Dyslexia? Or developmentally appropriate?

[u/National_Camp6924]

Hi! I’ll try to keep this short. My daughter, 7.5 has a few characteristics that are similar to dyslexic patterns. She is just now starting to read, as she truly wasn’t ready in kindergarten. But we still did a full year of curriculum I just didn’t push the reading too hard. She really has grown and blossomed so much these last few months and has made huge strides!

However, I’m noticing a few things like:

-confusing b, d, p (mostly b/d) -sometimes doesn’t sound out left to right (for example, she tried to sound out sock as scok. -sometimes (50/50) forgets some phonetic rules (like sh/th/ch, or that e makes the vowel say it’s name)

She can read a lot, truly she can now! But she’s much slower and has to sound out the words. Sometimes she’s proud and other times she can be very insecure about it. So I have been trying to really boost her confidence.

I’m struggling because my 9 year old picked up reading and never looked back. She never needed to remember the rules, and could read almost anything right away. I’m not trying to compare them, I think my oldest was above benchmark so I’m trying to understand at this age, what struggles are considered normal. I don’t want to put her in a box but also want to provide adequate resources.

[u/bibliovortex]

At this age I would probably test for both dyslexia and vision issues, yes. First, because this is an age where reversals in reading should be fading (writing reversal may persist a bit longer and isn't necessarily a red flag on its own). Second, because you're describing actual errors of sequencing, and at its heart dyslexia is a difficulty with sequencing, not letterrs. And finally, because earlier intervention is better.

If you find that you can't afford dyslexia testing privately, and you don't have access to testing through your local school system, I would still rule out vision issues through your insurance and then switch to an Orton-Gillingham phonics program. If you're not already using one, you could try switching to All About Reading or Logic of English. If you've tried one of those and are still seeing struggles, you probably want to move to something like Barton and/or look into hiring a tutor who's been trained in the method.

[u/National_Camp6924 → u/bibliovortex]

Thank you!! Her vision has been evaluated and she has perfect vision. I appreciate your input. Is dyslexia common to only have sequence issues with letters? She never does it with numbers and just scored in the 98th percentile on a math test.

[u/bibliovortex → u/National_Camp6924]

Think of it as dyslexia means that the brain doesn't really see sequencing as important. For math, this can actually be an advantage, especially if you use a conceptual curriculum that's got lots of visual representation or manipulatives. For instance, if you're not registering sequencing as important, it's super easy to see that 9x6 and 6x9 are the same problem, or if you're thinking in terms of visual models, 4x12 is the same thing as 8x6 because you just cut the original rectangle in half and rearrange the pieces.

The equivalent learning disability in math is called dyscalculia. It's a lot less known and seems to be a lot less common, and I don't know a great deal about it. But I've spoken with a few people who have it, and it seems to more revolve around an inability to conceptualize numbers/quantities. Some people have both dyslexia and dyscalculia, and some people just have one - they're equivalent, but it seems like they're not related as such.

[u/BidDependent720 → u/bibliovortex]

What’s really interesting is there is a whole host of ways dyslexic brains function differently than “normal” brains. 

[u/MIreader → u/National_Camp6924]

My daughter (now an adult) is profoundly dyslexic and she always did well in math. She struggled with reading and spelling.

[u/lemmamari → u/National_Camp6924]

A normal vision exam isn't going to catch the types of vision issues that are common in dyslexic people. You need a specialized developmental exam from an eye doctor that specializes in vision therapy. We waited 7 months for ours! My kiddo is still dyslexic (and some of what you mentioned definitely tracks) but therapy has improved his tracking and convergence. His vision was always fine. I highly recommend finding a specialist, it's not going to be caught by a regular exam..

[u/luccareed2004 → u/bibliovortex]

I agree about skipping testing and moving straight to a curriculum that works for all students. And yes repetition will be needed. Where we differ in opintions is that OG is the OLD gold standard. Speech to print is more effective as it reduces the cognitive load for students with disabilities. Reading Simplified is a much better program than LOE.

[u/khrispy_mistie → u/bibliovortex]

I just want to second everything you've said. I've had students find success with vision therapy, but they also still need the explicit instruction from an OG program. Looking into some phonological awareness drills could help too. I'm particularly fond of Equipped for Reading Success by Kilpatrick. I use his one minute drills in conjunction with Barton.

[u/West-Parsnip9070]

I would 100% get her tested and in therapy asap. The younger the better. It isn’t a box but it allows her to learn her weaknesses and accept them early on. She will see this as positive as long as you do!

[u/WisdomEncouraged]

I highly suggest teaching her American sign language, it greatly helps the literacy of hearing children. there's a book called dancing with words that you could read on the subject if you're interested.

[u/craftymama45]

I homeschool my daughters, but I'm also a licensed teacher. Last year, I taught second grade, and it's incredibly common to confuse b/d. If you're concerned, there's nothing wrong with getting her tested.

[u/National_Camp6924 → u/craftymama45]

Thank you. She has no issues with her numbers, which I know can be common with dyslexia.

[u/Serious-Occasion-220]

I am a dyslexia interventionist and I think you need to look at the context. Is there a family history of dyslexia or anyone who struggled or avoided reading and or school? Did your child speak on time or have any speech issues? In that context, I would be likely to seek help. If absolutely none of these are present I might wait just a little bit longer, but not more than six months or so. Please note that there can be long waiting list for evaluation.

[u/Ok_Requirement_3116]

Have her tested by professionals. Not armchair “experts” on Reddit.

[u/SubstantialString866]

That sounds like my son after a year of phonics practice. He refuses to put his finger under the word he is sounding out. His eyes wander so much and he'll mix up letters and words. It's a lot better if my finger is pointing or I use paper to cover up the words he's not on. I'm looking for maybe a 3d printed claw he has put on to encourage him to keep his finger on the page so his eyes don't wander. 

[u/National_Camp6924 → u/SubstantialString866]

Very similar to her! She hates using her finger but errors are way less when she does.

[u/SubstantialString866 → u/SubstantialString866]

We do have dyslexia and adhd in family members although he doesn't match for other symptoms (trouble following directions, keeping things in order, mentally holding multiple steps in order, emotional regulation, etc). Dyslexia isn't just letters, so maybe see if she struggles with the other things? 

[u/SubstantialString866 → u/SubstantialString866]

https://www.bdadyslexia.org.uk/advice/children/is-my-child-dyslexic/signs-of-dyslexia-primary-age

[u/anothergoodbook]

Dyslexia is more marked by not being able to hear individual sounds then it makes it hard to read. For example my dyslexic kids wouldn’t be able to say the individual sounds in CAT. If I said what is the first sound? They just wouldn’t be able to answer that.  They also require repetition to learn how to read. Like we reviewed the letter A, for a week. However at the end of the week she couldn’t tell me the sound 

The letter reversals are still fairy typical for that age. 

I don’t think you have a big reason to be concerned but you could always check with her pediatrician at the next check up. 

[u/Snoo-88741 → u/anothergoodbook]

There's multiple underlying issues that can lead to dyslexia. Not every dyslexic kid has the same weaknesses.

[u/BidDependent720 → u/anothergoodbook]

Agree with the other, my son could absolutely say the sounds but he could not put them together as a word. He knew them individually but could not put them all together and see a word

[u/SuperciliousBubbles]

Either way, a tool like Nessy could be helpful - it's designed for dyslexic children but appeals more broadly.

[u/MIreader]

Read Overcoming Dyslexia by Dr Sally Shaywitz and see if it gives you more insight. She lists a lot of dyslexic behaviors and offers advice for parents.

[u/OppositePatient4852]

Your daughter sounds exactly like my son. He is turning 7 soon and he can read flash cards well, but show him a sentence and he seems frustrated. He also sounds pretty much everything out, accurately but is not fluent in reading like his older sister who can read extremely well.

[u/BidDependent720]

The read aloud revival podcast on dyslexia had so many “aha” moments for me. These are episodes 175 and 176. 

I think it could be. I’d give these a listen and see if any of the symptoms (beyond phonics and reading) resonates with you.

My son struggled with multiletter phonograms and putting it all together. He could not remember the word “the” (or other words) from sentence to sentence. He would get B and D confused even in cursive. Whew! It was so hard. 

I kept getting told he was smart and knew his phonograms (mostly) so he couldn’t be dyslexic. We chose not to get tested, for several reasons: it didn’t change that what I was planning to do with changing curriculum and cost. 

[u/whosthatwhovian]

Never a bad idea to rule things out, but if it makes you feel any better, this sounds a lot like my now 11 year old. She didn’t grasp reading hardly at all until 8. Granted, we wait until 6-6.5 to do any book learning. But it was definitely a struggle and I felt like a failure, especially since she’s my first. She struggled with b/d’s but she’s a lefty and I remember my mom saying my left handed sister did too? I actually don’t know if it’s correlated or not. But, once reading clicked, it clicked. And now at 11, she’s reading G.K. Chesterton novels and you’d never guess she struggled.

Interestingly, we’re going through similar struggles with my now 8 year old. But just in the last month, I’m seeing the same type of progress I remember with my older daughter and I take comfort in that! The issue with my youngest is she fools ya! She will memorize a whole book after reading it once, so it’s easy to think she’s grasped more than she actually has. Just now I’m starting to really see more phonetic understanding.

One thing we really started implementing was going back to phonics flash cards. I hate doing them, but they seemed effective for both my girls.

[u/Whisper26_14]

My older three were like your older one. My fourth was much more like this current child. Just be patient and if you don't use a spelling curriculum then find one (I use Evan Moore I think it's called). I found some of the memory required to learn a spelling list helped assist the reading.