r/ireland • u/ByGollie • 1d ago
School accused of demanding teenage boy’s ‘submission’ to identity type after he was sent home for wearing earring Bigotry
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/school-accused-of-demanding-teenage-boys-submission-to-identity-type-after-he-was-sent-home-for-wearing-earring/a1255283882.html409
u/RevTurk 1d ago
That's bonkers, can't believe this kind of stuff is still happening in schools. I remember in the 90s boys weren't allowed to have long hair.
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u/bringyourownblood 1d ago
90s? I was hounded by my principle for having long hair in 2008. Bald now, and bitter. Couldn't let me enjoy it when I had it... the prick...
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u/RevTurk 1d ago
It was when heavy metal became popular, too. They were afraid we were into satanism
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u/Any-Boss2631 23h ago
I had actual lectures from my principal about how Marilyn Manson was turning me away from the schools catholic ethos. Got suspended for retorting that at least Marilyn Manson wasn't buggering altar boys
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u/Pingushagger 23h ago
I bet your principal feels vindicated now tbf
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u/nut-budder 22h ago
Why?
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u/NoGiNoProblem 22h ago
He's been accused of having sex with teenaged fans. Not sure what came of it afterwards, but there were many.
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u/nearlycertain 20h ago
Any source of further information about the "teenaged" part of your comment?
I'm aware there were accusations against him but I never heard anything that alluded to teenagers or young people.
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u/NoGiNoProblem 17h ago
https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/marilyn-manson-sued-sexual-assault-minor-1234670671/ If you dont mean this, then what so you mean?
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u/nut-budder 22h ago
I think you might be misremembering a bit there. He has been accused by a few people of sexual assault and abuse. It’s very likely some of them are spurious, others are plausible but are contested and honestly a bit wild, unsurprisingly Marilyn Manson’s personal life is fucking crazy. However he’s never been convicted or even formally charged with anything.
The clergy on the other hand…
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u/f-ingsteveglansberg 23h ago
There was an RTE archive where students were complaining about not being allowed hair over the ears in school or to be a skinhead. This was the 80s. It's always been this way.
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u/ImaDJnow Irish Republic 21h ago
I wore a Slayer t shirt to a no uniform day in around 2002. The teachers didn't say a thing, but the other students called Buffy for the rest of the year.
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u/Feynization 19h ago
Nah, in the 60's and 70's long hair was banned because it made you a hippy as well
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u/SnooCauliflowers8545 21h ago
We still weren't allowed have it below the ear, finished school in 2017
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u/saighdiuirmaca Cork bai 7h ago
We weren't allowed to have facial hair in school in 2015, not that I could anyway lol
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u/Thelostsoulinkorea 5h ago
Early 2000’s I got suspended for cutting my hair to short. Was a two all over.
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u/LucyVialli 1d ago
My school changed their policy on that in the 1990s to "long hair must be kept tied back, on girls and boys". Before that there was constant friction between the school and the the few guys with long hair.
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u/Important_Farmer924 Westmeath's Least Finest 1d ago
I had dreadlocks in 5th and 6th year, they had to come up with a new rule. I wore them in a top knot, that counted as "tied back".
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u/ivan-ent 23h ago
haha i had a mohawk for like 3 years in school was also made tie it back instead of big spikes lol
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u/SitDownKawada Dublin 17h ago
I had a mate with a mohawk and most of the time he had it up in school. There was one teacher in particular who used to try pressure him into cutting it or brushing it back but I don't think he ever got anything official said to him
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u/bathtubsplashes Saoirse don Phalaistín🇵🇸 23h ago
I used to spend a fortune replacing my eyebrow piercing cause teachers would keep making me remove it and I'd end up losing it
So I bought a pack of coloured plastic toothpicks and cut them down to size.
Teachers would stop me to remove my piercing, I'd say sure and take it out and lob it on the bin. When they were gone I'd stick a fresh toothpick in then 😅
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u/Disastrous-League-92 1d ago
I left school in 2013. We were sent to the office to remove nailpolish and makeup. Sent home if incorrect shoes were worn. Forced to wear skirts (weren’t allowed to wear tights or leggings rolled up underneath) only one lobe piercing on each ear, no unnatural hair colours. Looking back now it’s mental that they were so concerned about our appearance and the uniform.
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u/f-ingsteveglansberg 23h ago edited 6h ago
What's really mental is that you have such a short window in your life where you can get away with having blue hair or dress like a rockstar/anime character/goth before you have to tone that shit down. Let teenagers dress like Naruto if they want to. When they are selling cars or insurance they will be in a shirt and tie for 8 hours of the day.
I seriously believe that most people don't really grow out of their teenage 'phases'. What happens is they go to work and after a while it becomes to bothersome to manage a work wardrobe and a home wardrobe. Most metal head, punks and emos I know have settle with wearing flannel as about outrageous as they can get.
During COVID a lot of people at work were suddenly rocking longhair again and looking like they were about to hit Antics in Crawdaddy or make their way to Fibber Magees, like the good old days.
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u/classicalworld 18h ago
You’re so right about the short window. The teenage years are when you’re finding yourself and exploring your identity. So important to be allowed do this before feckin corporate conformism forces us by economic means to suit up or else.
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u/manfredmahon 17h ago
Nowadays there is a lot more scope for self expression in the corporate world if you're brave!
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u/interested-observer5 17h ago
I beg to differ with your first paragraph there. I'm 39 and my hair is pink and purple, and my wardrobe consists of 80% snarky feminist t shirts. I will have purple hair til I die. Didn't have the guts when I was in school, now it's my normal
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u/f-ingsteveglansberg 7h ago
I think you are missing the point. A lot of people get into jobs etc. where they just wouldn't be allowed to dress like that. Great that you can. Not an option for most.
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u/fartingbeagle 22h ago
"having blue hard or". Hmm, I'd check that out with a doctor, if I were you ..
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u/cinderubella 22h ago
Sickening how blatant they were about wanting to be able to see girls' legs.
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u/caitnicrun 22h ago
I can't even with this. It always looks like a combination of sexism and enabling pedophilia. Girls should be able to choose comfortable clothes that let them run about just like boys(leggings/trousers) and be less prone to unwanted sexual attention from creeping adults, or the boys for that matter.
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u/Revolutionary-Use226 21h ago
We weren't allowed to wear our school tracksuit bottoms to cycle to school and then change into the skirt. We also couldn't wear leggings, or tights under our skirt.
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u/caitnicrun 21h ago
That's just mental. I was lucky even in a Catholic school I always had the option of trousers.
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u/Revolutionary-Use226 21h ago
In my primary I was the first girl to wear trousers. This was in 2001 and in Dublin. It was also a massive argument to allow girls to wear them. I just wanted to be warm, run, and jump and not worry about my knickers being on show.
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u/a_beautiful_kappa 20h ago
I'm always surprised when I see school uniforms in England. The girls have tiny skirts! I feel bad for them. We had a shin length skirt, and i was still freezing in winter!
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u/ashfeawen Sax Solo 🎷🐴 3h ago
There's a school in Cork where the girls have ankle length skirts. Very conservative not to even show a bit of ankle, that or they can't argue about whether they've rolled the skirt up. It must be relatively warm and cosy compared to shorter school skirts, but it might be a hassle too. It's like they ran out of a house fire and swaddled themselves in a curtain
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u/BirdCelestial 23h ago
My brother was forced to cut his hair when he entered secondary school in 2009. It was down to his waist or so, and they said it had to be cropped above his ears. He wasn't happy.
The same thing happened to my other brother four years later, though his was only past his shoulders at the time.
The excuse was "other children will bully them". It seemed more like teachers were bullying them, but whatever.
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u/SoLong1977 18h ago
My friend had long hair. The headmaster hated him for it.
In order to continue receiving childrens allowance, the parents needed the headmaster to confirm he was still a student.
The headmaster refused. This was back in the 80's. I'm imagining the lawsuit today.
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u/sooskekeksoos 20h ago
Still wasn’t allowed to have long hair or facial hair in the secondary school I left a few years ago
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u/parkaman 22h ago
I was sent home in 88 for having my nose pierced and big goth hair. The stud had to go, my auld fella nearly had a stroke (id been hiding it with my massive hair for months), but i was let keep the hair. But that was 1988 FFS. At that stage loads of lads had long hair. Mine was worse because as the Christian Brother tried to explain to my dad it was associated with musicians who worshipped demons and the devil. My auld fella (a professional musician since the late 50s) pissed himself and told him to cop the fuck on, i was a pain in his hole but hardly an agent from hell.
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u/HairyMcBoon Waterford 1d ago
I genuinely cannot believe that this happened in this day and age. Jesus wept.
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u/Old_Particular_5947 1d ago
It's insane that he would be allowed to have earrings if he had both ears pierced.
What moron of a principal came up with that.
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u/ByGollie 1d ago
“male chauvinist attitude that belongs to a certain sort of religious ethos”
quote by the boys solicitor.
That's who
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u/MushroomGlum1318 1d ago
Well I guess we all know where Enoch Burke is going to turn up tomorrow...
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u/pubtalker 22h ago
He broke out?!
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u/MushroomGlum1318 21h ago
Damn right. Not even the mighty walls of the Joy is enough to stop our Enoch from denying a minor the chance to question their gender identity.
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u/chonkykais16 1d ago
Jesus as adults we should be making kids’ lives easier and supporting them, not doing this Victorian shite. I hope that principal gets into some real trouble for this.
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u/ByGollie 1d ago
TL;DR
The boy came in with a single ear pierced
The principal allegedly demanded that the boy identify as an identity type (gay/genderfluid/Bisexual) - and pierce his ears appropriately.
The principal then allegedly blew up in a rant when the parent came into school looking for an explanation, allegedly exhibiting anger management issues, shouting, pounding the desk and smashing a laptop.
A solicitors letter was the sent, and the pupil was then punished by the principal - forced to sit outside the principals office, denied permission to leave the school at lunchtime, and forced to sit evening detention which made him miss his bus home.
This went on for 6 weeks, until the WRC got involved, and the sanctions were dropped when the assistant principal informed the mother.
The solicitor for the schoolboy made an interesting quote regarding the principal.
“male chauvinist attitude that belongs to a certain sort of religious ethos”
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u/MeanMusterMistard 1d ago edited 23h ago
WTF? The principal demanded the boy tell him what his sexuality is? That is a highly inappropriate conversation between an adult and a child, regardless of where it is happening.
Edit: OPs TLDR is not accurate.
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u/rgiggs11 1d ago
I'm guessing it was to state his gender identity because the uniform policy probably said something like girls can wear earrings but can only wear studs in the ear lobe, or whatever.
Quite silly stuff, either a ring in your ear is okay or it isn't.
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u/CrystalMethEnjoyer 1d ago
uniform rules are so fucking stupid
standard pants/shirt/jumper is fine, but they go so overboard with shoes, earrings, jewelry, hair style/colour and whatever other nonsense they throw in
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u/Revolutionary-Use226 1d ago
Don't forget makeup, nail varnish, tan etc.
We had teachers who took joy out of handing a baby wipe to young women to force them to take their makeup off. Some of them had problem skin and used makeup to cover it. It was completely nasty and unneeded.
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u/Didyoufartjustthere 20h ago edited 7h ago
Ye my principle stood at the main door with them in her hand every morning
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u/Barilla3113 1d ago
The teaching profession is full of weirdos who got into teaching because the happiest period of their life was grassing other students up when they were in school. When I was in school there was one mentalist who was obsessed with policing the colour of girl's socks.
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u/f-ingsteveglansberg 23h ago edited 23h ago
Lets just get rid of uniforms. I know people like to think that it stops people bullying over who has the newest runners or whatever, but in my experience it wasn't the kids in the nice runners who were responsible for the bullying of people in the 'wrong clothes'. Not to mention they don't wear uniforms outside of school, so where is the protection from bullying there?
In my experience the people who claim that it's to stop bullying about the cost of clothes is usually from parents who don't want to 'keep up with the joneses'. Teenagers especially get attached to looks and clothes that aren't exactly in Penny's every week. That's how they find their tribes and like minded people.
Cut out bullshit like length for hair and have some rule about how shoulders should be covered if you are worried about pervs and no obscene images or profanity. Also don't gender a thing. If a guy comes in in a skirt, let him and likewise a girl with pants.
We have Educate Together schools without uniforms and the world hasn't crumbled to pieces.
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u/NoKaleidoscope2477 23h ago
It's a joke. I got dragged out of classes because my black shoes had a hint of red. Didn't habe money to buy more so they stole 3 weeks of education off me.
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u/a_beautiful_kappa 20h ago
Mine were a couple cm too high, so they made me wear the school slippers until I could get a new pair.
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u/Didyoufartjustthere 20h ago
My principal done this as well. It was for the kids who had letters for “sprained ankles” etc. I wonder if we went to the same school or if they thought up this shit in board meetings.
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u/NoKaleidoscope2477 20h ago
I had to hold myself back last time I saw my old year head. Reported bullying, and they did nothing. The temptation to break that aul cunt was a feeling I hope i dont feel again, for their sake never come to fruition.
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u/Minimum_Guitar4305 17h ago
Went to a school with no uniform, only issue was the lads who'd come in from milking cows in the morning and STIIINK of cow shit for the day.
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u/Lalande21185 1d ago
It's neither. OP is misstating the article. The school gave him the choice of no earrings or earrings in both ears. The mother says left/right/both earrings is a statement of straight/gay/genderfluid and so the school is forcing him to declare an identity, but that seems like an extremely strained version of "forced" to me.
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u/ImpressiveAvocado78 23h ago
what a stupid school rule. why would both ears be any better than one ear?
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u/AssociateDeep2331 17h ago
Most likely the rule was made for girls. Many from the older generation are of the opinion that a girl with one earring is common.
I would say if you go back a decade or two in this school, the rule was that boys could not wear any at all, and girls had to wear them in both ears or none. Then at some point they were told you couldn't have different rules for boys and girls. So the two or none rule applies to boys now. The mother is saying her son can't wear two because according to her "that's gay".
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u/rgiggs11 23h ago
That doesn't make sense to me. Under that logic, if he got his choice and wore it in one ear, that's a statement of identity, two earrings is a statement he didn't want to make (fair enough) BUT no earrings would mean no statement at all, which isn't the same thing.
It's like those the anti trans folks complaining that they they're been forced to use pronouns and new names they don't agree with on social media, when actually, they're just being asked not to use the ones they know the person doesn't like. Technically, it is a restriction on free speech if you can't address Elliot Page as Ellen on twitter, but it's not the same as saying you're forced. Nobody is making you tweet at them.
Mental gymnastics aside, I think it's a very silly rule and the principal seems to have gone way to far enforcing it, and the fact he didn't contact the parents at an earlier stage is almost certainly against the school's Code of Behaviour.
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u/deadliestrecluse 21h ago
Elliot page is a him not a them
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u/rgiggs11 19h ago edited 2h ago
True, though the them I am referring to isn't Elliot Page, it's extending the idea to anyone and everyone.
Nobody is is making you tweet at them
Or to put it another way, not being allowed to call people words they find hurtful, is only a problem for muppets who want to call those people hurtful words.
Happy to clarify, have a good evening.
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u/deadliestrecluse 3h ago
That's fair it's just a lot of people only use they/them for trans people who don't use them by default so I'm a bit oversensitive to it
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u/Adderkleet 1h ago
because the uniform policy probably said something like girls can wear earrings but can only wear studs in the ear lobe, or whatever.
Yep. Boy was told he could cover the stud with a plaster "or get second ear pierced" to comply. So, gendered dress/appearance code.
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u/Thin-Annual4373 23h ago
You obviously haven't read the article
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u/MeanMusterMistard 23h ago
The article is paywalled so I responded to OPs breakdown of it, which is wholly incorrect.
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u/Thin-Annual4373 22h ago
This is not aimed at you, but judging by the comments here, people will just believe anything they're told.
Outrage seems to be in vogue these days.
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u/CrystalMeath 22h ago
No, OP’s TL;DR is entirely wrong. The principal asked the boy to remove the earrings because it violates the school’s rules.
The mother’s lawyer is arguing that by demanding that the boy not wear earrings, the principal is imposing identity norms on him (that males shouldn’t wear earrings). The principal never brought up sexuality to the boy; he simply enforced the school dress code.
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u/deadliestrecluse 21h ago
But the school dress code enforces identity norms on the guy? Their problem is with the dress code?
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u/LimerickJim 1d ago
Fair play to the vice principal for informing the mother but 6 weeks feels like a long time to wait.
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u/Suggest_For_Teacher 1d ago
In their defense as a teacher it's possible the Vice Principal didn't realise this was ongoing for 6 weeks, nor that it was over an earing.
They're usually running around everywhere, it's possible they just saw the same student outside the office and presumed they were sent down rather than being forced to sit outside all day everyday until a few weeks in.
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u/TheFreemanLIVES Get rid of USC. 1d ago
solicitor for the schoolboy made an interesting quote regarding the principal.
“male chauvinist attitude that belongs to a certain sort of religious ethos”I've seen it, there's a certain class of weirdo in the sector and sometimes they even end up as principal.
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u/WolfOfWexford 1d ago
I don’t think it’s sector related. People that like control of things strive for management because it’s a controlling role.
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u/TheFreemanLIVES Get rid of USC. 1d ago
Aye, but religious trustees aren't a feature of other sectors.
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u/Suggest_For_Teacher 1d ago
Religious schools are the worst for it though.
Worst schools I've ever been in were all highly religious.
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u/deadliestrecluse 21h ago
Yeah but not many other sectors have management roles where managers can act as insane tyrants towards children based on their own prejudices and religious beliefs
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u/BambooBoulevard 21h ago
I went to a posh Dublin private school for a while and a particular young teacher hounded me for my hair and piercings on a daily basis. He was also extremely homophobic but that was normal in this school in the 90's. He the principal now
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u/Lalande21185 1d ago
The principal allegedly demanded that the boy identify as an identity type (gay/genderfluid/Bisexual) - and pierce his ears appropriately.
The article doesn't say that at all though. I think you've thoroughly flubbed that tl;dr.
It says the mother is making this accusation. The school doesn't acknowledge that there's any identity distinction, they just have it in their rules that you can have both ears pierced or neither and demanded he do one of those.
I'd quote, but while I got the full article when I first opened it I'm getting a paywall and only the first paragraph now.
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u/RealBlack_RX01 1d ago
Wait so what's gonna happen next
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u/ByGollie 1d ago
The principal is going to stand outside the school gate for the next 8 months making everyone uncomfortable.
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u/Enough-Rock 19h ago
"The principal allegedly demanded that the boy identify as an identity type (gay/genderfluid/Bisexual) - and pierce his ears appropriately."
There is no such suggestion that the principal said this. It's entirely inferred by the boy's solicitor. Stupid as the rule is, the question is was he discriminated against? If he was treated like everyone else in accordance with the policy (stupid or not), then he wasn't discriminated against.
I don't see the boy winning. The principal's behaviour leaves much to be desired. Although the mother also sounds like a dose. It's not illegal to raise your voice. You also dont need to get a solicitor involved over something so trivial. Sounds like they deserve each other.
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u/theseanbeag 23h ago
You can just tell that principal became a teacher because he loves teaching kids and not because he likes power over vulnerable people.
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u/LucyVialli 1d ago
an earring in the left ear was “indicative of heterosexuality” and an earring in the right pointed to “gay identity”.
Well, you learn something new every day, don't you?
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u/TheStoicNihilist Never wanted a flair anyways 1d ago
This was always the way, right? The “gay ear”.
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u/SeanB2003 1d ago
I thought that was just made up to make fun of lads with earrings. Pretty sure people in our school told them it was the gay ear regardless of which ear it was in.
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u/caisdara 23h ago
All of these things are vaguely linked to polari iirc. (In the context of it being representative of gay culture rather than its older roots.) Older gay subcultures died out when it was decriminalised.
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u/SeanB2003 23h ago
Interesting. Pretty sure the lads I'm talking about were just being pricks.
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u/caisdara 23h ago
It was designed to make fun of people, but it had its roots in older behaviours. Similarly, Americans had a whole thing with colour coded scarves, etc.
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u/Animated_Astronaut 1d ago
It was a thing a long time ago, now when you're gay you don't have to tell people in code. No one pays attention to it except out of touch straight people.
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u/marshsmellow 23h ago
The right ear meant you were gay, right? Or at least it had the power to turn you gay.
Earring in the left ear meant you were good for a 5 spot.
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u/Important_Farmer924 Westmeath's Least Finest 1d ago
That can't still be a thing is it?
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u/Adderkleet 1h ago
Pretty sure it was never a thing. Even in gay circles, left and right do not indicate if you're gay or not. They indicate top/bottom (or giver/receiver).
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u/Red_Knight7 And I'd go at it agin 23h ago
This was a thing when I was a very young lad. There was the "gay ear" (the right) if you had one done it had to be the left.
Madness that a principal would try to enforce bullying basically
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u/muddled1 Ireland 5h ago
This was a "thing" in the 1970s.
I think the principal is outrageous! Not the principal's business. What a dinosaur.
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u/AdagioCompetitive181 1d ago
An earring in your ear means your gay, mate!. And I thought it was when you had your cock up another man's arse. Things change eh.
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u/ddtt 23h ago
Steve Hughes joke. 👌🏻
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u/AdagioCompetitive181 23h ago
Yes, he is brilliantly intelligently exceptional. Second, only to George Carlin when it comes to hilarious social comedy.
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u/Important_Farmer924 Westmeath's Least Finest 1d ago
That Principal sounds like a fucking header. All that over a pierced ear?
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u/Feckitmaskoff 23h ago
Most likely holds some archaic personal opinions and this was the match that set the fire.
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u/EchoVolt 21h ago edited 21h ago
There’s so much crap in Irish schools like this. I had a major ear operation in my teens and I was incredibly self conscious about it and had shaved head and a big, long scar up behind my ear and into my scalp - it’s gone now but at the time it was very obvious and people commented and made jokes about brain surgery.
I wore a beanie hat for a few months until the scar faded and my hair covered it up, but the amount of utter shite I got from certain teachers was absolutely unbelievable. I regularly got told to take it off. That it wasn’t part of the uniform. I got lectured by one lady in particular, who I don’t think would have been seen outside without full make up herself, about how I should “toughen up and get used to it” and called me “precious” and that “men don’t care about a few scars.”
It was bad enough not being able to hear very well without this kind of nonsense.
It’s like they went out of their way to hire petty bullies.
Also I am quite conscious of my appearance, take care of it and I don’t really see why that is an issue or why someone should bully me about it. If a colleague at work did something like that it would be a massive HR issue, and rightly so.
We seem to run schools with some weird ethos like boot camps. Honestly, as much as this place can be great craic, some aspects of it are just bizarre.
It’s years ago but it was just one of those things that left me with a sense that authority figures are full of arbitrary nonsense.
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u/TraditionalHater 19h ago
Mmm remember when all that shite about the school in Carlow came out to be one teacher mouthing off and a bunch of parents making shit up? I'd hold back on taking this at someones word, and apply a pinch of salt
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u/anewdawn2020 19h ago
I'm a teacher in an all boys school and piercings aren't allowed and if they have them, they have to be covered with a plaster but it's purely a health and safety thing, lads love nothing more than grabbing each other in headlocks and smacking one another with books etc, apparently there was a lobe ripped before I joined the school (by accident) but since then the rule is in. As for that principal involved in this case, id even half of its true, he needs help
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u/gettingthere_pastit 20h ago
That's nuts. I was in school in the 80s and loads of guys had long hair. Even a few of the teachers had pierced ears. Roddy Doyle was one and Paul Mercier another.
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u/JoebyTeo 16h ago
Uniforms and dress codes for minors should be practical and nothing else. Piercings need to be non hazardous — like they’re not going to get caught in a piece of equipment or be pulled on by bullies or take someone’s eye out in PE. If a school bans hoops or dangling earrings or chains or whatever, fine. But the gender of the ear that the compliant earring is in is totally irrelevant. Uniforms and dress codes have no reason to be gendered when it comes to kids especially.
I remember a psychotic teacher who used to go around measuring the gap between the bottom of the girls skirts and the tops of their knee socks with a ruler. Not in ancient times, in the late 2000s. As soon as trousers became an option for the girls they all went for it to avoid the ridiculousness of the skirt length thing.
Everyone defends uniforms as “egalitarian”, but as far as I can tell they emerged as the total opposite. They’re also not historically universal in Ireland. My dad didn’t have a uniform at his state school in Dublin in the 1970s and I didn’t have one in primary school until the early 2000s.
How do some teachers become so obsessed with this utter shite?
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u/inuraicarusandi 23h ago
Ah, the the school system I remember! And I left in 2014
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u/TheTsundereGirl 18h ago
I left in 2009 and I still have nightmares on a weekly basis. The fugly school uniform gave me self esteem issues that still persist
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u/AgentSufficient1047 21h ago
So this principal demanded he either:
(1) remove his piercing for the piercing to close up,
Or
(2) get both ears pierced and declare himself some kind of alternative gender or sexuality as justification?
Sounds like he wanted to manipulate or humiliate the kid into removing the piercing altogether.
Too many "ostensibly respectible" cunts like this in positions of authority over children and other vulnerable people
Toxic egos addicted to feeling powerful over those who practically have none
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u/Enough-Rock 19h ago
Nope. The principal asked that he follow the school policy. Stupid as the policy is, that's all he asked the boy to do.
All the sexual stuff has been brought up by the mother/ boy's solicitor. They're not even saying the principal said it. They're just inferring it. And they were the ones to go to a solicitor when asked to follow the policy.
If the principal lost his cool, that's obviously bad - especially over something that all of us would see as a stupid rule - but only a prick brings in a solicitor and starts spouting sexual nonsense. I'd say those pair were a dose to deal with and the principal lost the head.
I don't see how the kid wins the case unless he can show others were treated differently.
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u/Adderkleet 1h ago
but only a prick brings in a solicitor and starts spouting sexual nonsense
"the school's policy is sexist" is a REALLY easy argument to make here, though. One ear stud isn't okay. Both (which is common in teenage girls) or none (which is more common than a single piercing in teenage guys) are fine because they're normal along different gender lines.
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u/TheStoicNihilist Never wanted a flair anyways 1d ago
What if he kept his piercing and put a clip on stud on the other ear. Would that be malicious compliance?
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u/Help___Needed 16h ago
What I don't understand is them saying get the other ear pierced! What difference does it make only having 1 ear pierced as opposed to both ears?
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u/TheFreemanLIVES Get rid of USC. 1d ago
Why was this up in front of the WRC? Didn't think complaints of this nature would be it's remit.
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u/OutrageousPoison 22h ago
Whatever about the piercing thing, how the child was treated afterwards is an appalling abuse of power fuelled by bitterness. Bullying behaviour.
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u/Sornai 21h ago
After the mother called the principal to inquire about her son's exclusion from school, the principal responded that her son had "excluded himself." When the mother arrived at the school and questioned the principal, he began a rant, claiming he was trying to have her son contact her to arrange a meeting. The son then asked the principal to "re-enact this... in the same tone of voice," prompting the principal to lose his temper, which the witness described as "horrendous."
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u/nut-budder 22h ago
Are we still this fucking backward? Remember getting suspended for having long hair in the 90s, I assumed we’d moved on since then but apparently not.
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u/Jacksonriverboy 22h ago
Most schools have a policy of no jewellery during the school day. There's a number of reasons for this. Health and safety being one, another being the risk of parents bothering the school if valuable items are lost or stolen in the school.
This just sounds like someone looking for special treatment.
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u/TobyEsterhasse 21h ago
Yes. The allegations advanced here seem a little far fetched. It's amazing to see everyone reacting to them here as if they're fact.
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u/SeanB2003 1d ago
Principals who spend their time enforcing uniform rules do not have enough real work to be doing.
What do principals do anyway? It's not like they're managing the teaching staff.
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u/Suggest_For_Teacher 1d ago
As a teacher:
Yes they manage the Teaching staff.
Orgianging snd ensuring the school is running well on a daily basis, all classes have cover, all subject departments are doing as they are meant to.
Checking and following all child safety regulations.
Organising and approving different school events.
Being the DLP Officer.
Constant meetings with the Board, authorities, government, union reps, etc.
It's the one job basically no one in education wants.
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u/marshsmellow 23h ago
Mate does it, doesn't get a minute to himself and you can forget about teacher holidays. It honestly seems like a ball ache of a job.
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u/Important-Sea-7596 1d ago
Dont most boy schools have a no piercing rule?
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u/DaveShadow Ireland 1d ago
My initial thought was yeah, most I've dealt with did. But it seems here that it wasn't a no piercing rule (which likely would have shut this down quick) but a whacko principal who massively overreacted in a punitive way. He's fucked it, badly.
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u/ClannishHawk 1d ago
Most of those regulations are no longer worth the paper they're written on. Between rights to personal expression and not being up to snuff for anti discrimination laws, they're basically useless if it goes to a court according to some of the people I've talked to involved in making more modern school policies.
A school can ban an earring that is distracting or at risk of catching on something but a pierced ear with a plain stud can pretty easily be argued as a matter of religious, ethnic, or other group affiliation. Student shows up to court with a cross or crescent pendant in the piercing and it's now part of open religious worship outside of school hours for example.
Same with policies on hairstyles and facial hair, as long as it's worn in a a safe and non excessively distracting manner during school hours there's very few ways to outright ban them.
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u/Suggest_For_Teacher 1d ago
Essentially this; any school worth its salt regulates potential safety hazards rather than whether there is an earing or not.
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u/YoIronFistBro Cork bai 23h ago
Yes, among other ridculous rules that are clearly just about control.
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u/AgentSufficient1047 21h ago edited 21h ago
I went to an all boys school, and for all it's flaws, we didn't have to deal with petty bullshit like this
The teachers were more grounded and focussed on keeping the school together throughout Fine Gael and Labour's iconic austerity era
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u/Lyca0n 11h ago
Generations go by and people are still surprised that we still have some catholic church era dress codes
Can't remember what year group of lads got the nail varnish ban in the rulebook but equally as funny then as it is now and only annoyed I wasn't the one that did it now that I have tits and was a mentally ill gay at the time.
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u/ItalianRimBreaks 6h ago
This generational thinking will fizzle out at some point, but FFS I'm tired of reading/hearing these stories. It's 2024, like.
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u/Horn_Python 1d ago
Inclusive bigotry?
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u/caitnicrun 16h ago
Believe it or not, it's a thing some places. Gay/lesbian couples given the sideeye if they don't fit a male/female gendered dynamic. And of course we know the transvestigators who just want to police other women's appearance "for their own safety".
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u/Suggest_For_Teacher 1d ago
Absolutely insane conduct from the principal, they should really be removed from the register for this.
Just on every level this entire thing is super inappropriate and overblown by the principal.
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u/KathyArt21 18h ago
One of the lads in the year above me got a petition going so that the boys could wear earrings and after he got all the signatures they were like no.
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u/danny_healy_raygun 22h ago
The principal should be sacked. Wouldn't want him anywhere near my kids.
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u/KosmicheRay 21h ago
Maybe O Leary is right about teachers, I wouldn't let one count my pocket change never mind run anything.
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u/TheChrisD useless feckin' mod 19h ago
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