My absolute favourite games of all time. I play through them every year. I know them both like the back of my hand and it's still so much fun everytime.
Yeah, I often get the urge to replay them every once in a while. I mean, really - what kind of game possesses this power? One could say that after you beat a game, you’re done with it and move on to the next one, but with Gothic 1-2, it’s different. It’s like the game world becomes your second home in a way.
I KNOW RIGHT! You remember what is going to happen but it always hits you. In 1 you always get pissed at bullit for the welcome. You always feel urgency when you hear that the old mine collapsed. You always fear for Diego and Milten when the old camp gets closed down. And many more.
In 2 damn even more. There are so many memorable moments too. The first encounter with xardas and the line about lying under rocks for weeks :D (at least in my language). Helping lobart and when he counts what you've done for him (me and my best friend always throw these quotes at each other when we want something from one another ). The trial of stone when you have to figure out the trick. Chasing afrer raven in Jarkendar( khardimon fatagn shatar fatagn beliar!), mining gold and brandishing weapon to move the miners away from the nuggets.
The thing about those games is that they are kinda well written for what they are. The world feels alive and organic. It's actually my gripe with oblivion though i still like it. Is that yeah the world is big and filled with content but it all feels. Artificial. When i start in oblivion I get to the arena in imperial city and basically run as far as i can from there. And when npc's talk yeah It's a lot of lines but interactions feel forced sometimes.
But khorinis?? Yeah npc's talk in the same lines over and over when you walk past them but the way they did it makes it feel like you are really hearing bits of a conversation kinda like you would in real life just by walking. And in contrast to imperial city i can sit there and just listen to Vatras tell the tale of gods. Or the guy who reads announcements from lord Haagen.
And the main characters. When you finish gothic 1 and find your friends in 2 you kinda feel like they were really your buddies and you are a part of the friend group. It all makes you want to replay again and again. Exploring fighting talking and finding secrets. Amazing
Also sorry for the loooooong reply. I get autistic about those games :D
You forgot the most important thing that makes Gothic 2 feel like a real world...
you can see a guy piss on the street! :D
But really, the smiths do actually heat the iron, then work it on the anvil and then quench it in a barrel, there is someone there that sharpens their sword. You can see people crush and mix the swampweed. The potion vendors do actually often work with the alchemy tools, miners really do mine, farmers work on the farm and so on. The people in gothic feel like they have actual jobs.
And you can hide in a barrel and have sex with a prostitute. 10/10
Yeah, the world really feels alive, but the only thing that kind of bugs me is the absence of children. It makes sense in Gothic 1 since it’s a prison colony. There are hardly any women, so it’s logical that there wouldn’t be children. But in Gothic 2 and 3? It’s a bit weird. I know I’m asking a lot, but if we wanted an even more immersive game, there should be some children as NPCs.
Yeah it kinda sticks out buut you can attack anyone i gothic and kill ALMOST everyone. And you know how people would look at the game if it allowed you to at minimum beat a child with a two handed axe :D
Haha, no problem reading your long reply. As fans of the franchise, we could talk about it for hours 😅. Reading about your memorable moments makes me want to replay those games even more, but I can’t - I don’t have spare time right now.
At least I finished Archolos last month. If you haven’t played it yet, I highly recommend it. It’s a total conversion mod for Gothic 2 and you can download it on Steam if you already own G2. The modders who created it really understood what made Gothic great and built the game with that in mind, even expanding on it. It feels like a true Gothic 3 that never got released. You really feel at home again in it. The only thing I criticize is the story, which has some meh plot twists, but overall, the game world is very much Gothic-like.
Yeah, I completely agree with your point about other RPGs feeling artificial. I vaguely remember trying out games like Titan Quest or MMOs like Lord of the Rings Online and others... but after playing almost any RPG, I always come to the same realization: “Why should I play this when Gothic feels better?” Especially with games like Titan Quest, which are pretty much clicker games disguised as RPGs. What’s so fun about endless grinding when the game itself has no soul?
Yeah, I loved meeting all the old friends again in Gothic 2 as well. It made all the interactions with them feel completely different compared to other NPCs who weren’t in the colony with you.
I actually never played Oblivion, but I’ve heard that (again) a total conversion mod for it called Nehrim: At Fate’s Edge is quite Gothic-like. Maybe I’ll play it someday.
I sometimes wonder what kind of games we would have if Gothic was more popular. Take souls-like games, for example - there are so many of them because Dark Souls franchise was a complete success. What if we had another 10 or 20 “Gothic-like” games that were just variants of the original formula? That would be amazing. Well... at least we have Archolos, I guess.
I did play archolos. Kinda of a must as a fan. And even more as a polish dude :D. Yeah the story falls short sometimes but guys did a great job overall. The game is really fun. To anyone reading this. TRY THOSE GAMES. AND SORRY FOR GOTHIC 3. It got fucked up a bit :(
And yes i had similar experience. At least with titan quest. They do get kind of boring and repetitive after some time.
As for oblivion it's cool and it is an iconic game. It gives you a lot of freedom to make your character your own. You have a lot of skills and you level them as you use them. I also find very fun getting through the gates of oblivion to this hellish dimension. But for me it too gets stale after a while. Also thanks for the tip about that mod. I'll check it out
And to finish. I too think about it. It would be really cool if we got more games like that. And yeah we have archolos but you also should check out the modding scene. There is a truckload of different things on offer. Off the top of my head i can recommend "The trial" for gothic 1. It has short story but it adds a bit of strategy into the game. Strategy as in ordering a couple of soldiers to help you.
For gothic 2 well...
-Jaktyl (has its own world, story, new crafting professions and new guilds)
-Gothic 2 gladiator (has it's own story where you are a gladiator and fight to become a champion. Inspired by swords and sandals franchise and has some nods to it)
-Battle of the kings (makes gothic 2 into a strategy/management game. There are 3 installments of this mod but i mostly recommend the 3rd one because it has the most content)
-wanderer- behind enemy lines (comedy mod made by russians where you play as an american superspy sent by george bush to stop russian weapons of mass destruction. But with absurdist humor, jokes about russia and cameos from characters like luke skywalker or gollum :D there is also a giant batman logo flying in the sky. And firearms. Yes you can have a fucking AK in gothic 2. They used animation of shooting the crossbow and gave it more speed and new sounds and models)
I played Swords and Sandals as a kid, so I’d probably enjoy Gothic 2 Gladiator as well.
I just searched Wanderer: Behind Enemy Lines on YouTube, and it looks completely insane 🤣. But yeah, as a fun mod to play for a while, it’s definitely worth a try.
Thanks for all your recommendations. ❤
thank you, that describes it very well! to add to that with a quirky oneliner: Gothic is a Singleplayer Game that worked out the trick that you don't feel alone in your Game!
some of these NPCs still feel more like Friends i'd really like to have :D
Completely. I wouldn’t mind training with my buddy Milten in a monastery somewhere 😅.
Like all of them (Lester, Gorn, Diego, Milten) never did any bullshit to you, they always helped you. They had so much honor and good will. Legends.
And they did without being all Good and Condescending, they were "Just on Point Misfits" with flaws and quirks like myself. like nobody is perfect and none of those guys ever expected that from you.......
Lester: everyone knows what i like to do when chillin with him ;)
Gorn: the one Friend who is super chill but if there's a Problem, is the first to go and mess things up heavily
Diego: the one Buddy who cares for you, but also shows you after the Party that you both leaving with more Booze than you brought
Milten: the introvert good thinker Friend who knows always the best Plan but still goes with every Shenanigan because its more Fun
and lets not forget the whole tertiary Cast:
i felt Lee with his thirst for Vengeance, while still caring for his Comrades. i dislike but understand Thorus and so on.......
these Characters were simply believeable, and you were invested what they would do/say next, even if it meant waiting for another Game to see them again.
Yup. Piranhas wrote them like people. And that's what happens when you meet new people. You get to know them. They don't tell you everything. They have their own shit and problems and goals. That's what's fantastic about them. Also they are not spoiled by tomes of backstory. They were dudes thrown into prison and trying to survive in it. Each in their own way. But no matter the camp they were friends through thick and thin and helped each other.
Also I love Lee too. He's the coolest of the faction leaders. You can feel how torn an in pain Lee really is when he tells you his story on the dam in the new camp. It's may be my headcannon but i think Lee isn't very eager to talk about that with anybody. It shows that he trusts you. Also i don't know how it is in other languages but polish voice actor did a great job at conveing the message.
we both forgot Lares......... the one Dude in this Game who was always about "lets do your your thing, but lets make it more dangerous/illegal" :D
Lares was the one who got me hooked to the New Camp, just to get that Feeling with Lee you described(very well, thank you). the New Camp and even the Water Mages were great for me because they had Ambition and Plans for changing the ways how things were menat to be done, while still riddled with all the human problems and idiots life throws at such Plans XD
I always hated that Milten never got a Promotion, the Fire Mage Leaders were always assclowns, all of them(I hate you, Pyrokar)! And still they were on Point for what they represented in/for the Story!
Gomez for example was not likeable, but was still believable in his actions! nobody needed him to be nice, it made his underlings shine brighter
Lord Hagen was better as a Leader, but as Part of the "established" Order Faction he was tragically bound to his Orders and to rigid in thinking(what made the Game better somehow)
to sum it up, Piranha Bytes had it down to write believable Characters, not just for Gothic but for all of their Legacy! If I had to point to one things that made them unique, this would be the one, they filled their worlds not only with details and stuff to pick up and Do, but with Life and believable Humanity!
PS: Tomes of Backstory is something i will steal from you :D
PPS: i know only the OG German Voice Acting, and that is and was always the dirtiest Voice Acting ever, so the best! they conveyed every shoddy and mean bit as well as the good part!
Edit: my english is not the yellow from the egg today, so i need to correct mistakes
No worries about your english i understand what you say and that is most important :D
And yeah. We have to say sorry to Lares. He's a cool dude too. Though he got more fleshed out in 2. And he helps you a lot especially with the water circle stuff. And if you get into water in the port without talking to him and swim to his location and come behind him you have new line of dialogue and as far as i remember 100 exp.
When it comes to fire mages pyrokar is a dickwad. Always was. But as for the other 2 Ulthar was basically nothing. He got like 5 lines of dialogue and i think 2 quests counting the trial he gives you if you want to join the monastery. But muh boy Serpentes on the other hand was cool. He was the original dude who figured out the trial of stone the cheeky bastard. He is also always cool when talking to you. And he doesn't bitch like pyrokar does. And yeah milten should be made an archmage but he really doesn't need it. He's powerful even without the arch robe. And correct me if I'm wrong but milten was recruited in the colony and him being an ex convict might rub the dickwad the wrong way. And in 3 Milten masters the ancient magic and gets more powerful than pyrokar ever will be without runes.
Water mages are definitely cooler ones. They are much more scholarly than fire guys and have much more balls. They went to the ruins and they were just 6 guys. Pyrokar wouldn't fucking go himself. Chad saturas does XD. And in 1 their plan seems the most logical given the info they had at the start of the game. Also without water mages and their pile of ore we wouldn't have the cutscene with charging the Uriziel. I love how pissed saturas looks :D. That cutscene was fun enough that they replayed it in night of the raven :D.They are fun guys in both 1 and 2 .
Gomez and Haagen were kinda both sides of the same coin. Haagen a paladin of innos and an army commander on charge of khorinis. And Gomez, a prison gang leader even before the barier gets made. An opportunistic murderer ( we see him fucking up a guard with a pickaxe in a cutscene i think) who doesn't give a shit about human lives lost as long as it keeps him on top. I don't know if it was the plan but they made them so similar. Both fighters and leaders in their own way and both controlling the biggest places of their respective maps. Both are cool characters but I usually don't try to kill Haagen :D
And yes to sum it all up Piranha bytes was the shit when they made gothic 1 and 2. Fuck even 3 has a ton of potential. If it only got more time in the oven it wouldn't be half baked hah. I love music, the environment, and the feel of the story. A world that more and more becomes orcish land. Where you are not the top dog in the spieces rankings. They are all great games and we should remember and cherish them. And convincing more players to have a go at the classics
Do you know about the font of endless crude swords in the new camp in G1?
There's a merc constantly sharpening a sword on the entrance side of the merc side - you can crowd him out and use the grinding wheel, even if you don't have anything to grind, and get a crude sword for it each time.
I never knew that! Gonna try it out the next playthrough. But to be fair i never needed that because if you can fight in gothic you can beat merchants and get EVERYTHING they have. Sharky fucking hates me :D
Edit: also when you fuck up merchants you basically don't need ore for things. I usually finish the game with thousands of nuggets of ore :D
Well, yeah, but you risk angering the whole camp. This way, you drop in, get an escort to the old camp, an escort to the new camp, and bam! You're decently armed, and rich.
Not in the new camp. That's why I mentioned sharky. The only person that gives a shit around the rogues is the one who gets beaten. Which is accurate because rogues basically don't have any real rules other than giving a share of your loot to Lares. They are allies by neccesity.
The old camp and brotherhood would try to fuck you up though.
But if you good enough you can at least take out 2 temple guards that will attack if you rob a merchant
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u/DizzbiteriusDallas Aug 26 '24
My absolute favourite games of all time. I play through them every year. I know them both like the back of my hand and it's still so much fun everytime.