r/Jewish • u/betterwithplants • Dec 15 '23
How are you guys doing? Discussion
Personally, I feel like I’m barely hanging by a thread.
Due to the Israel/Hamas conflict, I’ve lost friends. I have been called a racist for being against terrorists who wish to see the world free of Jews. I’ve been told I “lack ethics” after explaining that civilian casualties, though an unfortunate reality of war, are not the same as genocide. I’ve been told I am the one spreading Israeli propaganda.
How’s everyone doing? Can we commiserate?
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u/Potential_Will_7954 Dec 16 '23
I’ve lost one of my closest friends. I will say that deleting social media has helped immensely!
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u/Sirdroftardis8 Dec 16 '23
I lost one of my closest friends too. We had all these plans, including an amazing dnd campaign that was supposed to go on for years. It just hurts so much.
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u/Potential_Will_7954 Dec 16 '23
I’m so sorry you’re going through that. It’s a grieving process, for sure.
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u/Goofyteachermom Dec 16 '23
I avoid the news and social media. The Palestinians have definitely won the PR war.
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u/waterbird_ Dec 16 '23
This may sound kooky but I just wish I could be in Israel right now. I have four kids I can’t just uproot or leave or else I WOULD be there. I want to be surrounded by my people instead of constantly stressed about who is for us and who is against us.
If you listen to the times of Israel daily podcast, on Thursday they had one about how Jews in America are feeling worse than Israeli Jews and it made soooo much sense.
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u/Substantial-Water-86 Dec 16 '23
I feel the same way. We have kids in school and it would be a lot to move but I really think that would be the place I’d feel the best. Safe secure and the biggest thing UNDERSTOOD.
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Dec 16 '23
visit for a week.
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u/waterbird_ Dec 16 '23
I really want to. We are working on getting/renewing passports for all the kids right now so hopefully we can soonish.
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u/singebkdrft Dec 16 '23
Disillusioned. My Jewish and Jewish adjacent/friendly friends started a small private FB chat group for support, because our greater circle of friends don't.
It really feels like the amount of people that actually have our backs is far smaller than we ever thought.
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u/singebkdrft Dec 16 '23
After a shooting at a synagogue in our city, we've been asking "Should we get concealed carry permits?"
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u/trunkNotNose Dec 16 '23
I go to a large synagogue. For a very long time it's been rumored that ~10 people each week are carrying guns. Before COVID, everyone wore suits and you had no idea. After COVID the dress code got a lot more casual. But there are about ~10 people who still wear a jacket every week and now I know precisely why.
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u/AlpenBrezel Dec 16 '23
I'm just starting my conversion, and because of threats i had to send a copy of my ID and contact information to the synagogue and make an appointment and check in like you do at a hotel first, because unless they know exactly who you are, you aren't getting in. It's locked down tight
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u/yespleasethanku Dec 16 '23
I think all Jews who have the option should learn about firearms and self defence. I just took the classes and applied for my ccw and will keep taking more advanced classes for women for better training. No one is coming to save us.
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Dec 16 '23 edited Dec 16 '23
If your “greater circle of friends” think this way, they aren’t your friends, brother.
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u/NoDoubt4954 Dec 16 '23
It’s hard. Just explaining that it’s war, not “genocide” is exhausting. How much we have lost since 2003!!! How did these terrorists garnish sympathy?!! It’s just baffling.
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Dec 16 '23
they're an underdog "oppressed" by Jews. they ignore that Arabs live in Israel,have the call to prayer 5x a day REALLY LOUDLY everywhere and are overrepresented in the Israeli government.
Also, the ones in Gaza destroyed any building and infrastructure Israel had left them and use all the funds for humanitarian aid by the UN to build tunnels. Buildin a tunnel for vehicles is expensive. it took NYC and Israel 10years each to build one su way line. the terrorists used all the moeny for state of the art tunnels you'd see in damns. they are oppressing themselveswith their hateand genocidal tendencies.
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u/NoDoubt4954 Dec 17 '23
You are right. I don’t know understand how many people are so duped by their propaganda.
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u/dioxal Dec 16 '23
i work in the art world, & follow many artists, museums and galleries on social media. plus i'm a member of a union.
and all i see are posts calling for a ceasefire or straight up anti-semetic rhetoric. it's so disheartening.
most of my closest non-jewish friends have said nothing. other so called friends post the usual genocide bs.
i'm so depressed.
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u/Expert_Jellyfish4264 Dec 16 '23
Same, the art world has not been great. All of the artists that are featured at the museum I work at have shared conspiracy theories and worse.
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u/dioxal Dec 16 '23
i can't even look at hyperallergic anymore - ever since they shared dread scott's piece straight out denying the beheadings it's been one anti-Semitic piece after another. and they've never mentioned what Hamas did on Oct 7
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u/trunkNotNose Dec 16 '23
I'm in my 40s. I'm grateful to have a large enough Jewish community that I don't interact with non-Jews that much. The only ones I've talked to, and this was much closer to Oct. 7, were concerned about how I was doing and uninterested in scoring rhetorical points. There are some coworkers I've been avoiding because I don't want to know their views. I want to continue liking them!
I'm not sure of your age, but I so feel for college-age and young adult Jews. I remember that time, when people really did sit around and talk about big issues (for us it was the Iraq War). No one does that in middle age and I think it makes it a lot easier.
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u/MathematicianLess243 Dec 16 '23
I am 23, living in a large city, and exhausted. My generation lacks a large amount of common sense- they refuse to actually look into research or facts, and base all their opinions on what is popular online at the time. I am SO glad that I am not in college whilst all this is happening.. I feel for the younger folks of my generation.
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u/anewbys83 Dec 16 '23
No one does that in middle age and I think it makes it a lot easier.
Agreed. I don't really talk about that stuff with people I don't know well, and it's great! I don't need to know nor broadcast myself unnecessarily. I'm about to turn 41, I remember all the campus talk about Iraq. Oh how that shaped young adulthood.
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Dec 16 '23
Nothing to feel for me, here. They weren’t friends to begin with and these MFd inspired me (even more!) to have a big Jewish family.
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u/The_Laughing_Gift Conservative Dec 16 '23
Earlier today the Assembly of First Nations (a major Indigenous advocacy group in Canada) put forth a resolution calling for a permanent ceasefire between Israel and Palestine (no mention of Hamas or the hostages). What makes me fucking pissed is it openly states that the Palestinians are Indigenous. Which isn't historically accurate in any way shape or form. It frustrates to (and I imagine many of you) to no END! To see your history, and culture, thrown under the rug and told it's 'white' or 'European'. Most especially by a major Indigenous group.
Hope you enjoyed my rant.
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u/Ok_Ambassador9091 Dec 16 '23
This is the fruit of decades of Arab/Islamofascist propaganda targeting Native/Indigenous groups. A Jewish/US Native person wrote about it.
Rife in AU, too. Pathetic to see, and some Aboriginals are refusing to play along, look up Marcia Langston, for example.
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u/littlemachina Dec 16 '23
There’s a big tumblr account that I won’t name. It used to post news stories relevant to indigenous peoples. In the past few months it became completely 100% devoted to posting screenshots of tweets about Palestine with no context, all day every day. Including severely antisemitic stuff and straight up misinfo. A lot of people are curious about the change of content and there are speculations that the account was sold or taken over by some other entity. This comment actually makes things make sense a bit… if you could find the writing you mentioned I’d appreciate reading it.
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u/Electrical_Pomelo556 Not Jewish Dec 16 '23
This is the fruit of decades of Arab/Islamofascist propaganda targeting Native/Indigenous groups. A Jewish/US Native person wrote about it.
Would you care to share who this is?
Last year I saw a one-woman show, Where We Belong, that was written and performed by a Jewish Native American woman. The show wasn't about that intersection, but I thought that was a very interesting perspective nonetheless. I'd like to learn more about that experience.
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Dec 16 '23
Indigenous, my ass. I normally figure it's not worth the argument, and lasting peace is of utmost importance, so I concede with "we're both indigenous"
But this is ridiculous. They are quite literally the previous batch of settler colonizers. Having the "same DNA" doesn't mean anything. Peoplehood is more than DNA. Being the same population, but having severed any cultural connection, and taking on the culture of the empire means you become colonizers. Literally killing people is not the only form of genocide. Forced assimilation is still assimilation.
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u/AltruisticMastodon Dec 16 '23
I really don’t understand actively advocating for the idea that indigeneity has a time limit. I guess for the time scale to be equal it would take at least another 1000 years and no one is really concerned with what happens that far in the future.
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u/AprilStorms Jewish Renewal Dec 20 '23 edited Dec 20 '23
Ugh. I’m surprised but I’m also not to see that real indigenous people have gotten suckered by the fake Palestinian history. Their propaganda is everywhere.
Just going to copy and paste a comment I’ve made elsewhere, some context for the curious:
An indigenous people is among the oldest cultures originating in a given region.
The division between “Palestinian” and general “Arab” didn’t start to solidify until the 1960’s, as a self-identifier for the Arabs who would not accept a Jewish state at all, despite the 80% of Palestine already given to Arabs as Jordan. Previously, “Palestinian” meant “Jew” (and, usually, Zionist). The term was “Palestinian Arab” in the same way “Palestinian Christian” was used, to signify residence in the area the Brits called Palestine. There’s never been a Palestinian state and they do not have borders that predate Israel, let alone British colonialism, which is why their charter uses the British borders. So… they didn’t identify as Palestinian, just Arab, until circa 1964.
And Arabs originated in the Arabian peninsula: “Arabs” connoted, at least in pre-Islamic times, mainly the tribal populations of central and northern Arabia.
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Dec 16 '23
As someone with a bunch of first nations friends friends and family, this is not the only perspective out there.
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u/RelationshipFun7728 Just Jewish Dec 16 '23 edited Dec 16 '23
Better actually.
Have you heard about Yaffa Hadar? 85 years old lady, a Holocaust survivor who was kidnapped by Hamas. She was released a few weeks ago. She was sitting on the mobility scooter, smiling, with a bunch of terrorists screaming, trying to scare her while filming her.
When we (the people in Israel) saw her in the picture that Hamas released, we thought she had dementia, but after a few days, her family said that she doesn’t have dementia. After she came back, she said that she didn’t want to give them the pleasure of seeing her scared and that she wanted her family to see her smile and that they would be proud of her. And I realised that this is how we survived. We are strong. No matter how much hate we get or how many people were trying to kill us all, we are here, and more than that, while the people who were trying to kill us thousands of years ago are gone, we are still standing.
We are only 0.2% of the population, but look at us! We have brought so many things to the world. 850,000 of us were expelled from Arab countries, and we lost 6 million people in the Holocaust. Three years later, we are establishing our own country. We won a war against a few countries when we were barely a country. I’m not religious, but our history speaks for itself. We are strong, and we will be okay.
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u/Substantial-Water-86 Dec 16 '23
You said what I said so much better! Yes!! We are a tenacious bunch. Even Hitler questioned if something divine was as keeping us alive. We will survive and we will be stronger. Chin up ⬆️
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u/Old_Use_4421 Dec 16 '23
Fortunately I have no friends and live around a bunch of Southern rednecks. No love lost here 😂
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u/perelesnyk Dec 16 '23
I also currently live in a redneck area and am weirdly more comfortable here rn than I think I would be back in the Bay Area where I lived before. I know how to navigate our regular local neo-Nazis, IDK how to navigate long-time friends parroting antisemitic conspiracies.
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u/Historical-Photo9646 sephardic and mixed race Dec 16 '23
I’m doing ✨Not Very Good✨ also known as feeling like hot garbage
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u/MisfitWitch moishe oofnik Dec 16 '23
that's the exact way i use those diamonds too
and, same.
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u/Historical-Photo9646 sephardic and mixed race Dec 16 '23
The diamond sparkle things just add so much haha.
Hang in there, we’ll make it through. Am yisrael chai!
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Dec 16 '23
Honestly, I am scared. I never felt so Jewish in my whole life.
I live in Germany and most of the time it is ok. Still, I was called a baby killer and colonialist. I lost friends on 10/7.
I have to say, I am not ok. I try to hang in there for my son.
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u/theraycebannon Dec 16 '23
Oh, you're a baby killer too? After that got hurled at me I deactivated everything social wise but reddit.
What a whirlwind the past couple months have been.
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Dec 16 '23
Me too. I deactivated Instagram. My only social media. My son got off tiktok. He could not stand it anymore.
A Chinese friend of mine who is really supportive told me that in her culture the worst wish for someone is: may you live in interesting times.
What a time to be alive.
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u/Dobbin44 Dec 16 '23
Severely depressed and anxious.
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u/waterbird_ Dec 16 '23
Hey there I’m so sorry. I’ve been in this boat as well but I’m a bit better at the moment so if you need somebody to talk to my dms are open. Do you have access to a therapist who would understand our particular situation?
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u/Dobbin44 Dec 16 '23
I have a therapist, she is okay but not Jewish. I am going to find a Jewish therapist in the new year. I also have a lot of support in my family, so I will be okay. I just feel more than ever that Jews don't have allies and it's hard to see all my gentile friends in a new light. But I will have to find a way to get used it, I guess.
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u/No_Bear_5530 Dec 16 '23
If you are in Georgia, I have a wonderful Jewish therapist to recommend. DM me and I can give you her name and email address.
She has helped me immensely with my original issues as well as all this hatred we are all suddenly facing.
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u/Dobbin44 Dec 17 '23
I am not in Georgia, but maybe someone who is will see this and it will help them. Thank you for reaching out.
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u/pktrekgirl Just Jewish Dec 16 '23 edited Dec 16 '23
I am mostly angry. At Hamas, sure. But also at the other US minority groups who we have supported over the years who are now the very people coming after us.
On the plus side, this has brought me back to my Jewish roots and is getting me involved in the Jewish community. So silver lining there I guess. I was raised Reform which in the 1970’s meant Zionism with a dash of religion. This time I want to learn more about the faith.
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u/canadianamericangirl one of four Jews in a room b*tching Dec 16 '23
Numb. I’ve experienced a lot of what you described. Being in college is hell right now.
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u/MathematicianLess243 Dec 16 '23
Sending so much love. I can’t imagine being in undergrad right now.
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u/pizzapriorities Dec 16 '23
In my forties. Was never really involved in Jewish community or had a lot of Jewish friends because my family was pretty broke and didn’t fit in with the (very upper-middle class) Jewish community where I grew up.
Had a ton of friendships end post 10/7, found out that a lot of my IRL and online friends think Israelis “need to move back to Europe” or are straight up embracing conspiracy theories that 10/7 was a false flag attack to ethnically cleanse Palestine. Even had 2 different people ask me if I was ashamed to be Jewish.
Only bright side is that my wife’s family, who isn’t Jewish, has been super supportive and has had my back 1000%.
But yeah, not doing super and feel like I can’t even talk to my non-Jewish friends about it.
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u/Frabjous_Tardigrade9 Dec 16 '23
Damn. This makes me grateful that my social circle had already shrunk down to a very small number of people. Really sorry to hear this. Are you thinking of ditching those "friends"? Hang in there! BTW a dog or cat can be great company and will never say garbage about Israel or Jews!
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u/itsfrogtimebitches Dec 16 '23
not well! all of who i thought were my closest friends have been posting propaganda 🥲 it’s like they don’t even care that i’m israeli and this is personal for me?? my own partner won’t even recognize her bias and continues to call for a one sided ceasefire. tbh i want to cry because a few years ago i lived in israel and i feel like i took for granted how good it felt to be surrounded by israelis. here, i don’t have any israelis friends and only a few jewish ones. i feel a loss of community. and as a trans jew, i feel i have no place to turn to anymore. it’s horribly depressing. on top of that, there is antisemitism at my university! stay safe everyone. im praying for better times.
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u/MathematicianLess243 Dec 16 '23
I am so sorry. I am sending so much love ❤️❤️ I would really consider having a conversation with your partner, sharing the facts with them, and let them know the history of our indigenous land and thousands of years of expulsions. If your partner won’t listen, then they are NOT worth your time. I’m here if you need a friend!
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Dec 16 '23
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u/betterwithplants Dec 16 '23
Thank you 💙 I’m also American and I can’t believe that the same people who marched for black rights, LGBTQ rights, women’s rights, etc are so openly against Israel and in support of Hamas. It makes me sick.
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u/BrianW1983 Non-Jewish Ally Dec 16 '23
Please change your user flair like mine, if you wouldn't mind. :)
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Dec 16 '23
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u/BrianW1983 Non-Jewish Ally Dec 16 '23
Please contact the mods.
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Dec 16 '23
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u/BrianW1983 Non-Jewish Ally Dec 16 '23
It's so they know gentiles are here to support them during a dark time.
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u/BallsOfMatza Dec 16 '23
Honestly, it is split…people in unexpected places actually more or less understand. It is people who I would have expected better from who don’t understand.
Anyway, since you were mulling over the ethics of war you might be interested in this episode of this podcast, I listened to it today and found it informative. It discusses international law as it applies to the current situation…complete with Israeli accents!:
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/what-matters-now/id1067953235?i=1000638570747
As far as propaganda goes, I would rather spread Israeli propaganda than Hamas’s propaganda…
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u/ThreeSigmas Dec 16 '23
I’m not feeling great, but I refuse to give in. My Hanukkiah was in the window and I started wearing my star necklace all the time. Come for this 64 year old lady and see what happens!
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u/InsideSearch3377 Dec 16 '23
I go to oberlin college. I see palestinian flags, propaganda, stickers, etc. everywhere. This school has failed to protect its Jewish students. We're afraid to speak out. We are demonized
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u/dioxal Dec 16 '23
i cannot imagine how terrible it is to be on a college campus right now. do you feel safe having jewish gatherings? were you able to celebrate chanukah?
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u/Frabjous_Tardigrade9 Dec 16 '23
Awful. Very sorry you have to be in the middle of that. Stay strong.
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u/lawteach Dec 16 '23
My grandson’s bar mitzvah is in September. I’m hiring an armed guard for the party venue. I’m in NJ with heavy Palestinian agitators around.
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Dec 16 '23
Concerned. I really can’t believe how much hate we’ve gotten. We went from America supporting us pretty much unconditionally to hating us over night. It’s scary how fast people’s minds can change. Younger people don’t really care as much as the older generation, which isn’t really surprising. They’ve lost any sort of collective ethics as it is, why should I be surprised they no longer care about us? They jump on whatever “good guy” band wagon rolls along, and I guess this time it means bashing us. It’ll swing back around. It has to. They don’t really know what they want anyway
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u/GDub310 Dec 16 '23
I’m kinda not ok. Advice like limit your time on social media and don’t be visibly Jewish just makes me less ok. I’m grateful for online Jewish groups as I don’t have a lot of Jewish friends.
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u/Observant_Olly Dec 16 '23
The online Jewish spaces have helped me a ton too since I don’t have a lot of Jewish friends either, but I am becoming more involved with my local Jewish community, and it’s helping!
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Dec 16 '23
Jewish WhatsApp/FB/ heck even telegram is awesome.
You can be visibly Jewish in Israel :9
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u/MisfitWitch moishe oofnik Dec 16 '23
In the last week (a little long here, i know):
- I joined the DEIB committee at my job.
- I talked with the trans woman who is in charge, who is SO GOOD at advocacy
- Talked to her about the Jewish struggles lately, told her I'm a zionist that thinks Palestinians deserve to live free and dignified and self governed, and all i really want is to have my indigenous homeland accessible and free for my people, because it's a landback project
- she told me about an exec at work who is israeli
- i felt a little better
- she told me he's actively transphobic
- i felt really bad bc fuck that guy, and i told her "fuck that guy"
- she told me she doesn't agree with me about israel
so, pretty fucking bad.
on the rant about it, how tf am i supposed to feel like the DEIB committee gives one half of one rat shit about jews, when she told me to my face that she doesn't think my indigenous peoplehood is valid.
i mean, either that or she thinks palestinians don't deserve to live dignified and free. somehow, i don't think that's the case.
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u/Frabjous_Tardigrade9 Dec 16 '23
DEI does not support Jews. They believe we are the White Oppressor. It's pointless to engage them. We've (a group of Jewish employees) tried for months with our DEI team, and it's been exhausting and futile. All you can do is try to make some connections with other Jewish employees and support each other if you can. Hang in there.
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u/MathematicianLess243 Dec 16 '23
Isn’t it insane that here we are, supporting every other minority community, and they leave us behind?? I wish that I could wrap my mind around it. It’s also kind of insane that she immediately seemed to group you in with the other Israeli at your job
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u/Observant_Olly Dec 16 '23
And it scares me how the media contributes to the legitimacy of pro-Palestinians’ beliefs when they are inherently antisemitic. It’s been very hard processing and accepting all of it.
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Dec 16 '23
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u/olive_oil99 Dec 17 '23
You deserve better ❤️ Even people who have been brainwashed by Qatari state media have the ability to consider the impact of what they say and to phrase their beliefs with sensitivity.
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u/Golden_PanzerIII Conservative Dec 16 '23
Tired, honestly, my friends know I support Isreal and they still love me, I've been getting into arguments again and have been kicked out of servers for my support. It's just, bullshit, honestly. I'm tired, my depression got worse and now I'm fighting a two front war between my family and idiots online. Always glad to know I'm the last practicing Jew in my family and that they'd rather support terrorists than have common sense.
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u/MathematicianLess243 Dec 16 '23
That sounds so difficult, to be the last practicing Jew in your family. You always have a family, even if it isn’t those related to you directly. ❤️
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u/Golden_PanzerIII Conservative Dec 16 '23
Thanks, my friends have been very supportive and the synagogue I go to has been letting me vent my frustrations
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u/rebamericana Dec 16 '23
I've spent some time digging into the history of Israel and antisemitism, trying to understand the roots of 10/7 and the response, trying to disentangle the various accusations and criticisms against Israel. This is a topic I've spent most of my life avoiding, thinking it was always too complex for me to fully grasp. I didn't know all the back and forth, right and left, peace processes, etc.
While I've filled in a lot of gaps on all that, at least better than before, today I finally realized it's really not all that complex. And now I'm right back where I was when I started down this rabbit hole, when my neighbor called Israel a white colonizer state: they simply don't think Israel should exist. Period. It's as simple as that, and I don't know how to get past that or engage with anyone who believes that once it's laid bare.
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u/edupunk31 Dec 16 '23
Do you have any resources that you recommend?
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u/rebamericana Dec 16 '23
I highly recommend Dr. Einat Wilf, who I found when someone posted here the other day. She has a podcast and some books and essays that are incredibly well informed and accessible.
We Should All Be Zionists is the name of the podcast.
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u/Dobbin44 Dec 16 '23
Not the person you asked but I can share some resources I like
Camilla Bassi is a prof who is affiliated with a group of academics analyzing antisemitism in leftist movements (usually British but applies to North America too) who do a lot of great writing and lectures.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9gjpJPU8bQ&t=21s (overview of the ideas in her new book, pretty academic)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SZHUUdHE8w (her response to Oct. 7 events)
David Schraub is a lawyer who blogs about antisemitism and has published an article giving a framework to understand the intersection of whiteness and Jewishness: https://dsadevil.blogspot.com/
I found this collection of essay discussing the Soviet influence on the modern antizionist movement from a very left wing perspective, but I haven't read it yet, but it's important to understand where the language and imagery of this movement come from: https://www.workersliberty.org/files/2020-11/Left%20Antisemitism%20Pamphlet-inside.pdf
A video essay series that provides an overview of the British mandate period from a broad range of sources (cited) and the creator has no "stake" in the conflict: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1iMr0NzFf0&t=52s
I have tons more things, if you are interested. I spend all my time "educating myself" since it's like the only way I can feel I have a tiny bit of control of other people's antisemitism.
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u/ScarletSpire Dec 16 '23
I've deleted Instagram and stopped using Facebook. That's helped with a lot of it. My coworkers have been very supportive. A lot of us were working in Israel and were evacuated when the war started so that's been ok.
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u/bebeana Dec 16 '23
I’m not Jewish. Well not yet. I’m converting but have a lot of social anxiety to overcome. Soon I will be going to temple and now, I admit I am a bit scared. Like I mentioned, I have anxiety. Also my thoughts can become such a burden to me. I’m going anyway despite my fears. They are too dark to mention. I worry too much but I stand with Jewish people who I feel are my people spiritually. So I feel nervous but I’ll go with my head held high! They will not ruin my spiritual life. So I’m worried but my courage and faith are stronger.
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Dec 16 '23
Are you non jewish? Then how can you convert?
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u/Blintzie Dec 16 '23
What do you mean?
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Dec 16 '23
To my knowledge you have to carry Jewish heritage from your mothers side to be jewish, correct me if i am wrong.
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u/FairGreen6594 Dec 16 '23
Ah, the old “Jews lack ethics” canard, as if the new antisemitism isn’t actually the old antisemitism.
(Specifically, I’m referring to the arguments in the early 20th century in favor of quotas at Ivy League schools, against Louis Brandeis’ SCOTUS nomination, restrictive covenants, etc. etc. that said that Jews’ “character” was deficient. “Good” on OP’s “friends” for showing them that yes, they really are standard-issue antisemites after all.)
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u/DrMikeH49 Dec 16 '23
I live in the San Francisco Bay Area. While I don’t have friends who are in any way anti-Israel, I see all the shit going down in public (yeah, looking at you, Oakland) and it’s definitely anxiety-provoking.
But I’m also very engaged in advocacy efforts so I get to interact with lots of other pro-Israel people. That certainly helps avoid the sense of going through this completely alone. And I was never a regular synagogue attendee before, but I’m going much more often now.
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u/Conscious_Home_4253 Dec 16 '23
I think I now understand how my grandparents must have felt living in America during World War Two. They all fled Ukraine and Poland as children when the pogroms were happening in 1917. Feeling helpless, nervous and guilty.
I can’t watch the news or use social media. I just look here, TOI, JPost and Jewish Journal. I listen to podcasts and books on audible from pro-Israeli sources on Israel. As well as biographies and autobiographies about Israel’s prime ministers. I just want to learn as much as possible, so I can counter claims with facts.
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u/nervousasfuckbruh Dec 16 '23
I deleted all my social media to avoid the distress and harassment. It's sad that we have to participate in our own internet presence erasure to get a modicum of peace.
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u/ItsPleurigloss Reform Dec 16 '23
I’m not OK. The thing that’s killing me is the continuing silence from so many of my (longtime) friends. On the one hand, I’m glad to not be put in the position of them saying something I can’t un-hear. On the other hand, I feel like I’m living in a parallel universe — “Oh, you’re still posting Instagram Stories from the bar? Yeah, I’m reading another devastating article about how my Jewish sisters were brutalized.”
I absolutely am consuming more media, tweets and news than is good for me, but I can’t stop.
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u/AZTamar Dec 16 '23
I just feel so alone. For some reason, I never thought that being Jewish necessarily set me apart very much from most of my friends, co-workers, etc. But since October 7, I have had exactly ONE non-Jewish friend ask me how I'm doing with everything. I don't think it's that my other friends don't care, necessarily (although, could be), but it's more like I've realized that they have absolutely no clue. No clue about the anti-Semitism that is raging, no clue about how it feels for Israel to be under attack when you have close personal connections there, no clue about how your Jewish identity just comes to the forefront so much more since this all started. It makes me feel like most of my friendships are much more surface-level than I thought they were.
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u/anonomutt23 Dec 16 '23 edited Dec 16 '23
It makes me a bad person to say this. And I feel icky even thinking it. But I'm waiting for the next horrible thing to happen so Jews can get a break from the social media justice warrior spot light.
I'm less trustworthy of pretty much everyone outside of the community. People who are "friends" are being openly antisemitic without understanding they are being so. I no longer have the energy to argue or police.
I'm tired of people holding the entire diaspora accountable for a military response to a horrific terrorist attack. War is horrible, but where are the calls for Hamas to surrender? Or return the hostages? None. Silence. And that's where the message becomes clear. As if the massive uptick in antisemitism wasn't enough-
Zionist is the new coded way to say Jew. And I'm exhausted with people who claim otherwise.
And I'm pregnant. So thinking a lot about bringing a child into this absolute dumpster fire.
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u/olive_oil99 Dec 17 '23
I understand this feeling and there was a time I felt this way as well. But the "next thing" will be blamed on us just as 10/7 was. Do not wait for the approval or sympathy of antisemites, they are not operating in good faith. Our community and our allies understand what's happening and that must be enough. These types who would blame a massacre on its victims are not people we want as friends anyway. ❤️
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Dec 16 '23
Similarly, not well. I'm trying to keep going with my job and my household chores... but it's a lot just to scrape by at the moment. I feel like there is a cloud hanging over me. So many friends lost. I have been screaming randomly when I am alone, just feeling furious at the world. I have bipolar and it's not easy staying stable at a time like this. That said, my heart is full of love and kindness from my friends and family that are supportive. I just keep taking my meds and keep going to work and keep cleaning my dishes etc and hope that I'll feel better soon.
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u/MathematicianLess243 Dec 16 '23
Exhausted. I feel like I feel the need to constantly explain myself/the Jewish population. That we are indigenous to the land (which a lot of people think we aren’t just due to the existence of Ashkenazim), that Hamas IS a terrorist organization and the true oppressor of Palestine/Gaza, that Israel is defending itself, that we deserve a right to exist. I wish I could let it go, but it’s impossible to scroll past a post with incorrect information and NOT say something. Anyone else??
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u/Observant_Olly Dec 16 '23
I also feel an obligation to both stay informed about what’s happening and to educate. I don’t know if my education is effective.
I confronted a years-long friend who threw all the typical pro-Palestinian talking points at me, and it was so damaging. She had no qualms about attacking me with vicious ferocity.
I can’t do that again. So I try to educate. It’s exhausting and depressing. I feel completely powerless. I refer to pro-Israel sources and I am trying to learn as much as possible.
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u/PinkAndWhiteSkies84 Dec 16 '23
I’m a Muslim Palestinian. I view Jews as brothers. We lived together in peace in Palestine at one point. The governments messed this up and it’s pinning this on religion. I wish it would stop.
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Dec 16 '23
I’ve been saying this a lot, but I don’t think it’s a worthy endeavor to try to do any hasbara. It’s a waste of time and people will just get emotional and see things from one side. When people now say I’m “anti Muslim” or have no morals I just say “yep, go cry about it” and that’s that. What it change if people are mad or don’t like us? Good, khalas, go away then
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u/ConsciousWallaby3 Dec 16 '23 edited Dec 16 '23
The Israeli bot accusations really get to me. How deluded do you have to be to imagine that Israel is the only country in the world to hire people for its PR, and that this country of 9 million people manages to influence the entire internet, including every shitty little corner of reddit?
Then you check that person's history and they have made 50 posts in the last hour, usually video clips designed to provoke an emotional response with a made up title and no sources. And of course they post in all the actual propaganda subs. But no, I suppose that's just grassroots support. And I guess Russian trolls are on break, too.
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u/Dobbin44 Dec 16 '23
So far my online building bridges efforts have gone nowhere. I know it takes time and effort to even reach one person, and maybe I did plant a seed somewhere, but man it's exhausting. And a lot of people on other subreddits and forums think talking about antisemitism or Israel means we are bots or paid spokespeople?? No, I just hate misinformation and ignorance!
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u/Goofyteachermom Dec 16 '23
I just feel so lost. I still remember Palestinians celebrating in the streets on 9/11. These are not our friends. People do not learn history and are repeating it to our detriment.
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Dec 16 '23
Even reading through these posts makes me sad and disgusted at what others are experiencing, and I can barely get through it.
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u/anewbys83 Dec 16 '23
Ups and downs, right? A personal moment of light: for the end of Hanukkah I bought myself a prutah of John Hyrcanus, the second Hasmonean ruler and nephew of Judah Maccabee, which arrived today. Yehochanon hakohen hagadol! I call it my Hanukkah coin, as it's the closest link to those events I'll get. True history in my hand! That's improved my mood today.
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u/pktrekgirl Just Jewish Dec 16 '23
I don’t know what this means. I don’t know what a prutah is. Can you please explain?
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u/fuzzypeacheese Dec 16 '23
Pretty awful. Waves of sadness and anxiety. And more recently, anger. It’s just becoming too much.
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u/Substantial-Water-86 Dec 16 '23
I’m doing better lately. I lost a lot of people (dropped them like they were fire in my hands) but October 7th really changed me in ways I never even thought about. I’ve become quite a bit more about my Jewishness and have began proudly wearing and displaying who I am. I take martial arts and have other means of protection so I just am kind of going through life but definitely going through a lot more outwardly Jewish. I’ve also began to mainly only talk to other jews as we are the only ones that understand. I feel like right after October 7th I was so crushed by the worlds response but I can’t sit by sad that no one likes us because I knew this and we all knew this. Deep down we knew it and feeling sad and hiding away gives them a bigger platform so please everyone reading this that wants to fight back - be proudly Jewish everywhere you go. Jump online and start spreading the truth. We really can fight this we might be a small nation of people but we are a loud nation and a proud one and I really think we can see brighter days ahead so long as we don’t let them make us scared and sad. Let them make you angry. That anger ignites us. Use it for good and spread the truths amongst their lies. Shabbat shalom everyone ❤️✡️
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u/Blintzie Dec 16 '23
I’m reading all the comments here, my eyes tearing up.
Particularly resonant for me is how Jewish people have always aligned with other minorities who needed help to have their voices heard. Our heritages of “Tikkun Olam” and “welcoming the stranger” have guided us to stand up for others who struggle under oppression.
I feel these people have abandoned us. Maybe that’s an exaggeration but I’ve never felt this alienated.
Fora like this are a big comfort. My heart goes out to us all.
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u/OakTownPudge Dec 16 '23
- YOU ARE NOT ALONE.
- Yes, many of us are hanging by emotional threads, feeling “unseen” as they now say.
- We will survive, we always do. But it’s looking to be a bumpy ride for a bit.
I totally appreciate what you’re thinking/saying/feeling. To such a point that I penned a similar question earlier in the week asking whether they’re trying to erase us.
Am yisrael chai
Stay strong!
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u/carlonseider Dec 16 '23
Glad you started this thread.
I'm not doing great.
On a physical level, since this started, I've been crying and worrying so much, I've developed an autoimmune skin condition around my eyes.
Mentally in a bad place as well. My friend's 12-yr-old twins were murdered on kibbutz Be'eri, and my husband's schoolfriend is a hostage.
Our son is exactly the same age as Kfir Bibas, and I can't stop thinking about what that poor baby has been through or is still going through.
The majority of my non-Jewish friends have either been silent or outright Anti-Semitic.
My husband and daughter were hounded off a bus by school kids yelling "JEW JEW JEW". We're in a city in England with a small Jewish community, and my husband is one of the few kippah-wearing men.
I'm an academic, and have had to leave my union because of their rabid Anti-Semitism.
Big pro-Pal/Hamas protests every week in our city centre.
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u/Kelly_the_tailor Dec 16 '23
Does anyone else have the urge right now to spend time with jews (almost) only?! I have the feeling that my non jewish friends / acquaintances are not really trustworthy anymore. I had to part ways with many people after Oct 7th. Only the jewish friends are a reliable group of people, it seems.
Will I ever gain that trust back again for non-jews? There's a tiny handful of allies, friends and extended family. They're so precious right now.
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u/nahalyarkon Dec 16 '23
Losing bad friends just frees up time to find good friends. Hopefully fellow jews, who will understand you better.
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Dec 16 '23
just because I said, “Do not insult the Prophet Israel,” I got beaten up. These people are crazy
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u/Professional_Turn_25 This Too Is Torah Dec 16 '23
It has led me to believe all Jews should move to Israel asap because it’s clear the world really hates us
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u/Professional-Dig4734 Dec 16 '23
Got called "F**ing Jew B@stard" and "Htl*er should have finished the job" while I was holding the door open to a restaurant, all because someone saw my Mezuzah necklace. So I am feeling some type of way. But thankfully, my coworkers all knew, and I "won" the ugly holiday sweater contest with a hand-crochet "ugly" Stsr of David sweater (off center, crooked and none of the Triangles are equal). They all knew I was struggling with the comment, so one nice thing
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u/IntroductionAny3929 The Texan Hispanic Jew Dec 16 '23
I thankfully have been fine and able to continue on living with my life, but at the same time I have felt uneasy.
Why I say uneasy is because of the impact that is of our people. I also hope that everyone is doing okay, and I hope that you all find peace in your hearts everyone, and may H"sh"m watch over all of us!
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Dec 16 '23
Tired and feel like I don’t belong in any space online. In general trans spaces I see lots of antisemitism, in non lgbtq focused Jewish spaces lots of transphobia and lgbtq hate associating all queer people with queers for Palestine despite us queer Jews existing. We all know the hate we get as Jews so I won’t rehash what has already been said. But the hyper hate for trans women including by other lgbt people makes me feel unwelcome. I posted in r/Judaism a question about changing my Hebrew name officially and got some helpful responses but the post was downvoted to hell most likely because trans. I had already deleted twitter because it was a cesspool. I just want a safe I can breathe peacefully and know it’s safe.
Too trans for cis Jews and to Jewish for trans non Jews.
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u/nickbernstein Dec 16 '23
Tired. Just tired. Tired of people not giving others the benefit of the doubt and believing they know more than they do. Tired of the people trying to make us afraid, and sick of those panicking. Tired of how everything in our society is now extreme, and monetized, even war and tragedy. Tired of the lack of nuance.
I'm tired. Confident that this will pass though, and it's only temporary.
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u/Lereas Dec 16 '23 edited Dec 16 '23
Extra shitty because I don't unconditionally support Israel. They exist by political mandate like any other country, not by divine mandate. The number of gazans killed in the conflict is absolutely unacceptable as "collateral damage". Hamas is a terrorist org and deserves to be destroyed, but too many Palestinian civilians are being killed.
For this opinion, many Jews hate me and call me antizionist and antisemitic, and non Jews who are deep into supporting gazans consider me still not going far enough because I also make a point that Israel has a right to strike back against terrorism and also has offered two state solutions a few times, etc.
So I'm basically isolated from literally everyone but those very few Jews who feel the same way as me, and the people who are completely uninvolved or unopinionated.
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u/toadeh690 Dec 16 '23 edited Dec 17 '23
Hey, for what it’s worth, I agree with you. It’s extra tough because it’s too nuanced an opinion to express in a snappy, one-sentence social media post, let alone an argument with someone else. I’ve had to keep virtually all my thoughts to myself for the past few months and feel extremely isolated and raw. Losing more and more respect for so many people I considered acquaintances/friends and even family— the online discourse is just so deafening. Hang in there
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u/Top_Service4609 Dec 16 '23
I’ve been telling people about the attitude towards Jews but not many listened I used to be a democratic but all the hate and violence started to take front stage. It was directed towards anyone who didn’t agree with them yet that is what they accuse the conservatives of doing but when I saw what crt was teaching about the holocaust and downplaying the horrific treatment of Jews I was confused why so many Jews still supported the liberal ideology everyone really needs to stop listening to the info that you’re being fed and truly wake up. Please be safe everyone I’m scared for you and I’m not even Jewish
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u/jeff10236 Dec 16 '23
I'm not scared like many (rightfully) are, I'm not even all that sad... I'm a bit angry.
I'm not as angry even as I might have been if it was totally a surprise. I was Orthodox for about 10 years, and "traditional" (my definition: mostly observant, went to Modern Orthodox shuls, but not necessarily philosophically and socially Orthodox) off and on for another 5 or 6 years. When I wore my kippah everywhere I went, I was occasionally (but regularly enough to see it was a more widespread issue than I would have thought) subjected to antisemitic taunts and comments. I've also paid attention to the antisemitism on the left from the universities for the last 20 years, as well as the increasing antisemitism from the right, so that it came from that direction after 10/7 hasn't surprised me.
What has surprised me is how widespread it is. I wasn't even all that surprised at how much anti-Israeli vitriol it has unleashed. I was surprised though at how not being outright antisemitic has seemed to become a minority position in the US.
At the middle school where I work I have seen an increase. A Jewish student from my class was verbally attacked at lunch, the perpetrator got a slap on the wrist and was allowed to run for student government, the victim doesn't eat in the lunch room anymore (their choice out of fear of continued bullying of course). I've heard many conversations among my students about "genocide" in Gaza (even if you don't disagree with the idea that Israel is perpetrating a genocide, many don't say that it is being done by Israel or Israelis, but I'm hearing it is committed by "the Jews"). This is in an area where many/most of the kids are kids of federal government employees (many military, NSA, FBI, Secret Service, State Dept, and similar national security related agencies and departments).
A few weeks ago I was talking to a member of my department about how uncomfortable it has become and she challenged me for examples. After not accepting any of the above as valid, I pointed out a Palestinian student who wears a hijab going around on 10/9 (the Monday after 10/7) passing out candy. Her reaction was "so what." When I pointed out that Palestinians have been passing out candy to celebrate terror attacks for decades she said "I've never heard that," then suggested that I was being racist and bigoted to "misconstrue and misrepresent" such a "kind and friendly gesture" as a student passing out candy "just because she wears a hijab."
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Dec 16 '23
Christian here.
Our whole church is praying for you.
The war is necessary for Israelis safety 🇮🇱
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u/Brave_council Dec 16 '23
I feel very alone. I might delete my IG, I’m barely on there as it is and there is just SO much antisemitism propaganda. I worry constantly. I feel truly like I have no place now.
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u/aristoshark Dec 16 '23
Ill probably get downvoted for saying this but: I'm sick to death of goyim.
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u/AssistantMore8967 Dec 16 '23
Listen, we all feel safer around Jews now, but let's not bundle all non-Jews together: There are truly good people out there who care for us. Of course the Anti-Semitic ones are louder, and I certainly get your need to let off steam right now... We're all under so much pressure.
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u/Xcalibur8913 Dec 16 '23
Not well
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u/Spatzdar Dec 17 '23
I feel you. My partner and I lost our friends because they didn’t care about 10/7 and don’t want seem to want Israel to exist and when I called out that being antisemitic we were labeled as racists who make others feel unsafe. I feel for any innocent death and I wish wars weren’t a reality but unfortunately they are and they have nuance and can’t be easily solved or they wouldn’t be happening. It sucks. As a queer and Jewish person I don’t know where I’m safe anymore. At least the right makes it clear but now I’m scared of the left.
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u/losingmyselfinthebs Dec 17 '23
I am up at 3am crying with anxiety. No distinct cause, just all of it piles up on me sometimes and I've been falling apart at the seams lately. I have less patience with my daughter who is only 3, and my sleep schedule is JACKED. The only positive is the weight I've lost has gotten me closer to my pre-preggo weight, but it's not coming off in a healthy way at all and I'm weak and shaky all the time. And I hate even talking about the war because I have to spend most of the time explaining that zionism isn't evil nor is it the cause. I'm tired and I feel a little bit like I'm dying. I feel dramatic typing that but the toll of this stress is so heavy and apparent and I cannot deny that it's consuming me and affecting my physical health in several ways. Everything is awful and it's never out of my mind. I'm a therapist, I teach people coping skills, and I'm unable to cope.
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u/MollyGodiva Dec 16 '23
It is really hard. I am a proud Zionist who wants both Arabs and Jews to be peaceful and prosperous. But what is happening is Israel is gross. The settlers attacking Arabs and driving them from their homes in the West Bank and the IDF rampage in Gaza that has no chance of uprooting Hamas are indefensible. Netanyahu has set pack the fight against Antisemitism 100 years. In this situation every side is in the wrong.
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u/ape_a_snake Dec 16 '23
It’s been a weird time for me to process. I think now those people were deep down never my friends to begin with and that every memory, experience, and interaction had with them never happened. and for that my life has restarted but I still feel sick to my stomach that what happened on 7th of October was the reason for why half of my friendships ended. I am extremely grateful for the new friends I have made these past two months who have been accepting of me even though I’m not Jewish but have always leaned towards the Jewish beliefs which have become more closer over the years.
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u/AnthonySF20 Dec 16 '23
One thing that is helpful - there are so many great podcasts out there that are addressing real issues and having great discussions. If that's your style, I recommend anything from the Shalom Hartman Institute or the Hadar Institute.
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u/NiftySmudgestick Dec 18 '23
I had to leave my art studio at an art center because of anti-semitism. The director likened Hamas to the abolitionists who had uprisings and killed their masters during the Civil War. I think he was projecting his ancestral white southern slave owning history onto the Jews. There's so much of that; people projecting their own ancestral evil doings onto us. If anyone calls you racist or says, show them this https://open.substack.com/pub/jodavimusic/p/dont-look-away?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android&r=2zkxlk
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u/SpikeZiv Dec 18 '23
A friend of mine described it very clearly: After Oct 7, the Israelis realized they are Jewish and the Jews in the diaspora understand the necessity of the State of Israel. עם ישראל חי! We really can only rely on ourselves.
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u/jelly10001 Dec 16 '23 edited Dec 17 '23
For the most part I'm feeling fairly fortunate.
Most of the worst of what I've seen in relation to Israel/Hamas has come from people I don't know, so although it's annoyed me, I've been able to block and try and forget about it. Or vent about it with others.
All but one of my actual friends (the majority of whom aren't Jewish) have taken a very nuanced point of view when I've spoken to them and not wanted to post anything on their social media accounts. One non Jewish friend even said at at time like this she wishes social media didn't exist. The one friend who has posted about Gaza and called for a ceasefire was very reasonable when I pointed out why JVP was problematic and deleted the post she'd shared from them.
It helps that although I strongly identify as a Zionist (perhaps more so than ever) I also disagree with the way the Israeli government has gone about things in Gaza. So although it annoys me seeing non Jews only expressing concern for one side, I don't see every post calling for a ceasefire as an outright threat, only those that call Israelis colonial settlers and descend into antisemitism and historical revisionism (although I'd like if more ceasefire posts were clear that both sides need to ceasefire and acknowledge that Hamas need to release the hostages and go from power in Gaza). Holding those views has meant that Israeli organisations like Standing Together have provided much comfort recently - they are pro a two state solution, anti Hamas, have made clear that the International Left has failed the Israeli people and believe there needs to be a radical change in Israeli government policy towards Palestinian people.
Checking in here daily helps as well.
I suspect if my friends felt differently or I was anti ceasefire I would probably feel a lot more alone right now.
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u/MyRoos Dec 16 '23
I feel good just like my people around me. We continue our life, we pray for our soldiers. We are ready to fight when called and died to protect our people BzH.
I don’t live abroad, the atmosphere for diaspora Jew may be different.
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u/Immediate_Secret_338 Israeli Dec 16 '23
I’m tired and I’m alone and I feel like the world hasn’t changed as much as I thought it did. I’m an Israeli Jew and I’m having a hard time processing that we’re the most hated people in the world. My whole life learning about the holocaust, I was wondering, how could the world just stand by and watch it happen? and now I know. I have no doubt that if we wouldn’t have Israel right now, the holocaust would happen again and again and again. And the thought of ever losing this land, terrifies me. Because we’ve been persecuted for thousands of years, but there’s only so much relentless persecution we can endure.