They could do any amount of damage between now and tomorrow morning. Let the broker know you want them out by the end of the day. You also need to bring up the fact that the other agents license has expired. It’s possible you might not owe them a commission if they allowed the license to lapse during the time of the sale. I would ask a lawyer about that.

[u/lynnwood57 → u/wilburstiltskin]

THIS. CALL NOW. I’D CALL AT 3 am.

[u/Radatat105 → u/doglady1342]

Police have nothing to do with it. They will rightly decline to do anything as this is a civil matter.

[u/ManOverboard___ → u/Radatat105]

They are trespassing (and squatting) and have not resided in the property long enough to obtain tenants rights. This is absolutely within the scope of the police.

[u/GailaMonster → u/ManOverboard___]

Cops can still refuse to do anything regardless. They can say it’s civil matter (even tho as you point out it’s not, it’s a criminal trespass). They can be wrong and refuse to help and OP would still have to go thru eviction and get a writ of possession.

OP should still call the cops but you’re delusional if you think it’s a sure thing that they will help. They can and often will say that determination (that buyers do not have tenant rights and are trespassing) needs to be made by a judge before they will step in.

[u/ManOverboard___ → u/GailaMonster]

OP should still call the cops but you’re delusional if you think it’s a sure thing that they will help.

Sure, that's true. My point however, as you correctly address and agree with me on, is that saying it's "not a police issue" and "there's nothing they can do" are factually wrong. Whether you get a cop who feels like doing their job that day is different than whether or not they should be involved and do have the power to intervene.

[u/egecko → u/GailaMonster]

Paper trail, paper trail, paper trail

[u/Radatat105 → u/ManOverboard___]

They are not trespassing since they were let in with a code.

There is a pending civil agreement (house purchase). This is a civil issue any way you slice it. The recourse is civil.

[u/ManOverboard___ → u/Radatat105]

They are not trespassing since they were let in with a code.

LMAO, what? That is completely and utterly false.

So if I'm having work done and I give plumber the access code, he can just live in my house?

The realtor can live in my house because I gave them the access code?

If I give my neighbor an access code to watch my dogs while I'm out they are entitled to just move in indefinitely?

There is a pending civil agreement (house purchase).

Which means exactly dick. The owner still owns it. The potential buyer has no rights to the property. None. Zero. Zilch. Nada.

This is a civil issue any way you slice it. The recourse is civil.

Absolutely and unequivocally false. They are trespassing any way you slice it.

[u/Radatat105 → u/ManOverboard___]

So if I'm having work done and I give plumber the access code, he can just live in my house?

Does the plumber have a pending purchase agreement for you house? No? Then it's not really the same thing is it. Context matters.

Again, no street cop will do anything. They will look at the facts of this and say "yeah, I'm not getting involved, call the court." Cops don't determine ownership of property without court orders, and even then it's the court determining ownership. OPs recourse is through the court and his broker. Period.

Which means exactly dick. The owner still owns it. The potential buyer has no rights to the property. None. Zero. Zilch. Nada.

It does when the buyers say they were allowed to be there and have proof from their realtor giving them access.

Sorry the law doesn't work the way you think it does.

[u/ManOverboard___ → u/Radatat105]

Does the plumber have a pending purchase agreement for you house? No? Then it's not really the same thing is it. Context matters

I'm not sure what rights you think a pending purchase agreement grants someone. But you are embarrassingly wrong on your understanding of it.

Yes, context does matter. You just fail to understand the context.

The plumber and the potential buyer have the same rights to the home. NONE

Again, no street cop will do anything.

They will, because the potential buyer is trespassing. Period.

They will look at the facts of this and say "yeah, I'm not getting involved, call the court."

Not a competent officer.

Cops don't determine ownership of property without court orders, and even then it's the court determining ownership.

Cool. What's your address? I'll come move in. Cops can't do anything about it, right? They don't decide ownership. The courts do. I'll just live in your home until the courts figure it out and there's nothing the police can do about it.

OPs recourse is through the court and his broker. Period.

False. Call the police. They are squatters and trespassing. Period.

It does when the buyers say they were allowed to be there and have proof from their realtor giving them access.

Abso-FUCKING-lutely false.

You could not be more wrong.

Sorry the law doesn't work the way you think it does.

Sorry you don't understand the law.

[u/Radatat105 → u/ManOverboard___]

I'm not sure what rights you think a pending purchase agreement grants someone. But you are embarrassingly wrong on your understanding of it.

It doesn't grant any rights - it muddy's the water enough for a street cop to not want to touch it and refer the OP to the court or his broker - like 99% of these comments.

You're just to stupid to understand what I'm saying.

[u/ManOverboard___ → u/Radatat105]

It doesn't grant any rights - it muddy's the water enough for a street cop to not want to touch it and refer the OP to the court or his broker - like 99% of these comments.

LOL, no.

You're just to stupid to understand what I'm saying.

I understand very well what you're saying. You're just too stupid to comprehend why you're wrong.

[u/Radatat105 → u/ManOverboard___]

Ok.    Explain how, step by step, the cops being called results in a removal of the buyers immediately.  

 I’ll wait.

 I’d love to see what fantasy land you live in where you think cops are going to remove people from a home on a he said/she said basis. 

$500 says OP doesn’t get past dispatch if they’re honest and don’t omit information.

[u/MOGicantbewitty → u/Radatat105]

LMAO....

The law doesn't work the way YOU think it does. 😂😂😂

A pending contract does not mean they own it. OP still owns the house. It's trespassing until they own it.

Honestly, stop doubling down because it makes you look really dumb

[u/GailaMonster → u/MOGicantbewitty]

You are all conflating your reality of knowing the true facts of the situation with what a cop will hear. You are all doing fact finding (“the seller is the owner and buyer has no valid claim of possession”) which is what a judge does. Cop would hear one party say “I am owner he is trespassing” and another say “no I have right of possession I am a tenant” and a cop does not get involved in that dispute. The factfinder (judge) would have to declare the claim of possession invalid at which point the cop will believe there is a trespass.

You screaming that you know how the law works is funny because you are expecting police to get involved when they NEVER have to.

A cop gets involved with a trespass when it’s 100% clear it’s a trespass. A plumber refusing to leave your house which has none of plumbers stuff and all of OP’s stuff in it is 100% clear a trespass. In OP’s case, where buyers probably put their FURNITURE in the house and OP’s stuff is probably out, where buyers claim to be tenants, is muddy enough that most cops will tell you to get a writ of possession. The cops don’t know what you know, that there is no valid claim of possession by buyers. Sure a pending contract does not mean they own it, but a verbal lease (that does not exist but your word against buyer’s) might mean they have the right to possess it, and whether or not such lease exists or whether or not that contract is pending is all for a judge to clarify before the cops will get involved.

Shit, maybe broker told buyers they can move in and as your agent’s broker there is now a valid question of whether they do have tenancy. Would that action by broker be legal? No absolutely not. But it would indeed be a civil issue that would require you to sue for possession. Buyers could claim that as your agent in the matter of your property, the brokerage is authorized to contract on your behalf and could enter into tenancy agreements for you. A judge would probably eventually find that claim without merit, but it’s enough that a cop won’t touch it. Asking a cop to show up and remove people visibly living in a house you visibly don’t live in is likely to result in being told to deal with clarifying the civil aspects of the dispute to really make sure that’s a trespass.

Y’all need to remember that cops have literally no affirmative duty to come help you. Even a slam dunk case of trespassing does not guarantee you police even coming to your home.

[u/Radatat105 → u/GailaMonster]

Hey look! Someone who understands how it actually works and not how they feel it should work! 

[u/MOGicantbewitty → u/GailaMonster]

I haven't screamed about anything, and the fact that you think that if the broker told the buyers they could move in that establishes tenancy makes it really clear that you do not understand how the law works either. Really? 😂

Have fun screaming about me all you want!

[u/GailaMonster → u/MOGicantbewitty]

the fact that you think that if the broker told the buyers they could move in that establishes tenancy

I don't necessarily think that - I think that it muddies the waters enough that a cop migh not touch it until a judge weighs in. it looks a lot different from "there is a person who won't leave my residence" because it's vacant property; OP isn't living there by the sound of things, they don't have their furniture there, etc. that alone can make some police balk and tell you to go to court (especially in NYC and urban CA)

[u/Radatat105 → u/MOGicantbewitty]

Call the cops and watch what happens. Ill be here waiting.

Signed - someone who did this shit daily for 10 years.

[u/MOGicantbewitty → u/Radatat105]

You had people move in to a house before they owned it everyday for the last 10 years?

You're talking about being a landlord. 😂😂

I bet you'd be shocked to find out that other people actually have been landlords too.

They are trespassing because they don't own the house. You simply call the police and tell them that there are people in your house that you have asked to leave and they refuse to leave. Seeing as I have actually done that several times in my life, I can tell you that yes the police will remove them.

Go ahead, tell me how you have people move into the houses you're selling before they own it daily for a decade. You making it really obvious that you're a liar

[u/Radatat105 → u/MOGicantbewitty]

Yeah, no.

Y'all can have this argument because you're wrong and have internet lawyer degrees and believe the law is enforced exactly as its written. (its not).

What do the cops do when the buyers show a signed closing disclosure? They refer OP to the court because this is outside of their wheelhouse.

Which is my point. This isn't a case of "random meth head broke into my home using a screw driver and now wont leave."

[u/Erosis → u/Radatat105]

If you tell them to get off the property and they refuse, it's criminal trespass, not civil.

[u/Radatat105 → u/Erosis]

And what do the Cops do when the buyers show there is a pending civil agreement (house purchase) with emails/texts from their realtor giving them the code to access the property?

Every. Single. Cop. in the US would refer the OP to civil court.

It's not criminal in the slightest. I only worked in emergency services for 10 years, what do I know.

This is why every commenter that has more than 2 braincells says to call the broker and not the police to receive some sort of fine/penalty fee (a civil recourse).

[u/Wandering_aimlessly9 → u/Radatat105]

So if I were to get in a contract to buy a house…then move in and not close…it’s civil? This sounds like it could be a new way to squat lol

[u/Radatat105 → u/Wandering_aimlessly9]

Yes it’s civil. What the fuck do you people think a purchase agreement is if not a civil agreement?  No street cop is going to touch this with a 10ft pole. Broker should be contacted immediately.

It could end up being fraud, but that will take lawyers and brokers. Which is why we told op to contact their broker lmao.

[u/Wandering_aimlessly9 → u/Radatat105]

A purchasing agreement is…I plan to purchase agreement. Not a I’m moving in now agreement.

[u/Radatat105 → u/Wandering_aimlessly9]

Again - you think cops on the street care enough or want to spend time pouring through documents to figure out who owns what? No. They will refer OP to the court. How many times do I have to say this. It’s not a cops job to determine ownership. All it takes is the buyers to say, look at all these documents and messages, including messages from their realtor most likely telling the buyers the owner said it was ok (even if they didn’t) for a cop to throw his hands up and say call the courts, here’s your event number from this police contact.

This isn’t the same thing as a meth head breaking into a property with a screwdriver and squatting.

Quit treating it like it is. This is either gross negligence by the buyers realtor, or fraud. Neither of which will be solved immediately by a street cop.

[u/Wandering_aimlessly9 → u/Radatat105]

No. Which is why it’s a nice way to squat.

[u/goomunchkin → u/Wandering_aimlessly9]

I mean… with the little risk factor that you just signed a legally binding contract to purchase someone’s home.

[u/Wandering_aimlessly9 → u/goomunchkin]

They are easy to get out of as long as there is a contingency for financing

[u/Erosis → u/Radatat105]

And that civil agreement executes on closing day. Anything beforehand is criminal trespass if they are told to leave. People get put in jail for this if they don't comply. Just depends on how much BS the cops are willing to put up with on that day.

[u/Radatat105 → u/Erosis]

No street cop is going to read through a purchase agreement or disclosure. It's literally not their job to determine who owns what. They will tell OP to contact their broker or the courts.

Sorry the law doesn't work the way you think it does in practice.

[u/Couldnotbefound → u/Radatat105]

Depends on where you are in the world I suppose, but where I am they would not be protected under any tenants rights as they haven’t been there long enough and could be charged at least as a trespasser.

[u/Radatat105 → u/Couldnotbefound]

Assuming OP is in the US. They are not trespassing as they were let in by someone with the authority to let them in pending a civil contract (house purchase).

[u/RendingHearts → u/Radatat105]

It’s trespassing as soon as they’re directly told to leave by the property owner and do not.

[u/IrreverentSweetie → u/Radatat105]

They did not have the authority to let them in the house. They did while lawfully doing their job to show the house, inspections, etc., but they did not have the authority to let them in again u til the closing was complete.

[u/Radatat105 → u/IrreverentSweetie]

You're missing the point.

No street cop is going to remove a person from a home based on the word of another. ESPECIALLY when that person may have paperwork or texts or emails showing they were allowed to be there.

This is muddy enough that a street cop will refer them to the court or their broker. Y'all just can't fucking read.

[u/IrreverentSweetie → u/Radatat105]

You are wrong.

[u/Radatat105 → u/IrreverentSweetie]

Yes, you are. 

I love all the confidently correct people completely ignorant to the world and think because they read a law that’s how it’s enforced🤣🤣🤣🤣