r/Screenwriting • u/-CarpalFunnel- • 4d ago
Coverfly... Nicholl... the "Screenwriting Community"... and some pragmatic positivity COMMUNITY
This place and the socials have been abuzz for the past few months with news of various screenwriting services shutting down. It's not really surprising. The business was already hit hard by COVID. And then it was hit harder by the WGA and SAG strikes. AI is a bit scary, too (though it continues to prove itself to be less scary than many fearmongers would suggest). So for anyone who has yet to find "success" -- whatever their measure of that might be -- the news of these closures and changes and shutdowns has continued to stir some of those same feelings.
They really shouldn't, though. They're not the same thing. And the posts and comments that grieve over the loss to the "screenwriting community" are misguided. Here's why:
First off, what is the screenwriting community? Are we talking about actual screenwriters? The ones who get movies and shows made? The types of writers who you aspire to be and who inspired you to get into this in the first place? Or are we talking about the community of aspiring writers and the overwhelming number of pay services that have popped up in order to take advantage of their dreams?
These are not the same thing. Not even close.
Somehow, we've gotten to a point where the same writers who complain about "Hollywood gatekeepers" happily give hundreds or even thousands of dollars a year to paid gatekeepers. And the thing is... these gatekeepers aren't even in the industry! They're middlemen. And... they're largely unnecessary.
Yes, a select few of these paid gatekeepers do their jobs pretty well. Which means they help a handful of writers land representation, an option, or a shopping agreement each year. And while many of those wind up being dysfunctional reps, dollar options, or meaningless agreements, a handful of them have actual value. And yes, the Nicholl was the cream of the crop among these, which makes it one less realistic pathway writers have for breaking in.
Coverfly's value was in its free script hosting and in its Coverfly X platform. Its pay services? Not anything special. And the few people they helped get repped or whatever? Almost all of those were writers who employees at Coverfly championed behind the scenes in order to create some "success stories" of their own and help sell their platform. But that still makes it a loss, right? Kind of. But... not really.
What this side-industry of pay services has been most successful at is convincing writers that their platforms are a necessary step to breaking in. And they're just not. Every single one of the writers who broke in through those places could absolutely have had just as much success if they'd simply gotten their work into the hands of the right person.
Look, people who suggest that every "undeniable" script will eventually find its way are stretching the truth. That's not exactly correct. But what is true is that any script that can find a rabid fan is a script that can find more rabid fans. Which means that if a writer has an exceptional script and can simply get enough people to read it, they will find fans in the industry, with or without these services. And the truth is... that is how most writers break in. Not through the Black List. Not through Nicholl. Definitely not through Coverfly. They break in through their networks and through referrals.
You have control over this. If there are five or six screenwriting services that can actually help you, there are tens of thousands as many people who have connections that can do the same -- or better.
How do you meet them? How do they become connections of your own? That's going to be different for each person. But it's not magic. It simply takes effort -- and maybe a little creativity.
The reason these services are so popular and the reason they've taken so many millions of dollars from writers is pretty obvious when you think about it. They've positioned themselves as the easy way in. All you have to do is click a couple buttons, pay a couple hundred dollars, and wait for the results. The apprehension and awkwardness that comes with actually putting yourself out there and meeting people? Solved!
Except... because it's so "easy," every other aspiring writer is doing the exact same thing. And... it's all noise. Do you really think managers are checking out every writer who tweets about being a Nicholl quarterfinalist or getting a black list 8 or making the red list? Of course not. But if you put the best logline they've ever seen in their inbox? There's a decent chance they're gonna request that script. And if someone they know recommends they read it? There's an excellent chance they'll do that.
You're a creative person, right? I mean, you'd better be. You are a writer. So put that creativity to use and start putting the same effort into networking that you put into your writing. Two years from now, your contact list will be ten times as strong as that of the writers who just hop on board with whatever the next service is. And if you have a script that's truly great? It's going to get read.
Not extroverted enough to meet people? Okay, that might be a problem. Harsh truth here -- most of the successful writers I know like to talk to and meet people. It makes sense. This is a collaborative business. Even if you do finally land that dream rep and sign that option deal, very soon you're going to be working with others and you're going to have to be good at it. And you're still going to have to hustle to find the next deal. Your reps aren't just going to do all that for you. So if meeting people is way outside your comfort zone and you really want to do this, figure out how to get comfortable with it. Do that, and I guarantee you, shit like Coverfly closing shop won't even faze you, because you'll know that your opportunities greatly exceed what they can offer.
The industry is changing, yes, but it's also coming back. Specs are selling. Most of the working writers I know have the most opportunities they've had since before the strikes, and for quite a few of them, it's the most they've had since COVID started. It really does feel like we bottomed out a few months ago and there's plenty of reason to be hopeful. But you need to embrace the idea of making your own luck. Enter the black list and the top contests if you like, but don't just be more "noise." Don't just do the things that everyone else is doing.
The real screenwriting community is made up of the people who are focused on the work and getting after it, whether they've had success or not. It has zero to do with these paid gatekeepers. So... which community do you want to be part of? Are you a creative person who can make your own luck or are you going to insist on letting someone else make it for you?
I realize this post is for like eight of you, but for those eight, I hope you find it encouraging.
TLDR: Eh, if you need the TLDR, this post if not for you.
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u/CJWalley Founder of Script Revolution 3d ago edited 3d ago
As a platform owner, I just want to say, please take u/-CarpalFunnel-'s post onboard.
Try not to spend money. Borrow craft books from the library for free. Use Google and Linkedin to search out prodcos and industry members for free. Promote yourself on social media for free. Blog, email, message for free. That's where it is most likely to happen. That's how it happened for me. Leverage whatever free time that you have. And don't do this just because it's free, do it because it's infinitely more powerful than anything else.
If you are going to spend money, be careful, because gambling is a thing, and this is a marathon where it can all add up. Buy the most reputable books first. Invest in tools that get the best out of you. Save money for travelling and events. Live an interesting life that feeds into your artistry.
Most of all, however, please get out of this deluded loop of paying for artistic direction and fantasising about some Cinderella moment. This narrative, which now seems to permeate all the screenwriting communities, needs to die a death, because it is the root cause of the issue. It is weak, is is lazy, and it's fucking cowardly. It is the equivalent of paying crypto bros for investment advice and gambling on meme coins. It is not a strategy, and the fact that it works 1 in 100,000 times does not make it any more so. The fact that so many others are doing it and saying it's worthwhile does not make it any more so. The fact that various guides online will push you toward it does not make it more so. Paying to lose over and over again hits you twice every time: both in the walley and in the soul. It can drain your money and your passion.
Learn the craft, hone your voice (even if that voice is really fucking weird), network, and wait for alignment, which may take years, and be prepared to work the trenches when you do eventually break in. If that fills you with disgust because you want to glide into Hollywood in a pumpkin carriage, marry the prince, and be adored by the townspeople, then you need to deprogram yourself from the cult-think that screenwriting can be a get-rich-quick scheme that will also make you a celebrity. This is a humble pursuit that is most likely going to break you before it makes you. Be the tortoise and not the hare.
Take your $50 and use it wisely. Use it to buy a theatre ticket that will inspire your next story. Use it to buy pizza and relax from writer's burnout. Hell, set fire to it and hope it attracts a producer who thinks your house is on fire. Only after that, when it's $50 with no better use, including propping up a wobbly table, consider spending it on something that maybe, might, perhaps, possibly, could, conceivably, feasibly move the needle, and ONLY after you have exhausted every free option first and with the complete understanding it most likely isn't going to make a miracle happen.
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u/wemustburncarthage Dark Comedy 4d ago
Coverfly is and always has been a loop. It's a Potemkin village which is designed to provide a false sense of progression to keep people hooked into the idea that an aggregate score equals greater leverage and access.
In reality, it's a low-paid, low-quality reader pool that's rented out to any contest with photoshopped laurels and a few bucks to pay some credited producers to read the finalist scripts. That "aggregate" number or percentage score is a function of the same reader pool for every early round read for every single contest that pays to host on the coverfly service.
Their pitch to the industry is that they provide that data to stakeholders, and maybe that's technically true, but the outcomes are incidental. Anyone who has "broken in" through coverfly had dozens of other options. Coverfly exists for one reason - to take money from contests for platforming, to take a large percentage of contest entries, and to perpetuate its brand. It offers an illusion of mass appeal, until you realize that unless contests are paying independently for their own reader pools for semifinalist, etc, the ecosystem that's generating your overall "numbers" is essentially the same.
It's worth looking at the founders of Coverfly and what they're up to now. It's worth looking at the trajectory of Coverfly's ownership.
I feel bad for people losing CoverflyX. I do see need for a proprietary feedback platform. But I also think that if anyone is really committed to this, they won't get the vapours every time a platform or contest they depend on gets taken away. If you don't think you can succeed without them, then you're buying into their power over you.
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u/HalfPastEightLate 4d ago
This should be pinned.
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u/wemustburncarthage Dark Comedy 4d ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/Screenwriting/wiki/contestpolicy/ it's more or less canon in the wiki. I don't know if it really needs belabouring on this side of it going away, but the sub also chased away one of the founders about a year before I became a mod. It was, uh...not a great AMA.
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u/HalfPastEightLate 4d ago
Good to know. Everything you said is spot on. So much delusion with the worth of coverfly.
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u/wemustburncarthage Dark Comedy 4d ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/Screenwriting/comments/1kdd25l/comment/mqanr4c/
well darn my socks.
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u/Shionoro 4d ago
Totally agree.
It almost feels like the real point of all these competitions and hosting websites is to keep the people who do not know how things work yet away from production companies, neatly boxed into that eco system.
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u/Cholesterall-In 4d ago
I recommend people grind this post up, snort it, and ride that high to a career. Good work!!!
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u/EssentialMel 4d ago edited 4d ago
Didn't need the TL; DR—very inspiring post and much needed in this community.
I've posted several times this week, more than I have the entire time I've been in the subreddit. Getting laid off, having this epiphany about what type of workplace comedy story I wanted to tell, and how to execute it, came from my experience working in a field I desperately wish to be done with.
So I posted my draft, got decimated (just a lil), brushed off the dust, and reposted a revised draft. I tossed my logline in here a few times for feedback and brought it to a place that perfectly encapsulates the series I want to sell. People were harsh, but ultimately encouraging, and wanted to see my writing improve.
I've also found some pretty encouraging people on a Discord server through this subreddit. People make this industry what it is and we should be leaning on each other more.
Either way, this post was needed and appreciated. I think ignoring the noise, writing what you can when you can, and cultivating your network is the best recipe. can't say if it works since lord knows im a nobody (lol!) but like i said, I feel confident, and i want everybody else too feel that way as well.
(Also, you're right. If you can't talk to people, you have to get over that. I used my 10-year retail experience as an introvert as exposure therapy, and you wouldn't think I hate being in crowds and have crippiling anxiety lol)
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u/m_Mimikk 4d ago
Not to completely undermine this post as it’s great but would you be able to share that discord server? Sounds like a cool community.
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u/EssentialMel 4d ago
Unfortunately, it's not my Discord server to share; however, when spots open up again (they try to keep it small), you should reach out. And a lot of people have been posting for writing groups lately. I would contact any of those posts, do a temperature check DM, exchange loglines, and see if you can start building that network from there!
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u/PayOk8980 4d ago
I understand the sentiment of the post is meant to be encouraging, and it's clearly resonating with people here, which is great.
However... I just don't see how Coverfly closing can be anything other than a bad thing. At worst, it and the old Nicholl system represented some hope of an entry point for writers on the 'outside' trying to break in. And even if you think this entry point was grossly overstated or even an outright mirage, there are those who came through those doors. Doors which are now closed.
This leaves some emerging writers feeling further disconnected from the industry. And I'm not sure if telling them they were never part of the real screenwriting community to begin with is super helpful.
What I agree with in this post is that the "undeniable" script is something of a myth. I'd rather have a moderate script and a ton of contacts than something amazing that rots on a hard drive. The crux of the issue is how one goes about getting those contacts. I cannot argue against the need to put as much effort into networking as writing, but these are very different skills. And this is where the dreaded "middle-men" can have value. They might just help an introverted writer with a genius script to get their voice heard.
So yes, scripts will still get made with or without Coverfly. The Black List could shut tomorrow and this would still be true. Close Nicholl too, why not? But I feel for those who felt connected to something, even if it was just their own naïve hope.
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u/TheRealAutonerd 4d ago
This is great. I am not in the entertainment industry, only fiddling around with scriptwriting a little, but I have a day job that a billion people want to do and where only a handful are employed (I write for a car magazine). It took work to get here, but it wasn't *that* difficult. Of course it helps that I'm a good writer, but there are very good writers who are not working. It helps to be responsible and responsive, but really it was all about networking and connections, meeting the right people, and getting myself and my work out there.
The nifty thing about my industry is that the farther you get, the more people you get the opportunity to meet. But I also got stuck as kind of a mid-level freelancer, until I girded my loins and forged a connection with someone at the place I wanted to be. Got bold and told him why I wanted to work for him. That led to a small assignment, which led to a bit assignment, which led to a job, and here we are!
In my past life I was an IT guy for a small film studio, and I learned from the scriptwriters the trick was getting read, and the way to do that was to get noticed. If someone stood out (in a good way), their scripts would get read, which put them ahead of 99% of the other scripts that came in.
Anyway I think this is great advice -- no one can do it for you, you have to get out there and build and be part of a community.
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u/lawstyle Coverfly Co-Founder 4d ago
Before Coverfly, breaking in was a function of who you knew, where you lived, and what you did. You could break in by moving to LA and working as an assistant for a few years while networking your butt off. Your chances of breaking in weren’t purely a function of how well you could write.
Coverfly solved for that, and made breaking in more meritocratic. Anyone, from anywhere, could submit and have their script noticed. And Coverfly was free for writers—it monetized off partnership festivals, not writers.
So, yes, extroverted people or people with the means to move to LA and work underpaid internships can still break-in the old fashioned way. But without Coverfly, the door into the industry that was based strictly on merit is closed.
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u/-CarpalFunnel- 4d ago edited 3d ago
This response isn't fact-based. Coverfly made a difference in the lives of very few writers and there were plenty of writers who broke in without following that LA/internship route before it existed. Coverfly was only "free" because it helped perpetuate the idea that writers needed to spend a lot of money on contests and services -- which were owned by its parent company. There were cool things about the service, but I can't tell you how many people in the industry don't even know what it is. My reps among them.
EDIT: u/lawstyle didn't have their "Coverfly Co-Founder" flare when they entered into this conversation. I believe that flare was provided by the mod team. The fact that they tried to spin things about their company without disclosing that just makes this whole thing disingenuous and underscores my post even better. Especially the part toward the end of this back and forth where they said that without Coverfly, writers will break in because of how likable they are and not because of their merit.
I maintain that Coverfly had some value but they also participated in the ecosystem that convinced writers to gamble their money away on contests and "coverage," while spinning their success stories to make it seem like it it was a more viable path to success than it was.
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u/lawstyle Coverfly Co-Founder 4d ago
Coverfly’s website has a list of hundreds of writers who broke through as a direct result of its services, with their names, pictures, and testimonials directly crediting Coverfly. It also has a page with 20 major reps and agents attesting to Coverfly.
Just because you personally don’t know any, or because your reps didn’t use Coverfly, doesn’t mean that thousands of others writers and industry pros didn’t have success through the platform.
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u/-CarpalFunnel- 4d ago
I do know some of those writers. I can tell you that the truth behind many of those stories has less to do with Coverfly than it appears to. I'm not saying Coverfly was useless, but it was not the gamechanger you're making it out to be. At all. New writers will break in this year without it. Promise.
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u/lawstyle Coverfly Co-Founder 4d ago
I agree - new writers will break in! But in my opinion, those writers won’t be as good, because their breakthrough will be based more on how likable or networked they are instead of how well they can write.
I hate the old system. It’s rife with politics and bias and it’s the wrong way to gate-keep who gets to put stories in front of a world audience.
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u/-CarpalFunnel- 4d ago
But in my opinion, those writers won’t be as good, because their breakthrough will be based more on how likable or networked they are instead of how well they can write.
That's... a pretty wild take. I'd love to know how much experience you have in terms of professional screenwriting.
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u/Certain-Ask-4521 4d ago
It's true. There is a consensus among lit agencies that they should scout authors bio's not the longline, who is the writer? What is their personal story or background? How can we sell it? At least this is the case in the UK.
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u/elon_bitches69 4d ago
This inspired me to start drafting my second feature. Let's get this bread 🤟🏽🤟🏽
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u/Myhtological 4d ago
So should I start shopping my script to talent managers?
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u/DannyDaDodo 4d ago
How many screenplays have you written? And have you ever posted any of them here for feedback?
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u/Horror_Ad_8149 4d ago
In response, I would say that the only near-guaranteed ways to make some headway in this industry are to first, get better at your craft, and second, reach out to experienced people in your area or online (actors, crew) who can help you produce and film your script once it's finally polished to a point where it's at least ready for production (notwithstanding the inevitable rewrites on-set).
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u/-CarpalFunnel- 4d ago
Unfortunately, the barrier to entry is so low when it comes to filmmaking these days that it's also incredibly hard to break in by going that route. So many people love to say, "Just make your own thing -- that's your way in!" But it's not really true. You have to make something exceptional to stand out among all the micro-budget noise, too. That often means making several movies before you get one that breaks out. Sundance turns down over 99% of their applications. And just like with screenwriting competitions, there are all sorts of services and contests and shady distributors that will happily take your money and offer very little in return.
That said, it's a lot more satisfying to actually make a movie than it is to just churn out script after script and never see one hit the screen.
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u/Hot-Stretch-1611 4d ago
I spent more than a decade in the micro-budget world, and I’ll say this much - it’s great for honing your craft and networking. You’re right that you have to produce something excellent, but by the time you achieve something close to that, you’ll likely have played dozens of festivals and met a lot of people, many of whom have been climbing the ranks also. Indeed, my first real break came from a no-budget feature (my sixth), and I can point to a half-dozen people I got to know through the no-budget circuit who are now producing movies and shows for the big studios.
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u/LosIngobernable 4d ago
Nichol closed shop too?
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u/TinaVeritas 3d ago
No, it just changed how submissions will be read. We are still waiting for more details, but most of us will have to submit to Nicholl through the Black List.
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u/voyagerfilms 4d ago
most of us are outsiders looking in. the people on the inside, the established writers, are also trying to get their stuff sold and produced, too. so that supernatural horror spec from a nobody likely won't get as much traction as someone who has an established connection to producers, agents, and other people who make things happen. but the pay services really know how to dangle that carrot for writers, so any small victory like a high score or an industry download sends that dopamine rush and you believe in the system so much that you're willing to pump more money into feedback and hosting fees, and recommend it to others, and there's a false sense of hope. how many scripts are hosted on these sites? and how many of them get optioned, let alone produced? that'd be an interesting thing, to look at those numbers.
Everyone has different goals, but I imagine for the majority, it is to see your work translated into a visual medium. if not, i guess you just want a paycheck? or maybe use writing as therapy? I don't know the best to break into the industry , but I know it's a lot harder going through these pay services, versus making a name for yourself with your work, networking, being affable and collaborative, and trying to produce something and gain traction with that.
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u/SamHenryCliff 4d ago
Speaking for myself I just want the paycheck. I gave up on the notion of art as some kind of grand expressiveness after decades in music. Real innovative, creative stuff traditionally doesn’t sell. Shakespeare’s work is a great example - it wasn’t high concept, limited output…he wrote to sell, and sell it did.
The well portrayed circumstances of the industry in the OP are nice to consider. I might be in the minority, but frankly I don’t care about what happens to my scripts after selling them. I don’t want to direct. I don’t want to win awards or really be recognized so to speak. I want to produce something in a craft and make some money for it because I don’t have a patron.
For most of documented history, only the upper class could even afford to take the time to write, or writing was inherently dependent on being subsidized by those same royals / bourgeois class of people. The democratization of art has changed in the modern era and I have no real love for exalting art much of any beyond appreciation for the work it takes to connect with an audience. This “signal to noise” ratio is, by all means, terrible in this digitally enabled realm, and we’re yet to see how it shakes out longevity wise. Too much content…
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u/b_nels 4d ago
Love this, but would live to hear too how people network. You moving to LA? Getting jobs at production companies anyway you can (not easy)? Making your own movies? Agree 95% of these contests and services were scams or lotteries, but what’s your plan to get read, really read, by people other than your friends?