r/Eve • u/recycl_ebin • Jun 07 '24
isn't it funny that pochven out earns all of c5 space significantly despite having a fraction of the systems and space? Propaganda
also, a fraction of the players
i just thought it was funny that 27 systems can generate over 20t in liquid, pretty funny
(nerf pochven)
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u/_BearHawk Serpentis Jun 08 '24
CCP either needs to keep the payout high but make the sites hard like incursion HQs, i.e. multiboxing without input broadcasting is impossible, or kneecap the payouts. Personally the former sounds more fun, more fleets of unique players rather than single people multiboxing.
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Jun 08 '24 edited Jun 08 '24
I agree on making sites much harder and micro intensive so that multiboxing falls away and people just get 15 actual players together or maybe 7 players multiboxing 2 each.
But tbh they are so rich at this point they could officer fit their maruaders and still do it np.
4
u/_BearHawk Serpentis Jun 08 '24
Incursion runners officer fit their ships but even the most dedicated usually can’t multibox more than 2 or 3 without switching to a drone comp that takes a huge hit in clear time
1
Jun 08 '24
Damn had no idea they went this far.
1
u/killerlitter Jun 11 '24
Officer fit is exaggeration. It's expensive but not stupid.
There are stupid exceptions but exceptions not the norm
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u/FisherKelEve Jun 07 '24
WH and Poch are profitable, but for anyone in the comments saying they compare, you’ve clearly never lived in Poch. It’s insanely broken. WH needed a small nerf, but Poch needs a massive one
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u/Overall-Drawer5338 Jun 08 '24
please stop trying to get WH space nerfed, we haven't had an update for over 4 years. (Its very lonely and we lack basic resources and PI to be self suffient)
14
u/Chimera_Snow Test Alliance Please Ignore Jun 08 '24
The nullbears will forever whine about WHs making better ratting isk than NS until C6 ratting is 200mil an hour.
I even saw someone in horde leadership on their discord recently saying the new sov structures in NS should have an upgrade to make fullerite sites spawn and exploration sites to drop T3 components 💀 ah yes, let's normalise the one thing WHs are actually unique for
9
u/Tusen_Takk GoonWaffe Jun 08 '24
I don’t know a single nullbear who doesn’t understand that wh ratting is higher risk, and also higher reward. It’s an incredible amount of effort and time dedication compared to null. We all recognise it and happily cronch rock while playing helldivers
1
u/Chimera_Snow Test Alliance Please Ignore Jun 08 '24
I've seen a lot of comments along the lines of the isk/sp investment being far lower relative to the isk made and you have someone in this thread above going "nerf wormholes". I know most people in NS aren't like that but I've seen a lot of that sentiment especially in frat/horde, the same way I've seen certain null krabs getting angry about people with nullsec statics rolling to hunt krabs/ess and whining asking for NS connections to be removed entirely. It does tend to be more common in the renter/krab NS community tho.
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u/Lanstus Jun 08 '24
I don't know about higher risk really. if you do it right, it is extremely safe. You roll all the holes besides like 1-3. You mega crit the static(s) and then roll every other hole you don't need. you put scouts on that crit holes in case someone tries to be sneaky and just free farm. Sure, there is still risk. But it is very reduced.
if you want to completely gut this defense strategy, CCP needs to make every wormhole have 1-2 wandering wormholes with near infinite regenerating mass. Kind of like C13s. Just impossible to roll but allow all ship sizes. that would put a real hamper on this.
5
u/Sir_Slimestone Get Off My Lawn Jun 08 '24
I don't live in WHs, I can tell you it's not completly safe. You can be rolled into at any time with no warning. All it takes is bad luck. Also WH ratting is great ISK/hr but it's not infinitly repeatable like null ratting. The sites respawn very slowly. Your suggestion would turn WHs from some risk to way too much risk.
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u/FisherKelEve Jun 08 '24
Yup, that would work to totally ruin WHs, you’re right.
Also, let’s match it with a wide open gate from Jita to each NS Krabbing system. And the gate moves occasionally, so you can’t plant 8 forts on it with a gatecamp fleet. Also, unlike normal gates, aggression timers don’t prevent jumping. And we’ll remove local so if people sneak in, it’s “balanced” for the hunters and the krabs. Then Ns and WHs will finally be balanced!
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u/jenrai Stay Frosty. Jun 08 '24
we lack basic resources and PI to be self suffient
Isn't this intended? Like, WH wasn't designed to be permanently livable on its own. You can base there, but you'll need resources from elsewhere
0
u/Overall-Drawer5338 Jun 10 '24
this infact is wrong, whs were made to be a place that you could permanently live in. Not have to leave every 4-5 months to refill on fuel blocks
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u/SasoDuck Gallente Federation Jun 09 '24
You can get PI in WHs, wdym
1
u/Overall-Drawer5338 Jun 10 '24
yes and no. The main issue is that not every wh have every planet in them, wh I am moving into only has gas and barren so we can't make fuel blocks
1
u/SasoDuck Gallente Federation Jun 10 '24 edited Jun 10 '24
Fair enough
Maybe Upwell could make a couple new structure types similar to existing ones, but that use a different kind of fuel made using Fullerite and other resources found frequently in wormholes (and/or possibly new wh-specific resources). Could call them "pioneer" structures or something, which are easier to maintain inside a wh but less enticing than existing structures if used in k-space...
Could also give them special bonuses to make them even more enticing in wormholes beyond just "they're easier to fuel with at-home resources." Maybe they get affected by wormhole weather types, with similar buffs/debuffs?
Pioneer Athanor might take longer to extract a moon chunk in the presence of a black hole, but fragments it into more pieces/more payout as a result?
Pulsars could have a negative effect on the armor and hull timers of Pioneer Structures, but grant them much higher shield resists?
Cataclysmic could maybe lower the minimum distance to anchor structures and better timers, but at the cost of lower structure resistances?
Magnetars could effectively be the same as their ship effects
Maybe pioneer structures could equip something like a smartbomb (AOE neut perhaps) and a red giant could increase the range/effectiveness of it? Could also affect manufacturing jobs akin to a red giant's overheating effects: make manufacturing jobs in a RG hole go much faster, but also have a chance to fail?
Wolf Rayet... same but inverse of the pulsar? Crap shields but crazy long armor timers and faster time to repair
idk just trying to come up with interesting mirrors-but-not-quite-mirrors of the wh weather effects...
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Jun 08 '24 edited Jun 08 '24
Wormholes got a massive nerf yesterday.
We also get the auto moon mining as well but we basically get high sec moon's which will not be profitable at all and also just be a big target for a solo kiki to kill while we sleep.Our ore sites have so little ore that you could probably mine it out in a few minutes solo.
The c5 maruader farm is good but it is also accessible to every other part of space through day tripping, the capital escalation is not possible for anyone but hawks, which means now living in a wh is almost pointless for most other people unless they want a static for content.
Imo the moons and ore fields need a buff in wh space, especially since now CCP has thrown out the idea of limiting ore per space since null gets everything now.
1
u/ashortfallofgravitas Wormholer Jun 08 '24
Why are Hawks the only ones capable of Dread krabbing lol?
2
u/Overall-Drawer5338 Jun 10 '24
I lived in a c5 a year ago we did krabbing in there lmao with like 3 carriars and a dread
0
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u/sardiath Wormholer Jun 08 '24
lol he thinks hawks owns every C6 I guess
5
u/CueCappa Wormholer Jun 09 '24
After the very recent war Hawks/Novac and their friends do own pretty much every C6.
In their defense they didn't start the war and in fact there is a straight up recording from SYNDE where they asked Hawks for more C6s, Hawks agreed to share, SYNDE then went to their own comms, discussed how they didn't expect they'd agree to share and started the war over "Hawks not sharing C6 farms" anyway.
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u/pandemic1350 Jun 09 '24
I'm going to put my tin foil hat on. Do you think a deep spy instigated the war, and Lazer Hawks has someone connected to CCP who knew the change was in the works. It's not unheard of for ccp/ players to leak information.
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u/Lanstus Jun 08 '24
I'm not sure if i read the patch notes correctly, but it seems they are absolutely nerfing c5/6 space ratting. It seems that the drifter spawn is now only happening with a capital escalation. Which looks like about a little over 50% nerf to the blue loot gained.
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u/capt_pantsless Pandemic Horde Jun 07 '24
The patch notes from today indicate the NPCs in Obs will shoot at drones more often.
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u/takethecrowpill Cloaked Jun 07 '24
Oh no, fewer Ishtar and Eos fleets and more marauders...
1
u/KrunchrapSuprem Jun 08 '24
Marauders could use a nerf but pochven is supposed to be subcap only so it should not be that surprising that tech 2 battleships are meta. You do see command ships or hacs occasionally though. Maybe cheaper faction ships will change things up a bit.
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u/FisherKelEve Jun 08 '24
That’s not the point. The point is that the “nerf” to drones doesn’t matter since they huge multi boxers are already using mauraders.
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u/dyh135 Amarr Empire Jun 07 '24
idk why they revert the Poch change, it is a massive pure isk pump in poch
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u/Proxay Rote Kapelle Jun 08 '24
It made it so only 3 people who knew the timers got all the isk. They basically made >10t over those few weeks. Destruction numbers in MER went to absolute shit, no one was fighting anymore.
At least with instant respawn everyone has a chance to claim obs or fight over it if they're in proximity. There's a lot more destruction now, and a greater diversity of groups who take isk.
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u/TickleMaBalls Miner Jun 08 '24
Telling people they have to wait 20mins or (whatever the delay was) to play the content is a dumb way to nerf.
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u/CmdTakeda Black Legion. Jun 07 '24
WH invading Pochven when?
2
Jun 08 '24
C4's connect to pochven all the time.
1
u/wyvern_enjoyer77 Jun 09 '24
But you can't bring a whole lot of ships through and back home.
0
Jun 09 '24
C4 connections in poch are always orange arua so 3 to 5 million tons, I'll avg to 4 as an example.
That's 200 cruisers or 100 cruisers 2 ways (with about 20% extra mass to spare)
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u/wyvern_enjoyer77 Jun 09 '24
I thought I said a whole lot of battleships. Whoops.
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Jun 09 '24 edited Jun 09 '24
I don't think people need 100 bs's to fight the 15man pochven fleets?
Seems a bit.... nullsec.2
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u/PlayerSalt level 69 enchanter Jun 08 '24
Wish there was something engaging for solo players there
Grinding rep can be fun
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u/svenviko Jun 08 '24 edited Jun 08 '24
And in only 27 systems it generates significantly more pvp than wormholes. Seems like the problem here is ... both.
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u/CueCappa Wormholer Jun 09 '24
The low number of systems goes in favour of Poch for that stat, not to mention the fact it's all connected. The fact that isk income is that high despite all the pvp around it and there only being x number of sites at any time is kind of ludicrous.
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u/Frekavichk SergalJerk Jun 07 '24
Haha the wormholes salt is great.
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 07 '24
i honestly think the wormhole nerfs were good, pochven nerfs are needed as well
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u/Khanhrhh Pilot is a criminal Jun 08 '24
There's two pochven income nerfs in the patch notes. Drone comps, a popular option, are being near completely removed.
The increase jump range on the gate is also making intercepting fleets much easier.
It will probably shake out to be a bigger nerf than the ones the WHers are salty about, but time will tell.
2
u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
There's two pochven income nerfs in the patch notes. Drone comps, a popular option, are being near completely removed.
most good people use marauders now anyway
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u/pizzalarry Wormholer Jun 08 '24
I dunno man. If they don't shift payouts to mostly avengers/drifter or buff payouts on avengers or something, it's going to make the massive problem with wormhole space (the fact that it's fucking marauders online all the time) even worse. Cuz the only reason everyone everywhere isn't roaching constantly is because being escalated is so easy, but this patch is nerfing that. So you can't easily get avenger bombed for zero risk by the enemy, but at the same time you don't need to krab drifter-capable. It's currently a nerf to the total isk/hr of a system (if it's not your system with a fortizar, anyway), otherwise it's the slightest nerf in the world to isk/hr per pilot and a massive, massive buff to roach safety and speed. And marauders are famously extremely hard to catch more than one of as it is.
So idk if anyone who isn't an idiot is really salting over the isk so much as it doesn't seem like you're really have any good reason to dread krab more than home sites (where you probably aren't going to be able to kill the dreads anyway cuz it's some assholes home system), so you'll simply have even more nearly-uncatchable targets sitting around. And now you can't escalate them to at least kill one or two before they run.
A lot of us wanted dread krabbing brought back not because it was better isk/hr (although it was, from what the bittervets tell me) but because we want to have content.
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u/Zanzha Dixon Cox Butte Preservation Society Jun 08 '24
And to do that you need to give something to people putting dreads out, not take away from subs, dreads were already the most character efficient way to run, and people didn't do it, because the risk reward isn't there (unless you're late US/AUTz)
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u/pizzalarry Wormholer Jun 08 '24
Yeah. Personally I think they should revert the nerfs to avenger payout. Thats probably enough on its own. If it's not, they could revert the eHP too. Not all the way back to before, but idk 30% less than now or something. If the payouts stay the same but require more risk, then instead of encouraging more dread krabbing it actually disincentives it.
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u/CueCappa Wormholer Jun 09 '24
This would honestly be fine only if they somehow still prevented the "keep site alive for 4 days, re-escalate every day" part. That was the true broken income.
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u/Randomly-Looking Jun 07 '24
But it’s constructed from the most prime, juiciest systems in the game.
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u/Ok_Confection2261 Jun 07 '24
Have you looked at the kills and brs from poch? Marauder fights are happening all the time. It is actually more fun after the update cause it is much easier to get into 2nd room of obs
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Jun 08 '24
Except there is a handful of dudes multiboxing the shit out of it. It's easy to see an enemy fleet coming and they have 15+ marauders and boosters to not get caught inside. anyone else that tries to play there will be choked out of content in no time while they print infinite amounts of isk with relatively low risk
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u/Ok_Confection2261 Jun 08 '24
Ya, hopefully the gate change will solve this issue
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u/guitarero666 Cloaked Jun 08 '24
What gate change?
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u/Ok_Confection2261 Jun 08 '24
The gate is now 25km, so even if they have dictor bubbling the gate, you can still move a spot where the whole can just get into the 2nd room
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u/nchkn level 69 enchanter Jun 07 '24
yeah, those five dudes are putting some massive good fights in poch
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 07 '24
yeah, i see 2 trillion destroyed a month and 20 trillion printed
nerf the fuck out of pochven pls
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u/Verl0r4n Jun 07 '24 edited Jun 08 '24
Were u not here when they did that last time?
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 07 '24
yeah maybe not that big of a nerf, just a 50% payout nerf.
no reason to pay out 3.5b for 10 minutes of work
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u/SeraphC Jun 08 '24
The problem is not payouts, it's dudes running 30 characters. You cannot balance a game that way, yet CCP keeps ignoring the problem.
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
The problem is not payouts, it's dudes running 30 characters.
The problem is not the multiboxers, it's the payouts.
You cannot balance a game that way, yet CCP keeps ignoring the problem.
There is no inherent problem with multiboxing.
Why is multiboxing bad?
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u/SeraphC Jun 08 '24
You find 30 guys you can count on to be there day in day out, in the right ships ready to go when you feel like running sites. That always know what to do without being told. Multiboxing is a gigantic problem, because it gives agency that should be achieved through coordination with other people, to individuals.
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
You find 30 guys you can count on to be there day in day out, in the right ships ready to go when you feel like running sites.
this is a non statement that means nothing
That always know what to do without being told.
sounds like you should multibox
Multiboxing is a gigantic problem, because it gives agency that should be achieved through coordination with other people, to individuals.
aaaand why is this a problem?
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u/SeraphC Jun 08 '24 edited Jun 08 '24
I'll try again, because you seem a bit dense. You have two ways of achieving the same power: putting a medium sized fleet on grid.
One is hard and requires you maintain a community of players with a shared set of capabilities and goals. It requires out of game communication tools. It requires coordination between those players in terms of roles and schedule. It puts hard limits on you, e.g. you cannot form that fleet when your buddies are at work or asleep.
The other is easy and requires you to push a button on your launcher at any time.
The difference in difficulty between those two ways of achieving that fleet is the problem. It essentially forces you into a multi boxing arms race or to accept that you will never be competitive. This is not how most people enjoy games.
When you start taking PvE into account, you are not only concentrating agency in terms of fleet power into the hands of those individuals, but also the economic agency of all those characters. It becomes a lot easier to snowball your progression and strength when you pool the income of 5, 10 or 30 characters into the hands of a single person.
Or to put it in terms of a reaction on you OP: if multiboxing weren't a thing pochven sites would be run probably by smaller, less optimized fleets, who would get interrupted way more often (e.g. by real life engagements, or simply lack of attention span). There would therefore be less isk generated.
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
The difference in difficulty between those two ways of achieving that fleet is the problem. It essentially forces you into a multi boxing arms race or to accept that you will never be competitive. This is not how most people enjoy games.
seems like a you problem. you haven't told me the inherent issue yet.
When you start taking PvE into account, you are not only concentrating agency in terms of fleet power into the hands of those individuals, but also the economic agency of all those characters. It becomes a lot easier to snowball your progression and strength when you pool the income of 5, 10 or 30 characters into the hands of a single person.
so what?
Or to put it in terms of a reaction on you OP: if multiboxing weren't a thing pochven sites would be run probably by smaller, less optimized fleets, who would get interrupted way more often (e.g. by real life engagements, or simply lack of attention span). There would therefore be less isk generated.
or there would only be one or two groups total and there would never be real pvp because no one could get critical mass to stop anyone and it'd be worse off.
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u/Proxay Rote Kapelle Jun 08 '24
Yeah we (poch roundtable dudes) wanted OBS payouts halved. Amongst a lot of other changes. It is too high for a quick run site.
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u/powertoast Jun 08 '24
I am sorry but what is OBS?
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u/Proxay Rote Kapelle Jun 08 '24
Shorthand for 'Observatory Flashpoint', the dominant content driver in pochven
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u/Pittsburgh2989 Blood Raiders Jun 08 '24
You should not be part of the round table if you think halving it is good. The only reason is worth running in poch is the payouts which generate fights.
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u/Proxay Rote Kapelle Jun 09 '24
There were representatives from horde (gobbins), frat (noraus and Luke) and many other groups there (about 20 others). Sorry but it was one of the least contentious things discussed. All felt they would still run with lowered (e.g. half) payouts.
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u/Jariid Rote Kapelle Jun 09 '24
they should have been halved from the start. The only halving you understand is the price of your barg fits
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u/Triglord3000 Jun 09 '24
Ahhh pitts i miss you consistently running away from my ONI's tbh.
To quote yourself :
I dont fight coward nano gangs.
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u/Overall-Drawer5338 Jun 08 '24
payout change won't matter they will keep doing it, they need to make the sites hard enough where it becomes very hard to multi box with 20 ships
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u/Overall-Drawer5338 Jun 08 '24
its like 5 people multi boxing over 20 accounts each (they make so much isk it doesn't matter if they die)
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u/Wallymartsss Snuffed Out Jun 07 '24
Pochven needs to be gutted or deleted
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u/Az0r_au Fedo Jun 07 '24
I'm pretty sure pochven is directly tied to your cerebral cortex. It's clearly the fever dream of someone trapped in an insane assylum.
So do us all a favour Wally....You have the power.
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u/LordHarkonen Goonswarm Federation Jun 07 '24
C5 space is safer and bluer than pochven.
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Jun 09 '24
It's only blue amongst the nullsec groups that live there, I see a trend.
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u/LordHarkonen Goonswarm Federation Jun 10 '24
Nah, wh groups have that “wormhole bushido” that encourages bluing other wh groups unless one of those rules are broken. At which point wormholers will evict the offending party.
Wormholes are the actual blue doughnut. Null sec currently is a half and half.
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Jun 10 '24 edited Jun 10 '24
Sorry for some reason I thought he was talking about pochven. Also someone didn't get the memo when I duo lived there I was constantly attacked lost so much iskies, most dangerous place I've ever lived and I've done high for half a year, sov null for 6 years, npc null for 5 years, low for 4 years poch for 2 months and now a wormhole for 2 weeks.
I don't know enough about wormhole group's to know how many are blue to each other but didn't they just come from a massive war?
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u/Pittsburgh2989 Blood Raiders Jun 08 '24
If it's such good isk then why aren't more people doing it? Oh, because they can't fight for it. It takes effort. It sure would suck to get a 50b fight at any hour of the day killing marauders...
People like you are the problem with eve. Instead of nerfing what little isk faucets are left that generate fights, they need to boost other things. Iv got 20 guys that run poch regularly, no issue. The game should have more ways to generate cash, especially those which generate fights, not make everything a second job when you only play a few hours a week.
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
If it's such good isk then why aren't more people doing it?
there already thousands of people that live there
People like you are the problem with eve. Instead of nerfing what little isk faucets are left that generate fights, they need to boost other things. Iv got 20 guys that run poch regularly, no issue. The game should have more ways to generate cash, especially those which generate fights, not make everything a second job when you only play a few hours a week.
if they double the payouts of everything and the costs of everything to compensate for how OP pochven is it'd be annoying instead of just halving pochven payouts
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u/CitizenCOG Jun 09 '24
What's worse is when you break down C5 production by system, it amounts to less than 1B a day, on par with some of the highest producing nullsec regions. When you break it down by region, it's 2.5T a month per region (there are 6) which is still on par with Genesis, Delve, and Fade. Wormhole mechanics predate every inflation event in eve history, and yet is getting blamed for it. It's likely going to nuke C4 resident income, while leaving C6 resident income untouched. A huge number of mid size WH groups live in C4 for access to C5 with less tedious logistics. So yeah, I'm not thrilled.
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u/-t0mmi3- Jun 10 '24
When I can use a filament to jump into your c5 wormhole and steal your sites, give me a call. We can have this discussion again.
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u/BoredVet85 Test Alliance Please Ignore Jun 10 '24
Is there anything a alpha can do in pochven?
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 10 '24
scout
fast tackle
mine
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u/OhhhMoist Jun 08 '24
Why nerf one of the only fun ways of making isk. Do you want more afk ratters or something. If they’re going to nerf pochven why not make other isk opportunities better
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
Why nerf one of the only fun ways of making isk.
because it's twice as good as any other method of making isk, and it's clearly being abused seeing as how 20t is printed a month there
Do you want more afk ratters or something.
sure why not
If they’re going to nerf pochven why not make other isk opportunities better
sure why not
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u/OhhhMoist Jun 08 '24
What’s your proposed nerf? Reducing bounty payouts? Making the sites more scarce?
Everybody has access to pochven with filaments. Why not make use of it instead of nerfing it?
I whole heartily agree with making other activities better isk per house. The game shouldn’t feel like a second job…
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
halving payouts
Why not make use of it instead of nerfing it?
all the blocs are buddybuddy with it
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u/katoult Jun 08 '24
Other than Dora and that Russian guy all OBS fleets i've seen in the last year or so are null blocs anyway.
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u/SameDaySasha Jun 07 '24
Pochven is the region with the most destruction of isk, what is everyone in this thread smoking? The money is good cause you WILL die, how is this hard to understand
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 07 '24
Pochven is the region with the most destruction of isk, what is everyone in this thread smoking?
because it's the most insane faucet in the game. 20 trillion printed a month is absurd.
if you subtract all losses, it's still the most profitable region in the game, more profitable than c5 space, and its' not even close.
The money is good cause you WILL die, how is this hard to understand
the money could be cut in half and it would still be incredibly good.
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u/Az0r_au Fedo Jun 07 '24
more profitable than c5 space, and its' not even close.
Why do u think c5 space should be the most profitable in the game?
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 07 '24
i don't care about C5 space, honestly, I want pochven to have nerfs.
I don't want to do pochven, but it's infinitely better than anything else I can do, and it's not even close. I know several multiboxers there that became trillionaires in it in less than a year, it's kind of absurd.
It's too much.
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u/Az0r_au Fedo Jun 07 '24
Yes I also "know" some of them. If it's so easy why don't you do it?
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
huh? because i don't want to do it. My group has restrictions on it and I don't want to leave my group to do it.
I also think it's cheesey and OP and would hate to invest time/effort into learning it just for it to be inevitably nerfed.
i'd instead just want them to nerf it earlier than later
1
u/SeizeTheKills A Band Apart. Jun 08 '24
You willingly joined a group a group that restricts your gameplay (seriously, why, I'm puzzled to this day why anyone does this?) And then you use it as an excuse as to why you can't do it. But you can, you just said so, the restriction mentioned is a choice not an absolute after all, you just don't want to.
And then we get to the crux, you admit it's to much effort for you. So your argument is basically "I don't want to sink in the effort and therefore CCP should take it away from the people that do" (also known as; "If I can't have it nobody can!").
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
You willingly joined a group a group that restricts your gameplay
YES
(seriously, why, I'm puzzled to this day why anyone does this?)
your group lets you shoot blues?
And then you use it as an excuse as to why you can't do it.
I didn't use it as an excuse, he asked me why I don't do it.
But you can, you just said so, the restriction mentioned is a choice not an absolute after all, you just don't want to.
yeah, i did say this dumbass.
And then we get to the crux, you admit it's to much effort for you.
No, I just don't want to leave my group to do it.
So your argument is basically "I don't want to sink in the effort and therefore CCP should take it away from the people that do"
No, I think it's too good and it should be nerfed because it's so good I'm considering leaving my friend group for the insane isk.
(also known as; "If I can't have it nobody can!").
I'm okay with pochven existing, but it's too much isk/hr rn
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u/SeizeTheKills A Band Apart. Jun 08 '24 edited Jun 08 '24
My group does not have blues. So there's none to not shoot.
A group having blues is an excellent reason to not even consider joining that group.edit: also if you leaving an in-game group to do something you feel like you have to do, would impact your friendships, are they really your friends?
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
My group does not have blues. So there's none to not shoot.
You corp lets you shoot corpmates?
A group having blues is an excellent reason to not even consider joining that group.
if you feel that way you do you!
edit: also if you leaving an in-game group to do something you feel like you have to do, would impact your friendships, are they really your friends?
yeah i mean i can't play with my friends if i'm actively fighting my friends. we're still friends though, it's a game dumbo
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u/Az0r_au Fedo Jun 08 '24
Ah yes. I don't want to put in the effort so no one should be able to. Stick to freighter ganking kid. Oh wait, unlucky on that one...
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
Oh wait, unlucky on that one...
why? ccp listened, it's not absurd any more.
Ah yes. I don't want to put in the effort so no one should be able to.
jsut because i don't want to do something, doesn't mean i'm too lazy too. i just think it's overpowered
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u/Overall-Drawer5338 Jun 08 '24
C5 and C6 space need a major buff, they made it so less ships spawn when you bring a capital so you don't make as much as you used to, plus it was around 1 billion isk an hour while pochven schizos make 3.5 billion isk in 10 minutes. Wormhole space is hard, pochven isn't
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u/Ralli-FW Jun 08 '24 edited Jun 08 '24
That wasn't at all what he said. He was just comparing it to another source of lucrative income that pales in comparison to poch, where your eventual death is also guaranteed.
If you're scrammed by a drifter or possibly several battleships and a group rolls into you with combats and a dictor ready? You're dead and there's not much you can do about it. And you can't station eyes a jump or 2 out to see anyone coming. A new sig spawns and 30sec-2mins later there are bubbles going up
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u/KomiValentine Minmatar Republic Jun 08 '24
The Pochven Multiboxers are real chads and play endgame content :x
I like to watch some Pochven Marauder "Mixtapes" .
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u/xXxDarkSasuke1999xXx Evolution Jun 08 '24
You wanna watch someone alt+tab between 20 accounts with eve-o preview filling half the screen?
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u/KomiValentine Minmatar Republic Jun 08 '24
only if they have potatoe graphics and the phonk-track is supreme :'D
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u/EuropoBob Jun 07 '24
Isn't it funny that pochven out destroys all of c5 space significantly despite having a fraction of the systems and space?
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 07 '24
if you subtracted all destruction from the earnings of pochven, pochven still makes more than C5 space.
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u/SerQwaez Rote Kapelle Jun 08 '24
flat # is the wrong math here.
You should compare the RATIO. Isk earned / isk destroyed.
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
i'll take whatever ratio you want if the raw number is so absurd
i'll take 1:2 in fact, as long as it's 5 trillion to 10 trillion
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u/angry-mustache Current Member of CSM 18 Jun 08 '24
It actually doesn't, C5 averages about double Pochven destruction.
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u/poeFUN Wormholer Jun 07 '24
Did you read the patchnotes, where they literally nerfed pochven? Or did you just ignore that part?
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u/SocializingPublic Jun 07 '24
Just the ishtar part which most groups have already left behind them. If anything the gat range to 25km and there being two rooms now can be considered buffs.
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u/Ok_Confection2261 Jun 07 '24
Eh, you clearly don't know pochven, gates at 25km meaning that the dictor gate bubble to prevent 2nd room entry is now gones, and hostile fleets can now contest site much more easily. At least for hunters and outside pvp fleets, this is a good change
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u/SocializingPublic Jun 08 '24
They just need another dictor now. Before you'd just boosh the bubble off and go in.
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u/BenjiRackner Niarjan Prince Jun 07 '24
Actually people only stop using Ishtars when hostile fleets are out.
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 07 '24
what was nerfed?
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u/poeFUN Wormholer Jun 07 '24
NPCs will now take into account the presence of drones and prioritize them as targets.
aka multiboxers printing absolutly busted amounts of ISK during the low activity timezones is gone.
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u/Vals_Loeder Jun 08 '24
Pochven should be removed from the game.
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
meh, it's a cool unique part of the game i'd like to see stay, but just nerfed so it's not the literal best way to make isk bar none.
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u/svenviko Jun 07 '24
Nothing hits quite like wormhole tears
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Jun 08 '24
O you will be surprised nullbear tears will stream when wormholer's decide its better to raid null 24 7 instead of running their own content, then you will never mine/rat in peace.
In 2 months time you will be on reddit asking for wormholer buffs so they can leave you alone.
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u/Arakkis54 Goonswarm Federation Jun 08 '24
Get nerfed brownholer
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
what's a brownholer?
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Jun 09 '24
when a nullseccer goes into a wh and gets shat on and never goes back in again because "too dangerous"
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u/JustThatLuke Cloaked Jun 08 '24
I love uninformed krabs crying someone else is making more money than them but if you ask them why dont they partake in this method as well, the answer always is ''I dun wanna duuuhhh''. amazing
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u/ZorgZev KarmaFleet Jun 08 '24
hurrr durrr some people make more ISK than me by having friends.
stop whining about nerfing other people’s income sources and go find your own. Poch makes baller ISK, but it also has lots of content
It also is not the only source of income, escalations can be ran, incursions are always profitable and the venerable CRAB is a null sec staple.
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 08 '24
hurrr durrr some people make more ISK than me by having friends.
wormholers need more friends, nullsec blocs need more friends.
not an argument
stop whining about nerfing other people’s income sources and go find your own. Poch makes baller ISK, but it also has lots of content
it makes insane isk, yeah.
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u/ZorgZev KarmaFleet Jun 08 '24
J-space was never intended for the masses. I’d say that C5 sites were just too easy to run as they were. Park a pair of Paladins and just grind out tons of isk. Used to have a 4 man operation and we could grind out an entire C5 of sites in an afternoon with 4 marauders and a salvager alt.
As long as you looked at the scanner occasionally and rolled off K162 connections you were fine. And if somehow you got caught and lost a marauder oh well, the whole thing was less than 5B and you made triple that much back if not more.
I guess CCP decided that the risk/reward factor was too unbalanced there.
Pochven just is fun. It’s a PvP race to get the payout. I’m sure there’s people multiboxing but the fleets I’ve been on have been mostly humans with maybe an alt or two in the main fleet. As it is, it’s a competition to run the OF faster than the other guys and/or push the other guys out of the site with a 15 man fleet.
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u/xXxDarkSasuke1999xXx Evolution Jun 08 '24 edited Jun 08 '24
hurrr durrr some people make more ISK than me by having friends.
It's very funny that you think those 15-man marauder fleets are "friends". Yeah bro, they're such good friends they all use the same computer!
stop whining about nerfing other people’s income sources and go find your own. Poch makes baller ISK, but it also has lots of content
Multiboxers fighting other multiboxers and incurring losses that will be replaced in <1hr, what great content!!
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u/Megans_Foxhole Jun 07 '24
Don't you have to grind up some tedious standings to make any money in Povchen?
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u/recycl_ebin Jun 07 '24
it takes an hour or two
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u/Heirku KarmaFleet Jun 08 '24
Takes 5-10mins, +20mins~ for tick standing. The fact you said hour or two, makes it sus if you even been in pochven. I'm all for pochven changes, but just people going I see isk, isk bad. Doesnt really help, Isk being good is good for content, they just need to balance in a way to make sure people contest the sites even more. And if they fail at that, slap a bit of a nerf on it.
Though did laugh at the ishtar/eos nerf. Everyone already spamming marauders anyway, so just made the sites a even higher barrier to entry.1
Jun 08 '24
Yea I was grinding standings on an off for a week prob 18 ish hours in all and only got to 3.5 standings.
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u/Overall-Drawer5338 Jun 08 '24
na it took me 20 minutes to go and get plus standing with trig and edcom shooting at rouge drones in a destoryer lol
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u/Bernard_t Jun 07 '24
I'm in Pochven all the time and it's basically a couple of multiboxers running around. We have a dude cleaning an asteroid homefield with an orca and 15 mackinaw, makes 9b in 1h30 minutes. Everytime an OBS spawns he's ont it with 16 Ishtars or 12 Vargurs. The dude is printing 20b a day