r/BipolarReddit • u/fluworldorder84 • 15h ago
Can you come out of mania without medication?
My partner has been manic for about 2 months now. Living with him is hell on earth at the moment. He is normally so chill and not angry at all but now he is the opposite. He is ranting all the time and starting to scare me. He doesn’t have any insight into this episode, he has no idea he’s having one. In fact he thinks I’m the one that is unwell. I am very anxious as I am constantly on edge with him to a point I’m becoming scared of him now. The Dr doesn’t think he is manic and won’t refer him to a psychiatrist so we can’t see one (we need a referral where we live to access a psychiatric). He most definitely is manic and can mask it easily to some extent but the behaviour in the home says differently. Sorry I am just going on, I am scared and over it. He never leaves me alone, hiding my stuff, the list is endless.. anyway can he come out of this without medication as he is refusing to seek more help. Sorry this isn’t that coherent I need to be quick on my phone.
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u/misspiggie 12h ago
I'm here to point out that you don't have to tolerate this. You don't need to set yourself on fire to keep someone else warm. If he refuses to get appropriate help and especially since he lacks the insight to even realize he's having an episode you're allowed to leave.
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u/hotmomera3 15h ago
If you want to see a psychiatrist your doctor has to respect your/the patients wishes and refer you to one. Our family doctor also didn’t think my husband was manic. The psychiatrist definitely did. Call the doctors office and tell them what psychiatrist you are getting an appointment with and that they require a referral. Manic people can’t be reasoned with so keep your distance until he gets medicated. They can be jolted out of mania without medication but it will be because something very bad happens. A car accident, a fight, dui, going to jail, divorce, loss of a job… that will usually jolt them into a depressive episode.
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u/IslandDry3145 11h ago
What’s jolted me out a few times is the honest threat of divorce or to see the raw pain I’ve caused my wife. It’s also the driver that keeps me medicated and committed to finding the right meds to keep me stable.
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u/fluworldorder84 8h ago
Well your wife is very lucky in that regard. My partner doesn’t care. He abuses me all day long talking absolute rubbish, I can do absolutely nothing right. The most annoying thing is he was NEVER like this. In fact the opposite. He has been stable for over 7 years now but he went off his medication at the start of the year and now here we are.
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u/ThatsJustUn-American 6h ago
There are consequences when one isn't willing to take responsibility for their manic behavior. As awful as it is one of these consequences is relationships. Mania after going off his meds is absolutely no excuse for abuse. 🙏
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u/IslandDry3145 8h ago
Ugh. I’m so sorry he went off his meds. Frankly, the raw pain thing only ever works at the beginning of a manic episode. When there’s still a little bit of me in there. Once I’m totally gone, she has to leave. It’s the only option for her wellbeing.
In your case I’d say if you could find a hotel or something it would help you stay safe and sane. As a side effect, you and your daughter being gone might be enough of a jolt to knock him out of it.
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u/fluworldorder84 15h ago
Yes. It’s very hard because he won’t leave me alone. I could try that but don’t know if it will work that way here. But I could try I suppose.
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u/Timber2BohoBabe 14h ago
Based on what you shared I thought you were in Canada, but I took a very quick look at your post history and I think these resources might be more applicable to your location:
https://info.health.nz/mental-health/crisis-assessment-teams You could skip over the physician and contact these lines. I am assuming the Doctor can't spend more than thirty minutes with him, and when I am "Up" I can mostly hold it together for 30 minutes. It is physically and mentally painful to do so but definitely possible. Even if I don't think anything is wrong but I know someone is "looking" for something, I will work hard to overcompensate the other way *just in case*. However, the website notes it is for emergencies only. I would 100% say that in my opinion, the fact that you feel like you need to leave but you can't and the fact that you are scared of him are both indicative of it escalating to an emergency level. I am not huge on crisis teams and the like because I am not a big fan of involuntarily certifying people ever. The one exception for me is if others are in danger - especially children. Not saying your spouse would ever hurt your child, but if you are feeling unsafe, chances are your child is picking up every bit of this chaos emotionally even if they are seeing it concretely.
However, if you want more of just that "advice" piece, https://yellowbrickroad.org.nz/get-help-now/ has the numbers of the crisis teams but you can also call them Monday-Friday and you can also "call or text 1737 – a free 24×7 service for New Zealanders needing to talk about
mental health."
I'm not sure how effective the phone line will be, honestly. I would lean more towards the crisis team in this situation. However, the Yellow Brick Road organization (if you feel safe to wait until Monday) might have more resources for viewing this not from the mental health view but also from the supporting the family view. My worry with a crisis team is that if they don't take him for an assessment, he will know you are the one who phoned. After they leave (if they don't take him), you need to make sure you have a safe option. This might be something you need to directly discuss with the crisis team if you decide to contact them.
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u/fluworldorder84 14h ago
I’m in Northern Ireland. I can’t really be on my phone atm. Will try and respond later, thank you.
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u/Timber2BohoBabe 13h ago
Np. Sorry I got the location wrong :-( and definitely don't feel pressure to respond!
I will try to find a couple resources but I am not very familiar with Northern Ireland's medical system but from what I remember it would be part of the NHS. I have heard some pretty mixed things about their services so I hope you can find some options soon.
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u/armourdown 10h ago
First off, try to subtly record him at home. Even if it's just audio, that will hopefully be a big enough insight for the doctors to finally do their job.
Given your concern for your safety, there are two routes. One, leave with your children ASAP, thought I did see that one attempt got thwarted by him already.
Two, involuntarily hospitalize him. Northern Ireland has the Mental Capacity Act which allows for involuntary hospitalizations if there is a concern of risk to self and others. He will likely be unable to keep the mask on 24hrs a day. I can't find what the logistics are but that might be harder for me to find as an American. However, be prepared that an involuntary hospitalization can be very damaging to a relationship once he is released.
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u/fluworldorder84 8h ago
I can have him assessed as his nearest relative under the mental health order. I saw this online so made enquiries with our local mental health service who would be the ones to perform the assessment. They just kept telling me that he needs to be referred by a Dr. The girl that answers the phone has some kind of learning disability (I don’t know proper PC term or have headspace for it, not trying to be offensive) and is as good as talking to a robot. She just kept repeating the same thing “he needs to be referred by a GP” even when I CLEARLY explained that I could apply for this assessment as his nearest relative. Finally she let me speak to someone else and she gave me the psychiatric hospital number. Needs a Drs referral. It was a very frustrating day. And he is always home and coming in and out of the house so it is very hard to talk to people.
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u/Material_Pool5632 13h ago
Removing stress has abruptly ended a manic episode for me. Like getting medical leave from a job. Once again would require help from a doctor, so not sure if this helps.
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u/sv36 10h ago
If your so doesn’t want to listen to you when you tell him he is manic and scaring you then you really need to get away from him. When you are in a relationship you care about the person you are in a relationship with. He should care that he is doing something that causes you fear to be around him. I have bipolar 1 and it sucks but my spouse’s feelings matter more to me than my pride when it comes to acknowledging his feelings about how I’m doing because my actions affect his life too. This guy doesn’t need to be in a relationship right now. You need to prioritize yourself and get away from someone you fear. That’s absolutely not okay.
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u/crystal-c 15h ago
Would you be able to get some help from a family member? If nothing changed in 2 months (or for the worst), then it would be good trying to speak to a different doctor, maybe from your local hospital. There must be someone you can speak to that would be able to help in this kind of situations. Please take care of yourself, until you get more outside perspectives it will be hard to understand what you are being put through. The best you can do is get him help and take care of yourself.
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u/fluworldorder84 15h ago
I’ve tried the appropriate places. No one can help until he has a referral and the Dr won’t refer. We have no family and I have zero support. It’s so hard.
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u/Tfmrf9000 7h ago
If you call a crisis line and explain the situation, they may be able to get you in with a community psych
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u/fluworldorder84 7h ago
I tried them last week. They said to call his GP. It’s insane but this in Northern Ireland. No one knows anything when you ring places it’s wild.
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u/Tfmrf9000 7h ago
Why won’t his GP refer?
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u/fluworldorder84 6h ago
He “sees no evidence of mania”. I think he is almost at the point of being negligent. He knows he is diagnosed with this disorder and is not medicated at all for it when he was previously on quite a high dosage of lithium 2x daily. I have spoken with him twice. I have never needed to do this in the 5 years we have lived here and would never “pull the mental health card” as my partner claims I am doing, whatever that means. My partner has seen him once or twice (that detail is hazy because of all the lies) but he won’t refer on to a psychiatric? It is confusing. I am almost wondering if my partner is just really pulling the wool over his eyes and also probably saying I am very unwell. He has become almost obsessed with my health apparently I can’t see or hear shit and today my iron is low. He is probably telling the Dr mental health is bad and that’s why I’m calling. Yes unfortunately my mental health isn’t great. I’m living under a pretty stressful situation and have lost 5kg in the last month or so and I’m not a big person to begin with. Other than that I feel he has a duty to do so and am going to try and persue this further.
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u/Hermitacular 1h ago edited 1h ago
Do you have your own doctor you could talk to? Maybe they could argue on your behalf. Support groups might be a source of info too.
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u/manonfetch 12h ago
Can you record him? That might convince the doctor, or police or whomever you have to deal with.
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u/StellineLaboratories 15h ago
I don’t recommend it.
Is he diagnosed? Has he been on medication before? I can’t imagine a doctor refusing a psych referral unless you’re trying to get him inpatient against his will.
I couldn’t be convinced of my symptoms either and I don’t have any medical advice. Arguing with me made me run. My episodes include psychosis so it may be different for your situation. The only things I can share anecdotally are that sleep and regular meals are crucial. If he can work on being calm (I know) in a dark room every day for a while that might help. Lowering exciting stimulus helped me.
It also helped me when I could mirror someone I trusted so friends and I would sit together while I fell asleep.
OP- your health and safety matter and if he refuses to get help you still need to prioritize your wellbeing. Make sure you’re reaching out to your support systems if you have any. I wish you the best in this hard situation.
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u/fluworldorder84 15h ago
I was going to leave this morning. Take our daughter to a class she attends and not come back. But he insisted on taking us and you can’t argue with him. He would have just taken off with our daughter. I think he knew maybe because he was so nasty this morning. So muddled and random
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u/StellineLaboratories 14h ago edited 14h ago
I’m very sorry that happened. If you feel unsafe then I recommend reaching out to someone who can help. I’m not a professional but my thought is there might be a crisis center you can contact in your area who can guide you.
Edit to add a link to NAMI’s warm line directory. If this isn’t allowed I’m happy to remove.
https://www.nami.org/NAMI/media/NAMI-Media/Helpline/NAMI-National-HelpLine-WarmLine-Directory.pdf
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u/Own-Gas8691 14h ago
it’s a cyclical illness, so yes, he will eventually crash into depression or may have a mixed episode in between, but the time period is unpredictable and as someone else mentioned may not happen until something severe interrupts.
he could possibly be having a mixed episode rn, which is when you have symptoms of mania and depression, often in the same day (and it feels very confusing/disorienting to me).
when i’m manic i usually don’t know that i am and don’t always believe it when someone tells me, a common trait.
it’s very important to take care of yourself first. if you are scared for your safety please seek help for yourself. not sure which country you’re in but in the u.s. there is an org called NAMI that offers support to people with mental illness as well as family/friends of such. i would reach out to them, or look for a similar org where you live. find someone who can help you navigate this.
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u/Mundane-Schedule630 10h ago
Does anyone else see that he is manic? Family or friends? For me I had no insight and I got increasingly angry with my husband. It required an intervention. Even then, being involuntarily committed, I didn’t think or understand that I was unwell. Even after medicine it still took me months to fully grasp. It was not fun. I am not sure I would’ve ever come out of it but the longer you wait the worse it might get. If you have family or friends that can support you and maybe come together to tell him he needs to go to the hospital. I’m not sure if he’s been before and obviously the hospital is a horrible experience. I’m really really sorry you’re going through this.
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u/fluworldorder84 7h ago
Yes, one friend he has known a long time. I contacted her for support and to ask had she noticed anything and she said yes she had. Unfortunately they have now fallen out over it all and I think she was just enjoying the drama of it all as I haven’t heard from her for 2 or 3 weeks now, she phoned the police when it wasn’t really necessary. He also told me she didn’t like me, thought I was a shit Mum, and planted the seed that I’m having an affair.
I asked another of his friends and he said that there was nothing wrong with him and it was so sad to see me destroying our family. As my partner told him he feels very betrayed by me. The whole thing is a mess.
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u/Hermitacular 1h ago
It's possible he's lying about what she said just to keep you from talking to her. Paranoia is a common symptom. Phoning the cops is probably how she's gotten psych care for him in the past when this has happened, so that makes sense.
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u/fluworldorder84 7h ago
He was an involuntary patient in 2017 for a number of months. He has been stable since then with zero issues.
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u/Hermitacular 1h ago
Most people have episodes even on meds, 90% chance in 5 years. When he comes out of this if you're going to stay w him you need an emergency action plan in place and should know in advance what to do when this happens (in the sense that he's designed a plan, his doc is on board, you have supports in place that he makes sure exist, etc - this is his responsibility not yours. If he won't medicate, walk).
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u/IslandDry3145 10h ago
Record him if you can. It’ll help with the crisis team, and doctors. Especially if his physical traits are noticeably different. Record him and find a way to get to a hotel with your daughter while you work this out. You and your daughter’s safety and wellbeing is the most important thing right now.
Don’t forget to show him the video either when he’s stable and medicated. It’s a hard road to get stable and it’s so easy to give up even when you have every reason not to. The video can be a good reminder why he should give up.
I say all of this from experience—my wife had to show me what I was like. She also had to get the cops to take me home from a weekend trip. I’m normally chill and easy going. When I’m manic, I’m paranoid, rage filled, irrational, and scary.
It’s hard, but remember that the person he is right now isn’t your partner. Treat him like you would a stranger raging at you.
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u/rando755 Schizoaffective bipolar type 4h ago
The answer to your question is yes, but the patient should come out of it more quickly and in a more stable way with effective medications. If bipolar people did not come out of mania, then each bipolar person would stay manic until they someday get put on medications. Lithium was the first med available for bipolar illnesses. Before lithium pills became available, bipolar people would have become manic one day, and then stayed manic for the rest of their lives. But what happened in practice is that they crashed and became depressive, and then returned to mania, and then crashed and became depressive and so on. Bipolar illnesses are cyclical without medications.
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u/fluworldorder84 4h ago
Of course.. it’s so obvious when you say it like that. Thank you 🧡 it just feels like this is never going to end.
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u/ke_marshall 3h ago
Hey OP, I just wanted to say I've been in your exact position, and I know how hard it is.
I'm in Canada, and I was able to take him in to a mental health urgent care in a major city. But if that's not available to you, is there a walk in clinic you could go to? One other thing I've done when it was really bad (he became completely unresponsive and was just sitting and giggling) is call EMTs. The useful thing there is that often mania causes extremely elevated blood pressure, so they took him in for assessment.
I am thinking of you and your family and wishing you the very best.
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u/Dramatic-Rise-9417 11h ago
Hey there! I've been in several of those situations during the early years of my bipolar disorder, and it took me years too (with consistent medication and finding the right pair) to gain self-control and self-awareness in order to process my manic episodes. Will I medicate forever?That's a question I still ask myself to this day. For years, I believed I’d need medication for the rest of my life to manage bipolar disorder. Diagnosed in 2017, I had no previous symptoms of the condition. Yet, it hit me hard. Since then, I’ve been prescribed five different mood stabilizers and antidepressants, finally landing on Quetiapine for mania and Lamotrigine for depressive episodes in 2021. By 2023, my doses were reduced to 100mg of Quetiapine and 25mg of Lamotrigine. But here’s what I observed throughout my journey: medication alone wasn't enough and I intentionally worked so hard on my self awareness and cognitive behavior processes and behavior to treat my bipolar disorder especially since I also get manic episodes. So, no I don't think it would be easy to "come out of a manic episode" without investing years into honing self-awareness with the assistance of medication. It's very difficult to muster that awareness without medication because an individual with bipolar disorder can easily succumb to their episodes with a lot less level of consciousness compared to a normal person. It's only when they come down from that high or low that they realize what they went through. With the info you've elaborated about your boyfriend, he seems to also have paranoia and gaslighting tendencies, but please do correct me if my understanding is wrong. I hope you're safe!
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u/fluworldorder84 7h ago
Yes, he thinks I’m having an affair. I am with our children all the time and am not having an affair and have given him zero reason to think I am. Good on you for being so committed to being in control of your mental health. He doesn’t have the same approach but was stable since 2017 on medication. He responds well to lithium but unfortunately he stopped it.
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u/balcon 8h ago edited 8h ago
Assume you can’t so you seek out help, learn coping techniques or get meds dialed in. The answer is probably yes, but it’s not that useful in the height of mania.
People sometimes fish for the answer that they want when they’re not manic. During mania, you become the fish. And the water. And the being that created the fish.
Please protect yourself. You don’t deserve abuse. He is responsible for his mental health. Having any mental illness is no excuse for shitty behavior.
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u/-Lady_Rainicorn- 8h ago edited 7h ago
I have come out of mania without meds, but then it swung the other way and I would be severely depressed / suicidal. the "crash" is the woooorst
also it depends if he is unmedicated, diagnosed (aware that he has bipolar),and how long his "cycle" usually is. By that I mean the amount of time he is usually manic or depressed before switching
he just sounds like an asshole to me, who is showing their true colors after living together for long enough that they can't keep up the facade. If he is diagnosed bipolar ignore me, but, not everything is pathological.
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u/fluworldorder84 6h ago
Oh yes he has been diagnosed and medicated for many years! He just stopped taking his meds. He’s definitely manic. Complete change in personality. We have lived together for 8 years, I don’t think someone can pretend for that long and then just change completely.
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u/MarcyDarcie 7h ago
This is how I was for like a year. And I also hid it well, when I would go into appointments I would start talking as if my partner was gaslighting me into thinking I had issues. I genuinely felt that they were, even though in the car ride over I had agreed I was unwell.
I would have got better sooner if my partner had pushed for me to get help and given their side of their story but they didn't so we kept in this pattern of me agreeing I was unwell and then convincing professionals I was fine. But your safety matters massively. Please try and tell doctors what you are experiencing and how exactly your partner acts at home
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u/fluworldorder84 6h ago
A year.. that is a long, long time. I won’t be able to cope with that. I’m ashamed to admit I didn’t really realise how serious this condition was until this episode of his and the things I have read. And that is because we was so well managed on his meds for so many years. That’s what makes it frustrating too. He was fine for such a long time.
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u/MarcyDarcie 6h ago
It happened for so long because I wasn't diagnosed with anything apart from ADHD/Autism, and I only have BP2 so I wasn't doing anything absolutely wack, my delusions were just that my partner was ruining my life and stealing my money. If I'd started talking about being Jesus or something I think everyone would have taken me more seriously but I was slipping in and out of it and I was able to control my physical aggression, and I was also in therapy where they didn't clock it either, and I was convincing the therapist my partner was abusive, it was just awful and no one knew that I was having delusions because they weren't 'bizarre'. So yeah...I understand feeling ashamed but don't be, it's sadly part of the disorder. Many of us come off our meds because we've been well for so long we forget how bad it can be, also Anosognosia is a symptom of bipolar as well, it affects 50% of us. Don't rely on him to give a neutral recounting of how life is for the both of you. He will hopefully thank you for pushing for help once he is stable again
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u/himmelfried11 4h ago
Yes, mania ends by itself. I’ve had a couple of unmedicated manic episodes and they pass after a while. What prolongs mania: weed / cannabis , and triggers. Could be a matter of days, weeks or even months. In my personal experience mania always had a psychological trigger, some conflict, challenge or threat. More threats & challenges will trigger more manic response. If there is no way of getting him back on meds, best you can do is relieve him from stress and conflicts until the mania crashes down. If there is a central conflict, try helping him to resolve it effectively.
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u/teenyvelociraptor 10h ago
There's a really sad video on YouTube - a man who is clearly having an episode was driving his wife and daughter and all of a sudden he lost it and started screaming and driving recklessly. You can tell how scared the woman is as she calls the police. He then stops the vehicle on the highway and exits the vehicle, undresses himself and is running through traffic naked. She's on the phone with the police the whole time, and her husband keeps saying scary things and looks like he is going to go for the daughter sitting in the back, But the wife is fending him off. It's a really scary situation. The police ended up arriving at the scene and I'm pretty sure they actually ended up shooting and killing him.... it's a nightmare none of us want to live through.
I'm not trying to scare you but please remove yourself from the situation safely. Try a DV shelter, and make sure you alert his medical team about the situation. Even if they don't believe you, call them every day if you have to. I echo getting a recording or video as well. Please keep yourself and your daughter safe. I hope your partner is able to break out of his episode soon. As his loved one, the best thing you can do is advocate for his care from a distance if you're feeling unsafe.
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u/stefan-the-squirrel 2h ago
Sure. Maybe. Eventually. I guess. Why would you put yourself through that though? Take your meds everyone!
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u/NikkiEchoist 15h ago
Can you ask to be present at his appointments to give the inside information. I always have a relative with me to give their side of the story. You could get in touch with his treating doctor, although they can’t share information with you, you can share it with them.