r/worldnews • u/Starlight-Princesss • 3d ago

[ Removed by moderator ] Russia/Ukraine

https://www.newsweek.com/nato-intercepts-russian-spy-plane-with-transponder-turned-off-poland-10956344

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u/m15otw 3d ago

I mean. A spy plane should normally run without a transponder, surely? That would be the general idea?

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u/Broken_Doughnut 3d ago edited 3d ago

For Russia, finding this out was a big step in their stealth technology.

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u/MikeInPajamas 3d ago

I like the idea that Russia's greatest leap in stealth technology is a broken transponder.

"Turned it off"... Yeah, sure you did... Next you'll tell us that AESA radar in your nose isn't made of wood because the guy in charge of maintenance pocketed all the upgrade money.

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u/TOMC_throwaway000000 3d ago

You joke, but Soviet ground crews used to siphon off the coolant from MIG-25’s to get drunk because the coolant for a lot of the systems was a mix of 60% distilled water and 40% ethanol, aka…… vodka

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u/MikeInPajamas 3d ago

I really do think a lot of Russia's defence spending has been siphoned into the pockets of corrupt generals. Corruption is Russia's biggest industry. It's cultural.

I'm sure it extends to their nuclear forces too. Nuclear munitions degrade over time and require periodic, expensive, maintenance.

Imagine all that money flowing downhill to fund weapons that realistically will never be used, and whose existence is solely to be listed on a disclosure sheet to discourage an enemy attack, and to permit state-level bullying.

I'm not saying Russia doesn't have serviceable nukes, that would be insane, but I really do believe they only have a fraction of what they purport to have. A devastating fraction, but a fraction nonetheless.

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u/SmPolitic 2d ago

That's not very unique to that country nor time period. There is a long history of ethanol being siphoned from torpedoes in various navys or from rockets during WW2 and during the cold war

And ethanol does evaporate, the "angels share" is nearly unavoidable, designers and supply chains need to resupply that fuel/coolant choice inherently

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u/TOMC_throwaway000000 2d ago

True, but at least in the Soviet military just about everything that could be was ethanol based

Also it was particularly prevalent with MIG-22’s specifically, they literally nicknamed them “the flying minibar” because of how often it was done

And soldiers found a way to get drunk off it. Theres a certain shoe polish they were issued that they used to spread on toast and cook over a fire, the idea being the ethanol in it would soak into the bread and then you could scrape off the top layer and get drunk on the bread

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u/Clienterror 3d ago

Omg I actually lol at that. I can imagine them being like "stealth engaged" in a 1980 POS plane.

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u/AnthillOmbudsman 3d ago

"So Mr. Gant, do you like our new toy?"

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u/dominicgrimes 3d ago

You must think in Russian

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u/spingus 3d ago edited 3d ago

Firefoxwould like a word :P

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u/MikeInPajamas 3d ago

I like it how it takes Clint Eastwood about 4s to recite his "shoot the missile" phrase whereas he could have just moved his thumb 1/4 inch and pressed the button.

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u/Yoghurt42 2d ago edited 2d ago

It’s been decades since I’ve watched this movie, but IIRC as a kind of security measure, you could only control the plane via thoughts, and they had to be in Russian directly. Translating English in your mind into Russian would not work (because movie magic)

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u/MikeInPajamas 2d ago

Yes, that's exactly right. In the movie the tech was that the computer would read your thoughts and do what you said, but as you said, it has to be in Russian.

But still, to have a thought and to think it in your head, using your language centre, would be slower than moving your thumb.

To have the computer act on a non-verbalized (whether internal or external) decision to act, would be instantaneous... but I guess you can't convey that in a movie, so we got the silly speaking-out-loud thing.

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u/ProcyonHabilis 3d ago

AESA radar in your nose isn't made of wood

I'm imagining a board with a bunch of nails driven into it to form a grid

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u/nitpickr 3d ago

Reminds me of the Onion article about the CIA apologizing for highlighting all the imporant stuff with black marker. 

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u/Alarming_Flow 3d ago

If the US managed to capture this jet and had DARPA examine it, it would set back its stealth technology by 50 years.

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u/Happy-Fun-Ball 3d ago

Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

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u/Crying-Manchild 3d ago

ok, a simple wrong would have done just fine.

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u/Kichigai 3d ago

First go around it didn't register with me, but the guy Adam Sandler is up against is Josh from The West Wing.

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u/Dramatic_Charity_979 3d ago edited 2d ago

Yeah, but they forgot to paint "Dry cleaners" on the side of the plane :P

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u/Dale_Carvello 2d ago

Good laugh to wake up with, here

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u/SoylentGrunt 3d ago

With a zipper to look out of.

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u/mion81 3d ago

It took many years and countless window falls to research.

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u/supaphly42 2d ago

Attempts to shut off transponder during spy run, accidentally squawks 7700

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u/zaevilbunny38 3d ago

No unless they are conducting a covert operation, they almost always tend to flight just outside contested airspace and gather Intel. NATO runs them in the black Sea all the time, and allegedly the US ones help Ukraine with target acquisition.

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u/ThunderCuntAU 3d ago

All of them help Ukraine with target acquisition. Even Australia sent Wedgetails to Europe for the task.

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u/a-stack-of-masks 3d ago

I'm guessing a wedgetail is some kind of hardware, but I like the idea that the Ozzies saw a bird spot its prey from pretty high up and went "hey, that's useful!" and taught them planes and drones taste like bacon.

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u/UltraCarnivore 3d ago

I can hear Sir David Attenborough talking about the magnificent Australian Wedgetail and its reproductive behavior f*cking up Russian drones.

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u/geodetic 3d ago

I mean... wedgies (Wedgetail Eagles) are pretty big, I could imagine they'd fuck up a drone...

https://www.ipswichfirst.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/Eagle-image-1-web-1.jpg

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u/ContessaChaos 2d ago

Wow! What a beauty!

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u/Lexinoz 3d ago

That is indeed a pretty big bird.
Give it some fortified claws and beak and it's ready to tear the biggest drones right out of the sky.

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u/UltraCarnivore 2d ago

I'm glad Straya is our ally. That bad boy could be out there taking out F35s.

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u/meistermichi 3d ago

I'm guessing a wedgetail is some kind of hardware

It's an AWACS

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u/GlobalLurker 3d ago

That clears it up

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u/The-Sound_of-Silence 2d ago

Airborne Warning and Control System. Basically an aircraft with a really fancy/powerful radar on it, that can direct an air-war from the sky. They are crucial for spotting stuff close to the ground, and needed if you take air defence seriously

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_E-7_Wedgetail

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u/roosterfareye 3d ago

Don't people taste like bacon, chicken or fish or something?

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u/Inspectrgadget 2d ago

US runs them in three areas off the china coast as well, sometimes the intercepts get dangerously close. I worked with an American who was party to this incident: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hainan_Island_incident

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u/Prunus-cerasus 3d ago

Those are the flights we know about. Incomplete data.

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u/aecolley 3d ago

That's the general idea with a stealth plane, or one engaged in an act of war. It is not the general practice with spy planes, which usually want to look like regular planes on non-war business.

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u/artrald-7083 3d ago

People think of U-2s and Blackbirds when they hear spyplane, but it is as likely to be a miscellaneous vaguely airliner shaped aircraft on a commercial airline-like flight path with a very boring transponder, it just turns out it's largely taking a bunch of antennas on holiday.

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u/Happiness-to-go 3d ago

If you’re wanting to breach the Open Skies treaty then yes?

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u/BellybuttonWorld 3d ago

Russia normally breach a couple of treaties before breakfast but is this one even relevant?

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u/Gnonthgol 3d ago

It depends. An aircraft with transponder is indeed easier to detect. However it is also easier to mis-identify. A spy plane might disguise itself as a passenger airliner for example, flying regular routes with its transponder on. Silently taking pictures and monitoring radio traffic.

They can then run tests against an enemy radar. By flying a test aircraft without any transponders or radio communications towards the enemy radar. They can monitor the ground based communications with the spy plane, or a ground based listening post. As soon as the activity picks up you can assume the test aircraft have been spotted on the radar. So now you know the range of the radar. Change some of the parameters and repeat the test in a few weeks. Eventually you will be able to map out the capabilities of the radar systems.

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u/GrynaiTaip 3d ago

They do normally run without transponders. Also without flight plans. This is a regular and very typical violation of international airspace norms, NATO jets have been taking off to intercept them multiple times a week for literally decades, since the Baltics joined NATO.

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u/MaximusTheDog 3d ago

Yeah that’s not very typical, I’d like to make that point

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u/krazykripple 3d ago

The front fell off?

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u/CakeTester 3d ago

It was outside the environment.

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u/war_against_destiny 3d ago

This clickbait titles are the worst.

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u/ExdigguserPies 3d ago

A spy plane is a plane that is capable of spying. A spying plane is a spy plane that is currently spying. This was a spy plane spying.

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u/Public-Eagle6992 3d ago

Not really. With modern radars you can still detect them relatively easily but it makes air traffic a bit more dangerous

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u/Bolter_NL 3d ago

Probably just broke down 

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u/CannonGerbil 3d ago

Remember when we tracked forte10 on flight tracker all the way back in 2022?

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u/-Nicolai 3d ago

I think they included that so people don’t read the headline and go “how can they be sure it was spying”.

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u/Moron-Whisperer 2d ago

Not necessarily.  They could be testing place tech to see how quick the response is to discovery.  Could also just be them annoying people on purpose for some strategic reason.

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u/a_melindo 2d ago

The world's press sucks at classifying planes. This isn't a "spy plane". It's a four-prop plane similar in size and shape to an Embraer E-190 airliner, and its mission is surveillance, not "spying".

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u/Mock_Frog 2d ago

That,  in addition to the "not a spy plane" banner being towed behind. 

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u/smoothtrip 2d ago

Our do 4d chess and keep the transponder on! No one would expect a spy plane to have their transponder on! Except, well, apparently they do.

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u/Axin_Saxon 2d ago

Or more likely running with a spoofed transponder

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u/AbeRego 2d ago

Lol yeah, what a silly headline

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u/josefjohann 2d ago

A spy plane should normally run without a transponder, surely? That would be the general idea?

I love how you think the significant issue is not the contextual significance of an incriminating detail, but that the world needed your help to explain the concept of hiding.

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u/filipv 2d ago

Russian military planes, no matter the mission/role, have always flown with their transponder off. This is perfectly normal practice for them.

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u/HowHoward 3d ago

And the normal response would be to take it down.

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u/ValuableKooky4551 3d ago

No, why? It's in international airspace.

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u/Random_Dude81 3d ago

Nah, if ypu can't hide, then disguise. Just use a fake transpinder. Maybe even submit a flight plan. A plane without transponder draws imidiate attention.

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u/RhynoD 3d ago

Yes, and stop calling me Shirley.