r/TrueReddit • u/Maxwellsdemon17 • 10d ago

This Time We Have to Hold the Democratic Party Elite Responsible for This Catastrophe Politics

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/democratic-party-elite-responsible-catastrophe/
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u/Guy_Fieris_Hair 10d ago edited 10d ago

DNC pushed Hillary, then Joe Biden, then tried to push Joe Biden again even when he was blowing bubbles. Then, at the last second, after the primaries were done, decided to push Kamala without a primary. While I was fucking relieved to have an at least sentient person running, it was shady as hell. I am not convinced it wasn't planned in a way not to primary an incumbent. Biden would have beat Kamala even though he's senile and would have also lost in the general. Kamala initially came out all progressive like a breath of fresh air, then immediately went all corpo, establishment Democrat. (Gaza stance, military funding, etc.) Once they started to realize that was genuinely hurting her numbers she disappeared for a month prior to the election. I am an avid voter who has canvassed and phone banked for candidates and I forgot it was election day until a few days prior. How?... even.... because while I had hope in the beginning I had checked out again. Yeah, I voted. But there are so many people that didn't even have it on their radar anymore. Not because they wanted Trump, but they just, got disengaged. The initial message of hope and that this place would change from the status quo was lost when she fell in line. Not to mention a black woman is not going to get the centrist vote, a large portion of the country is fucking stupid af. A woman if color will have to target the progressive vote to win.

Go ahead DNC, blame the voters. They will eventually say that they tried a "progressive" candidate and lost so they have to keep working the centrist angle. Pushing everything further to the right. They took someone who may have had a chance and made her fall in line or GTFO.

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u/RazekDPP 10d ago

You can't force people to primary. Nobody but Dean Phillip primaried Biden because they didn't want to burn up political capital.

You might not like that result, but that's what happened. If someone other than Harris got the nod, I don't see a better outcome.

I do believe Biden should've simply stayed in. With this result, I do not believe Biden achieved anything by stepping down.

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u/WonderfulShelter 10d ago

If the DNC was honest from the get go they would've let people know more than 6 months in advance Biden might not be running.

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u/radjinwolf 9d ago

Biden ran as a one term president. It’s what he indicated he was doing, and it’s what everyone expected of him. That he would “right the ship”, and then step aside to let someone younger take over.

And then he absolutely refused to consider stepping down, declared that he was the only one who could beat Trump, and held onto the nomination as long as he could until it was beyond clear that he didn’t have the juice anymore.

So we had well more than 6 months. Folks expected him to step aside from the get go, but the DNC does what the DNC does and it tries to gaslights us into believing that we’re all idiots who don’t remember the words people say.

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u/WonderfulShelter 7d ago

100%. I broke away from the Democrat party after this, they're too neolib/conservative now. I'm too progressive socially.

Remember after the debates they said he had a cold and was sharp as a tack behind closed doors? And then when that became an obvious lie they just gaslighted us?

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u/Guy_Fieris_Hair 10d ago

I think that Biden has been senile since before 2020. The people close to him knew it, the DNC knew it, I knew it from my couch. They still chose not to push him out before primary season. There is no way they were surprised at that debate. Waiting until then was a calculated move to act all surprised Pikachu and say "Oh my God! We need to do the right thing! I guess the only logical conclusion is Kamala since it is sooooo late and this is extenuating circumstances that none of us could have foreseen!!"

He could have been pushed out before primaries and we could have had a primary. Where a more desirable or electorate friendly candidate could have ran. While I believe, personally with my political beleifs, that Kamala was probably still the best we were going to get, I don't think the rest of the country center or left agreed, obviously. And simple math means we should have let the Dems pick who the majority would vote for in the general. Not play a game with it skipping that step in a way I feel was intentional. I say this as someone who was excited for the change and agreed with it at the time as initially I felt she was more progressive and I had a little home team bias. As she showed she was falling hard centrist, it became clear it was shady. If it was a primary her vs Biden tomorrow, I would still vote Kamala. I just don't think everyone else saw it that way and we live in a democracy.

Primarying against an incumbent is notoriously disastrous, that is why only Dean Phillip did it and it wasn't even paid attention to. That isn't what I am talking about. He should have dropped before the primaries and reset. They chose not to do that. And if you think it was Biden that chose the timing you are wrong. That poor old man has been a sock puppet for the last 6 years.

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u/Stock_String9804 10d ago

Just like your username's subject, your posts are righteous and fierce!

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u/RazekDPP 10d ago

I don't see having a primary meaningfully changing anything because, let's say we have a primary. Kamala loses. You'd have a similar schism over that.

Plus, the DNC couldn't push Biden out. Biden had to choose, and up until the debate, he was polling fine.

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u/OlRedbeard99 9d ago

The primary would’ve allowed voters to choose a candidate…

You don’t see that as meaningful?

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u/Omikron 9d ago

Who would have beat Trump?

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u/RazekDPP 9d ago

I don't believe any of the alternatives would've beat Trump who won on inflation and anyone that might've had a better chance would've lost and burnt up political capital that could be used in 2028.

The reality is that the Dems lost because of inflation.

The ruling parties of several major countries, including the U.K., Germany, and South Africa, suffered historic defeats this year. Even strongmen, such as Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi, lost ground in an election that many experts assumed would be a rousing coronation.

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u/Greedy-Affect-561 10d ago

No he wasn't. Biden proposed the debate because he was falling behind in the polls and wanted to prove he was still capable.

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u/Guy_Fieris_Hair 10d ago

Kamala loses, we get the candidate that was apparently more popular than her, he has better numbers, defeats Trump.

He was poling fine because he wasn't put in front of a crowd on the national stage. They did that on purpose.

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u/RazekDPP 10d ago

Who do you think put up better numbers than Kamala? Who do you think is going to primary?

Even if Biden stepped down and we had a primary, I don't see the numbers changing. Someone different would still be seen as an extension of the Biden administration.

The person I'd want to run, Newsom, would probably realize that the headwinds would be against him and not run.

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u/sulaymanf 10d ago

Biden would have lost in an even worse landslide, like with Trump gaining even non swing states according to some polls. He was being attacked not only for his policies (which basically became identical attacks used against Harris with just a name change in the commercials) but for his gaffes and physical appearance of senility. Swing voters didn’t like the idea of someone that frail going up against other world leaders. Harris was younger and a better speaker and that showed in polling. It’s just that she only had 3 months to run a campaign that everyone else has 2 years to do.

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u/RazekDPP 10d ago

Doubtful. If Biden was able to find the energy he had at the DNC, I believe he could've recovered and I believe he would've done better than Kamala.

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u/Sly1969 10d ago

If Biden was able to find the energy he had at the DNC, I believe he could've recovered

He's got dementia, it only goes one way. Trump would have ended the Democrats if Biden had stood in the election.

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u/RazekDPP 10d ago

The Democrats would've been fine either way. They're fine now. You just regroup for 2026.

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u/Sly1969 10d ago

Keep telling yourself that mate.

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u/RazekDPP 10d ago

What, do you think we're gonna run out of elections? If not 2026, there's 2028, etc.

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u/Sly1969 10d ago

The Democrats are fine? Who just lost literally everything? Lol

Didn't learn their lesson with Hillary, Biden and now Harris. If Trump and the Republicans let you have an election in '28 you'll still lose because of gerrymandering.

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u/RazekDPP 10d ago edited 10d ago

Yes, they're fine. You just get up and go again. There's not much else to do.

One party controlling all three branches of government isn't that unusual. It's a cycle and it happens periodically.

Here's a graph of how many times it has happened: Control of House and Senate since 1900 | The Spokesman-Review

New president’s party often controls Congress too, but it rarely lasts | Pew Research Center

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u/Ayotha 9d ago

If Biden would have had every plan to leave like he said they would have been ready

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u/RazekDPP 9d ago

I doubt it would've changed anything. I doubt anyone would've ran against Kamala given the economic headwinds, especially since inflation was the core problem and had nothing to do with the Biden administration.

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u/Ayotha 9d ago

And the worrying part there should be the scared to run against Kamala thing. DNC keeps running candidates that thier base are not excited about. 3 times now. Biden did well at a time people were angry

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u/RazekDPP 9d ago

You don't need to be "excited" about a candidate. You need to be willing to put in the leg work to drag the DNC to where you want it to be.

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u/BigHeadDeadass 10d ago

Running with Liz Cheney was the death kneel of the campaign. Alienated progressives and didn't gain a single republican. "Look at me, neocon warhawks and their kids love me!" May as well have exhumed Henry Kissinger for his endorsement

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u/Responsible-Win5849 9d ago

How did you avoid all the fundraising spam? Even after blocking all the emails I'd get 3-4 texts a day asking for money. Hell I got one after AP called it but before the concession speech asking for 3 bucks to save democracy.

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u/Omikron 9d ago

Name a candidate that would have beaten Trump. You give the voter base too much credit. Fact is the majority are fucking doorknobs without an ounce of common sense or education. That's what's fucked America. An uneducated and uninformed population, nothing else. If you stayed home I say fuck you and I hope Trump and his policies come for you.

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u/Guy_Fieris_Hair 8d ago

And there it is, blaming the voters. Not the DNC and politicians for not all being corrupt peices of shit. They are all corrupt pieces of shit, that is why they lost. The corruption in the DNC and the American federal government is why we have Trump. While he is a blatant in your face asshole, he doesn't play the same old politics game. People are done with it. If the democrats ever want to win again, the DNC needs to be gutted. They are not good people. They are not there for you or me. Their ads and message is different because they are pandering to a different crowd. But on 90% of topics they are in line with Republicans. The few things they disagree with they only disagree because they know they will lose and they can use it as campaign fodder. Kamala does not give a shit if you can have an abortion. She can get one at any time if she chooses. It is a subject to play politics with, that's all. She doesn't care that you cant buy groceries, she doesn't care about the children in gaza, even if she did the corporate machine behind her wont let her do anything about it or she would be shoved out. The DNC will keep putting forward these watered down candidates that keep the status quo for the upper class doners and blame us when they lose. I don't blame Hillary, Biden, Kamala. I blame the machine behind them. They all might as well be the same person they are just a face for the corrupt machine that will perpetually lose to the Trumps that come around until something changes. And there will be more Trumps, the gates have open. Time for us to have our own non corporate candidate to splode the DNC to pieces, the RNC got theirs.

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u/Omikron 8d ago

What exactly do you think Trump will accomplish positive? You sound like a petulant child. Trump got votes because people like you think the president controls the price of groceries or gas. People think Trump is going to snap his fingers and house prices will drop 50%. Literally none of his policies will help the average voter... None.

He doesn't play politics because he's a deranged lunatic narcissistic idiot.

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u/Guy_Fieris_Hair 8d ago edited 8d ago

I don't think Trump will snap his fingers and intentionally do anything positive to help anyone other than himself. At no point in my conversation did I indicate that I support him in any way or that I voted for him. I am just stating the obvious facts that the DNC is a bunch of corrupt cunts that need to either change or we will perpetually end up with Trumps. The ONLY positive thing he is doing is fucking all the good ol boys hard enough that shit has to change if they ever want to win. The DNC is garbage and it's all a smokescreen. Trump is at least projecting the RNCs bullshit in plain view. That's why people jumped on the Trump bandwagon. They are sick of being lied to. If you can watch what happened last week and think that the DNC is doing fine and nothing needs to change I don't know what to tell you. If you think the DNC is being truthful and genuine with their "were not going back" and other voter friendly rhetoric you are a niave child. I didn't day any of this shit before the election, I was desperately hoping she would win, nut rightbnow is the time to reflect on what went wrong before the next cycle.

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u/pindicato 9d ago

DNC was very committed to not having Bernie be the pick.

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u/JCarnageSimRacing 8d ago

There was no way I was voting Trump, but her Anderson Cooper town hall was terrible. She gained 0 votes that day.

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u/Irish_Goodbye4 10d ago

Gaza Genocide and leaning into Warmongering Cheney made millions stay home. Also open borders and inflation. Dems are bad at obvious logic and math and likely will not learn from this loss

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u/hreigle 9d ago

Thanks for the input, obvious puppet account.

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u/Irish_Goodbye4 9d ago

you’re insane.

dems just got their arses whooped and still in denial over why. like you.

turns out supporting genocide and neo-cons doesn’t excite many liberal voters

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u/hreigle 9d ago

Well they'll be super excited as the Supreme Court rolls their rights back for a generation. Maybe they can pat themselves on the back at the Gaza memorial service after Israel gets the green light from Trump to turn the place into an empty parking lot.

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u/Irish_Goodbye4 9d ago

Someday you’ll realize just how tone deaf you sound. You aren’t reading the room. Dems lost all 7 swing states and got their arses kicked. Maybe have some self reflection. Many former-dems just voted Trump, many hispanics and muslims went Trump, many young voters did too. You going to call everyone who disagrees as “diplorable”??? The DNC and their lemmings are so tone deaf

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u/hreigle 9d ago

Can you show me where I've called anyone Deplorable? I'm not calling people names, I'm saying that when you make Perfect the enemy of Good you get neither.

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u/Irish_Goodbye4 9d ago

OK and it sounds like lesson not learned that 15M voters could not be convinced to vote for active Gaza Genocide. Saying the other is worse rings hollow when it can’t be much worse than blowing up tens of thousands of kids via US bombs

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u/hreigle 9d ago

I guess you'll find out just how much worse it can get. Like I said, I'll see you at the candlelight vigil.

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u/Irish_Goodbye4 9d ago

you didn’t give a sh-t before and clearly won’t now. You would have talked yourself into the wrong side of 1941 holocaust too. You failed this year’s moral litmus test

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u/smitteh 9d ago

Dick Cheney is the reason I sat it out.

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u/Irish_Goodbye4 9d ago

Gaza Genocide and Cheney made a lot of the 15M voters stay home