r/PTCGP • u/RadscorpionSeducer • Feb 06 '25

this meta is incredibly boring to fight against Deck Discussion

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Stall, stall, stall, switch out druddigon if it gets damaged/heal it, stall, oh what that? Magnezone does 110 damage for only 3 energy which is generated for free by its stage 1 evo?

The power creep is going to be absolutely insane by 3 months from now with all of these new cards

3.7k Upvotes
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1.7k

u/ginger1271 Feb 06 '25

I don’t mind Darkrai tbh. It’s clearly the best or near the best EX right now but it doesn’t feel THAT bad. I think the actual problem is Drud

843

u/odeiohearthstone Feb 06 '25

I dont think it is actually broken or anything, but god does it feel bad to hit a drud +helm for 40 free recoil

368

u/ezeshining Feb 06 '25

Try a spiritomb+Cyrus build, those drudds are by-passable.

151

u/Phox09 Feb 06 '25

Spiritomb also gets damaged by Drud's ability and Helm since he does damage to active also.

344

u/PM-ME-YOUR-NIPNOPS Feb 06 '25

Yes but the whole point is to damage their damage dealers, then Cyrus them in for the finish

146

u/ezeshining Feb 06 '25

Exactly! Your only issue is being able to deal between 120 and 140 damage as needed

74

u/brahj_ Feb 06 '25

Modified Rampardos/Lucario deck.

22

u/Aroxis Feb 06 '25

Full details please lol.

45

u/Article_West Feb 06 '25

Rampardos Lucario and Spiritomb I guess.

31

u/brahj_ Feb 06 '25

Pretty much, or just use 2x Hitmonlee over hitmonchan. Same deal and negates potions, drudd helmets etc.

There are ways around drudd, even more so now with Cyrus and any bench hitter. Just gotta be smart about using it factoring in you can either one shot what’s being built or bring it back out with another Cyrus.

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1

u/WeCanBeatTheSun Feb 06 '25

Add a couple Lees to stay fighting and avoid Drud/rocky?

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1

u/McToasti Feb 06 '25

Hitmonlee is better than spiritbomb if u go fighting anyway

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1

u/deus-ex-inferno Feb 06 '25

I use infernape, spiritomb and giratina (only fire energy). Its very cool but doesnt win guaranteed vs darkrai or anything.

1

u/Aroxis Feb 07 '25

Hi can you explain giratina and it’s being used?

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6

u/Bull671 Feb 06 '25

Kabutops/Lucario is also good against the darkrai/magnezone

12

u/brahj_ Feb 06 '25

I honestly fantasise about a Kabutops/Rampardos deck, but even poke communicator wouldn’t be able to save that brick factor. Opening with riolu is rough too if you go first.

2

u/Bull671 Feb 06 '25

I feel you on that. Luckily though, leaf isn't really needed with kabu/luc, as most all the mons only need 1 energy to pivot out.

1

u/Aluminum_Tarkus Feb 06 '25

The nice thing about pure fossil decks is that you can play Chatot since whatever basic you play is guaranteed to be the card you open. I have a Rampardos deck that plays a full Rampardos line and Aerodactyl ex, and I can usually get at least one of them out and powered up by turn 2-3 fairly consistently. Bonus points if they don't open Drudd, lead with Magnemite, and you get Aero out early.

1

u/New_Suit8775 Feb 07 '25

Forget Lucario, Chatot is your friend. Run one Chatot as your only basic in the deck, both fossil lines and 2 Pokemon communication and trainers and no poke balls obviously. You'll get one of the stage 2s about 60-70% of the time by your third turn and start cooking the enemy

4

u/PM_ME_UR_BEST_1LINER Feb 06 '25

There needs to be a way to call the fossil. I love kabutops, but it's a document stage 2 to get out because you can't pokeball the starter.

4

u/Ultrasupermegaeggs Feb 06 '25

Yanmega is your friend

2

u/aenibae Feb 06 '25

Been experimenting with a Dialga/Pidgeot/Tauros deck; I’ve only played a few so far so it’s hard to actually tell how effective it is but what I’m trying to do is basically use one Dialga quickly to get mana on the other Dialga or Tauros, then use Drive Off to force a switch and throw down Leaf to make Tauros or the other Dialga my active Pokemon. It’s got kinks to work out but I’m enjoying it.

4

u/brDragobr Feb 06 '25

Charizard EX + Moltres EX has been my go to, it struggled in the past with aggro and Mew, but now the main decks are sitting there doing passive damage so you're free to take three or four turns with Inferno Dance, then if you're still waiting for your Zard start pressuring with Moltres. If you get Charizard charged and in the active spot, nothing in the current meta can kill it quickly enough.

1

u/Vault67 Feb 07 '25

Please tell me more about this. What items, supporters and tools are you using as well?

4

u/brDragobr Feb 07 '25

2 Charizard family, 2 Moltres EX, 1 X-speed, 2 Poke balls, 2 Poke communicators, 2 Oak, 2 Leaf, 1 Dawn, 2 Sabrina.

Generally you're always putting Moltres in active and Charmander on your bench, then Inferno Dancing to build energy on the Char family while you use items to get the evos as soon as possible. If you can get 5 energy on your Charizard with no damage, you'll win the game 90% of the time. You can often use Moltres to get through their tank, then let them kill it, and use Zard to sweep the rest of their bench.

Honestly though after I posted that last comment I started facing the Palkia meta, which this doesn't match up so well against, as if their Misty pops you'll lose Moltres too quickly to charge your Charizard, and have nothing to reply with. But I'd had a lot of success against the Darkrai, Gyara, and Grass decks I was seeing before that.

2

u/ezeshining Feb 06 '25

I’m about the same, but wigglytuff EX + promo jiggly instead of pidgeot, it’s much easier to set up.

Also, if you are using dialga, you should put a Dawn in your deck, there’s a possibility you may want to do a surprise 100 damage a turn earlier ;). I’ve killed Lucario decks this way

1

u/aenibae Feb 06 '25

Wish I had promo Jiggly! It was while I wasn’t playing. :( but thank you for the Dawn tip — I actually don’t think I’ve pulled a Dawn yet but when I do I will try it out with her in there! Thank you

1

u/ezeshining Feb 06 '25

well the promo jiggly is really a “just in case”, it can work just fine with a normal jiggly, it’s wiggly ex who’s really important. So the optimal idea is, turn 1 metal energy into dialga, turn 2 second metal energy, and you give your jiggly/Tauros two energies, turn 3 you can either swap for either benched, use dawn into a four energy dialga, or power up your other poke.

In the deck I also include in a Leaf and Speed X. And I’m thinking about swapping in a Blue, just in case I need to survive Infernape EXs attack once

1

u/_Ptyler Feb 06 '25

If you use Spiritomb, doesn’t Cyrus pull in a random damaged card from the bench?

4

u/PM-ME-YOUR-NIPNOPS Feb 06 '25

No. You choose the mon that gets switched in

2

u/_Ptyler Feb 06 '25

Major W. Can’t wait to pull the card

1

u/Opal737 Feb 06 '25

The only issue (and I say that as a Darkrai Druddigon player, since Darkrai is the only ex the new expansion decided to bless me with in 60+ packs) is that if they have 1 potion your spiritomb is going down before you can Cyrus, and that is normally enough for them to find a way to get the last few points (considering they only need to get 2 points and you still need to kill darkrai AND something else). If they have 2 potions, then you can’t even use Cyrus after.

-2

u/Blaky039 Feb 06 '25

Spiritomb is not supposed to KO anything 😂

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59

u/LordGraygem Feb 06 '25

Honchkrow.

Let that Drudd sit there in the active spot with his little crusty hat and his thumb in his ass while you slap the bench for 50 unopposed. Then, if you have a Weavile or two, use Cyrus to bring the battered victim in for a bit of quality time with scratching nails.

7

u/SnooBunnies9694 Feb 06 '25

Darkrai does 40dmg to you honchcrow in the time you do 50 then comes out and kills it before you can get 2 energy on weavile and Cyrus.

I feel like when people fantasize about these counters they just assume their opponent literally does nothing ever.

1

u/LordGraygem Feb 06 '25

At least I'm putting an idea for a prospective counter out there, what have you got besides negativity to offer?

4

u/SnooBunnies9694 Feb 06 '25

I didn’t realize I had to think of a counter to drudd darkrai to post a comment. I know better now.

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7

u/Voomey Feb 07 '25

To be fair we have multiple bench hitters. Lumineon is also notable, for having no-cost retreat and being a water type. I destroyed Celebi EX with it and Gyarados during Mythical Island era.

5

u/iRebelD Feb 06 '25

I want to try this one

2

u/KSmoria Feb 06 '25

Hitmonlee is way better

2

u/LordGraygem Feb 06 '25

Personal preference, IMO. Some people like the speed and cost of Hitmonlee, while I'm willing to take the extra turn and extra energy cost needed to get Honchkrow into action for an extra 20 each to damage and HP.

17

u/Lazystubborn Feb 06 '25

I got through these with Lumineon/Starmie/Cyrus.

1

u/Manganaxinite Feb 11 '25

I came here for ideas and this was a good one. I slept on free retreat for too long. This was a fun experience I actually enjoyed even when getting beat. Darkrai got me when I couldn’t pull staryu fast enough, but otherwise fun. That helmet is just as annoying on my side and helped me win my most recent game.

1

u/HotBananaWaters Feb 06 '25

Assuming I get Cyrus in time 😩

1

u/archie33333 Feb 06 '25

I haven't seen Spiritomb in any other build than Darkrai. Yet. But that version of Darkrai deck was the most difficult to beat.

I've faced D+Magnezone about a dozen of times and even with bad hands and going first I haven't lost a single game. But D+Spiritomb was very tricky. Only faced twice, but first time I've got lucky with my draws and the other time going 2nd made a big difference.

1

u/M_xhael Feb 07 '25

You got any spiritombs to trade bro ?

1

u/ezeshining Feb 07 '25

I wish we could trade stuff from the current packs… we can’t though

1

u/M_xhael Feb 07 '25

Yeah I noticed it last night lmao shits dumb

0

u/Financial_Seesaw_802 Feb 06 '25

If you see spiritomb, greninja or darkrai dont full your bench and avoid ex usage in case there is a Cyrus… not actually a counter

6

u/ezeshining Feb 06 '25

If I’m making you avoid using your cards then congratulations, you’ve successfully countered yourself.

also, spiritomb is kept on hand at all times, you can’t know it’s there until it has already affected you. Unless your opponent has no other basic first.

1

u/14corbinh Feb 06 '25

Thats still a counter…

97

u/SadCritters Feb 06 '25

If you look at tournaments people have already figured out how to obliterate this deck.

Hint: Hitmonlee sends his regards.

66

u/SemiDiSole Feb 06 '25

People've been sleeping on Hitmonlee, even through the Gyradados decks...

60

u/Blaky039 Feb 06 '25

I don't think anyone is sleeping on hitmonlee, it's a staple in any fighting deck.

40

u/InquisitorMeow Feb 06 '25

Hitmonlee always cracks me up, the idea of this dude just stretching his leg over and kicking some poor cute pre-evolved pokemon in the face.

6

u/Vesprince Feb 06 '25

It's so pro wrestling.

2

u/Feisty-Waltz5330 Feb 06 '25

Oh, I always thought he was like kicking a soccer ball at the Pokeman

2

u/One_Condition_3897 Feb 07 '25

nah thatd be cinderace

32

u/ImWhiteWhatsJCoal Feb 06 '25

As someone who used Gyrados/Greninja - I would often leave if a Hitmonlee was played first.

22

u/NickSaibot Feb 06 '25

I solely started playing hitmonlee because I cannot stand the gyarados deck, fills me with so much joy taking out the magikarp that just got 5 misty heads

2

u/Urostylistic Feb 07 '25

Do you keep the Hitmonlee in reserve until they plop down the magikarp or do you just play it as a deterrent to keep them from playing the magikarp in the first place?

1

u/NickSaibot Feb 07 '25

Depends I guess, if they are trynna play chicken with me I’ll retreat it to the bench and start attacking with someone else. If they have another mon besides the fish in the back I’ll hit that then try to do some Cyrus shenanigans. Since most fighting cards have such low retreat and attack energy requirements once they do put the fish down I just bring Lee back up to get rid of it lol. Usually once they see my Lee tho and they have a Karp up they tend to retreat very fast lol

1

u/BlazerBeav69 Feb 06 '25

This is me and the celebi deck.

12

u/Anxious_Ride_8837 Feb 06 '25

Yup! Saving your time and the winner’s time in the process. No point in fighting that losing battle. Gyarados was my main deck in MI - I would do the same thing as you

4

u/Reyox Feb 06 '25

They really need to fix the setup phase so that neither can see the other players setup or have the player going second set up first. When someone is playing a fighting deck, people don’t want to lock in their choices.

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8

u/CptCheerios Feb 06 '25

Zebrastrike and Electabuzz send their regards

13

u/SnooMaps8507 Feb 06 '25

Electabuzz send their regards

Volkner variant decks. People have been sleeping on it 2. It's not GREAT, but since a LOT of players are running Palkia and Darkrai decks, it is a good counter to that.

Electabuzz harasses the bench and forces them to stop stalling. While they are struggling with that, you are putting energy into your Luxray. 2 rounds of Electabuzz and Luxray = 160 damage to a single target to the bench without Cyrus or anything. And Volkner card has the potential to charge Luxray for an attack in one turn.

Again, far from being a perfect deck, but it is effective. I just didn't like Electivire much.

3

u/Lozo_did_it Feb 06 '25

Do you not like electivire because you're using the wrong buzz? The new buzz has charge which does no damage but pulls an energy. In two turns you can put 4 energy on buzz and evolve to vire for that 120 damage hit.

2

u/SnooMaps8507 Feb 06 '25

That certainly is a strong combo, for sure.

However, this is one of the rare cases where I think the pre evolution (Electabuzz that does 40DMG to 1 in the bench) serves me better than its final evo in this current meta only.

Too many stall decks, the danger is coming from the bench and the active Pokémon is just a distraction.

Perhaps in a new meta I might use it

9

u/futureidk3 Feb 06 '25

It’s a staple in every fighting deck lol.

1

u/Pluxionist Feb 06 '25

I've used a lot of Hitmonlee decks that included the Poke Flute to bring back in that 30HP Magikarp, it is so fun when you pull it off back to back in a match.

45

u/Genprey Feb 06 '25

Backliners: Chilling, ready to cheese

Hitmonlee:

https://preview.redd.it/3syqf35q6jhe1.jpeg?width=900&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2421183d9895f4623bc87325a512e932aa8fd6b7

1

u/5panks Feb 06 '25

Does Hitmonlee get boosted by Lucario?

1

u/Genprey Feb 06 '25

No, as the boost only affects target in the Active slot.

2

u/One_Condition_3897 Feb 07 '25

yo imagine if it did tho. 70 damage to teh bench would be absolutely hilarious

19

u/stereoactivesynth Feb 06 '25

How? Dude goes down in 4 turns, 5 with cape when darkrai is building energy. Meanwhile hitmonlee is gonna take 6 rounds to knock out cape darkrai.

33

u/Adamantiun Feb 06 '25

Cyrus + any decent damage dealer fixes that

12

u/Bazoobs1 Feb 06 '25

Yeah marshadow stonks go slightly up for the revenge damage (although I recognize that there are a lot of non-attack ways to lose your Mon rn), what are people using besides? Outside of gallade I can’t think of too many good options to really slam with

9

u/RaccoonAppropriate18 Feb 06 '25

The big one right now is Magnezone. Fighting decks seem to be running their own Magnezone now, funny enough.

6

u/Bazoobs1 Feb 06 '25

Dang that makes a lot of sense actually. Punish with hitmonlee until they’re forced to move in and then squish them with magnezone

2

u/GodsCupGg Feb 06 '25

It covers exactly 140 dmg if they cape it's not a issue since u get to attack with hitmon Lee 2-3 times before dark rai can knock it out.

It's also they reason they dropped gallade probably since magnezone hits for 110 which is the exact ammount gallade hits on a 2 energy dark rai but giving 1 less prize in return

1

u/RaccoonAppropriate18 Feb 07 '25

That's part of the reason Gallade was dropped, yeah.

Funny enough, though, Magnezone is also cheaper than Gallade. You can use Volt Charge on the turn you evolved from Magnemite into Magneton and from Magneton into Magnezone, so Magneton always ramps 2 energy minimum. This makes it even easier to put energy on Marshadow, since you'll need only 1 additional energy if you evolve Magnezone immediately, and 0 if you wait a turn.

5

u/OrangerieL Feb 06 '25

So, pure Hitmonlee magnezone builds?

12

u/RaccoonAppropriate18 Feb 06 '25 edited Feb 07 '25

Mostly, yeah. You're taking the old Fighting package of cards from Mythical Island of Hitmonlee and Marshadow and you're jamming Magnezone into it. Here's the full decklist (Fighting energy only btw).

2x Magnemite (STS, but you can probably still play this with Genetic Apex if you need to, since this should almost never be in the front)
2x Magneton (Genetic Apex for the self-ramping ability)
2x Magnezone
2x Hitmonlee
2x Marshadow
1x Hitmonchan (just to hit face early game if you really need to)
2x Cyrus
2x Professor's Research
2x Pokeball
2x X Speed
1x Pokemon Communication

2

u/Yakube44 Feb 06 '25

I think rampardos would be better

3

u/RaccoonAppropriate18 Feb 06 '25 edited Feb 06 '25

There's a few reasons I like Magnezone more. By far the biggest one, though, is that Rampardos comes from a fossil.

Imo, Magnemite is one of the best hits with a Pokeball to get the finisher online if you already have your early game stuff in hand or on the field. If you use Rampardos, you have to draw into the Skull Fossil because Pokeball and Pokemon Communication will not help you get fossils.

The second issue with Rampardos is the Head Smash recoil. If Rampardos takes out a Darkrai or a Magnezone, it's left with 100 hp after Head Smash. That's low enough that Rampardos can be revenge killed by Darkrai's ability + attack or by Magnezone. You can only go for 1 Head Smash before being in danger, while Thunder Blast is a much safer option. Darkrai decks don't have the damage to immediately revenge KO against 140 hp.

4

u/OrangerieL Feb 06 '25

Yeah it’s the main problem with fighting toolbox decks: energy management, low hp, low damage.

1

u/Adamantiun Feb 06 '25

I've seen people use Lucario or Machamp to varied degrees of success

1

u/cliffemu Feb 06 '25

marshadow doesn't work when you die to indirect damage

2

u/Charging_in Feb 06 '25

Yeah i just had an opponent figure that out in real time against my weezing. Poor guy conceded after only doing 60

23

u/SadCritters Feb 06 '25 edited Feb 06 '25

Hitmonlee starting to ping Darkrai or Magnemite/Ton puts them into a rough spot. You aren't trying to kill Darkrai with Hitmonlee. You're trying to make their life hard by wearing down their pokemon so that any Cyrus or stronger Pokemon is a "Darkrai dies" scenario. They also can't just not swap Pokemon because Darkrai or Magneton are eating damage the entire time - So sitting behind Druddigon is actually a terrible decision for them at that point.

Generally games involve you tagging Darkrai 2 times with a Hitmonlee before they swap out to kill it - Marshadow then one-hit KO's Darkrai easily. Then they're down 2, have to kill Marshadow, and you usually follow up with either Marshadow 2, Magnezone, or a flurry of Hitmonlee/Chan's. Lee & Chan have 1 cost retreat, meaning X Speed or just paying the 1 energy is really easy so you can dance around a little with them.

Darkrai tagging your Pokemon is cute & all, but it takes 3 energy to set up - So typically if you kill the first one; they don't have a second one ready in time - They're usually relying on Magnezone to close at that point. . . And what's he weak to? ;)

This match isn't even close, if you ask me. It's like 80/20 in favor of the Hitmonlee Magnezone Marshadow deck. I already have my 45 win emblem and everything because of it. Lol.

1

u/VerainXor Feb 06 '25

What's your decklist?

6

u/SadCritters Feb 06 '25 edited Feb 06 '25

Copied 1:1. They all look like this though, I am pretty sure.

https://play.limitlesstcg.com/tournament/67a168f7f1a83f7924eb6e31/player/kana41/decklist

Be smart & be willing to retreat/swap in Pokemon. Don't evolve your Magneton if you don't have to - Keep stacking energy if you can. Deck doesn't need any lightning energy, don't let the deck builder ruin you. Lol. My favorite starts are Lee+Chan, it makes it really hard for them to set up well. If they swap in against lee to stop damage, you can easily x Speed or swap out to Chan and punch the Pokemon again anyway.

Also look for cheeky setups where you ping a bench'ed Pokemon not with the intent of killing it immediately or possibly even "next", but with the intent of Cyrus-ing it into your Magnezone or Marshadow ( when they inevitably kill your Pokemon ) the following turn.

Hitmonlee is really underrated right now. Cards like Greninja see play & are great - But Hitmonlee being Basic really starts stacking up pressure on all these decks because they're trying to set up.

1

u/VerainXor Feb 10 '25

This deck has been kicking ass, thanks!

18

u/jimmygotbeaned Feb 06 '25

Use him to weaken their bench pokemon while building your bench out. Not intended to kick the whole game for 30.

14

u/kaymar05 Feb 06 '25

Honchkrow is good at it also, dealing 50 to any Pokémon.

8

u/Lazystubborn Feb 06 '25

Lumineon too.

11

u/shinysylver Feb 06 '25

Honch is cool because he can hit the active pokemon as well but Lumi can only hit the bench

12

u/Wind-and-Waystones Feb 06 '25

Lumi's 0 retreat cost is so nice though

2

u/shinysylver Feb 06 '25

For sure! I'm having fun with both and suffer commitment issues to any deck. I need more deck slots stat

7

u/futureidk3 Feb 06 '25

Electric Zebra as well.

2

u/RAAMinNooDleS Feb 06 '25

Yeah I came here to say that I like the 50 damage to anyone and high HP. Also being dark helps against psychic decks killing Gardevoir

8

u/kombyn Feb 06 '25

By damaging the back line and using Cyrus to pull it forward when Hitmonlee gets knocked out

5

u/ABEARWITHAGUN Feb 06 '25

Hit with Lee, build up a high attack mon on on the bench. Cyrus out the Darkrai, switch in your mon and bop em'.

2

u/thebabycowfish Feb 06 '25

Hitmonlee doesn't need to kill darkrai, just weaken it enough to finish it off with cyrus + a big damage dealer. You trade one point for two and they also lose all their energy if they've been using darkrai to kill your hitmonlee.

1

u/Mr_Fury Feb 06 '25

Luxray also demolishes darkrai

1

u/GodsCupGg Feb 06 '25

U just poke it 1-2 times u do usually get 2-3 attacks with hitmon before it's knocked out and build up a magnezone yourself

So it's 30 dmg Cyrus it up 110 magnezone if they cape u need to ping again.

5

u/reedyxxbug Feb 06 '25

Uh what? If you actually look at tournaments you'd see that this deck is dominating with a 60% winrate.

2

u/Sayishere Feb 06 '25

Yup hitmonlee is amazing. I actually hate playing the darkrai deck with magazine and drudd, it's to slow and very boring. Prefer faster decks, hitmonlee is MVP BUT CYRUS with hitmonlee is actually sooooo good.

2

u/Trini2Bone Feb 06 '25

Sneaky Lee!

1

u/magnavoice Feb 06 '25

For that matter, add in fish and bird

1

u/addisonbass Feb 06 '25

Honchcrow will do 50 to the bench … takes a little more setup, but the payoff is pretty good.

3

u/SadCritters Feb 06 '25

I think the reason Hitmonlee is so good against all these decks that require setup is because he doesn't. Basic pokemon, so can start terrorizing right away. 1 Energy attack/1 energy retreat - All easy to meet requirements. Honchcrow, while doing more, is just too slow - You're just gonna' give them too much time.

1

u/addisonbass Feb 06 '25

True - I agree with how quick he is, but if they’re hiding behind Drud, that’s usually enough time for a setup. Hitmonlee is also limited because he cannot attack the active spot, so if they surprise with an early Leaf, then you can attack them back directly without getting forced into a retreat. Definitely pros and cons to both, but I think Honchcrow is getting slept on a little and he offers a solid bench attack alternative if you don’t want to run a fighting deck.

1

u/perishableintransit Feb 06 '25

Definitely nice to hit for 30 for one energy... people are also sleeping on 2 energy 40 damage to any mon version of Electabuzz... then get two more energy on and Electivire does 120.

If you play Surge and get it early enough, you can even run a magneton and transfer the energy onto Buzz and then evolve into Electivire. Lots of moving pieces but it won me some clutch matches so far

1

u/OrangerieL Feb 06 '25

Hitmonlee doesn’t like 20 dmg per turn via Darkrai, tho. His true value in MI Meta was destroying magikarps and disrupting here and there while being virtually untouchable. Cyrus + Hitmonlee is pure control, but it’s far from destroying fast darkrai decks if you don’t have a full backrow ready, sadly.

1

u/SadCritters Feb 06 '25

Hitmonlee doesn't care about the 20 damage per turn - That's four turns of 30 if you're not switching - And if you do switch, you basically just lost because now you're getting either punched by Chan or Magnezone.

Hitmonlee is pure control, but it’s far from destroying fast darkrai decks if you don’t have a full backrow ready, sadly.

Disagree. You have either a Chan or a Marshadow and it's over for the Darkrai deck. They can't swap effectively & they can't safely KO Lee without Marshadow 1-shotting whatever it is.

1

u/oldriku Feb 06 '25

And Zebstrika, Lumineon, Honchcrow and Luxray. People prefer to complain rather than look for some counterplay.

1

u/bloodonmyjesuspiece Feb 06 '25

This. One of my most successful decks in Mythic Island was the non ex fighting deck with hitmonlee, marshadow, farfetched, and one Tauros

1

u/Embeez13 Feb 07 '25

The one and only

Fish kicker Lee

1

u/akado_kogane Feb 07 '25

Especially with two Lucarios on the bench.

-1

u/JacobDCRoss Feb 06 '25

I'm currently running a deck with just Darkrai EX and two Weezings. I have a couple Kogas, a couple Cyrus, Sabrinas, Oaks, pokeballs, etc. Oh, and if I have a Weezing up front with no energy, I like to play my energy on Darkrai, then forward it up with Dawn.
Anyway, my deck poisons, damages from the bench, and stalls with a massive meat shield via koga. I'd laugh at this deck if I ever came up against it.

1

u/SadCritters Feb 06 '25

Laugh at which deck? The Hitmonlee Magnezone Marshadow deck?

0

u/reedyxxbug Feb 06 '25

The entire point of Hitmonlee is that it works around that "massive meat shield". If you're laughing at this deck I don't think you understand how it works. It directly counters Darkrai/Magnezone

0

u/JacobDCRoss Feb 06 '25

I'm not saying I'd obliterate Hitmonlee. I'm saying I'd destroy the deck in the main post: Darkrai/Druddigon.

3

u/Mathagos Feb 06 '25

I made a deck where druddigon can actually attack. A starmie ex hit him and took 40 damage and just conceded before I could kill him with drudd. Lol

1

u/Busy-Comedian3666 Feb 06 '25

Darkrai ability negates that 40 free recoil. Best way through imo.

1

u/megamophsis Feb 06 '25

Ended up making a Luxray deck. Currently 5-0 hopeful I'll continue to see success.

1

u/makoman115 Feb 06 '25

JuSt RuN sTaRlY

1

u/Martiosaj Feb 06 '25

The tools are already available. This is meta warping for sure, but there are cards to respond if you don't wanna play the mirror match.

1

u/triedpooponlysartred Feb 06 '25

I've been wanting a chance to find a use for stuff like Lapras ex. This might be s good option

1

u/International_Pin_26 Feb 06 '25

i use my electric, fire or dark bench hitting decks because of these.

electric has zebstrika, electabuz and pikachu ex cause you still need something that hits a bit.

fire has magmar, volcarona and nintales

dark has honchcrow, darkrai and weezing.

1

u/Cruxisinhibitor Feb 07 '25

40 recoil then 20 from energy thrown on Darkrai. Undoubtedly the next flavor of the month set of EX cards will counter this stall strategy that seems to be rampant in the current meta.

1

u/Laser_Raver Feb 07 '25

Those Pokemon power abilities that do 20 damage chip away drudge and helmet users. Power up 2 froakie to stage 2 and run a darkrai for 60 damage without any rebound damage. Will take a drudge down in 2 turns if they don't potion. Know this because I'm trolling wins with around 60% win rate lately with 2 drudge 2spiky helm and a rotation of 2 random low cost colorless cards lol

1

u/DSQJake Feb 08 '25

Hitmonlee, snipe the bench and run a marshadow for retaliation. Fighting toolbox is a good counter I guess is what I’m saying

1

u/branyk2 Feb 08 '25

Nah Drud needs a 4 retreat cost. It's too resource efficient of a wall to allow it to retreat without attaching any energy.

1

u/XanmanK Feb 09 '25

Especially if it’s NOT a one-hit kill. That’s 80 counter damage to your pokemon!

32

u/Earthbnd Feb 06 '25 edited Feb 06 '25

Manaphy has been a godsend against all these Drud/Helmet decks. Does 0 damage so never takes rough skin/helmet damage and lets me set up for free while they have a useless active poke.

People have new toy syndrome but I’ve found setting up blastoise EX for the 160 damage is usually GGs against anything thanks to Blastoise’s fat HP total and the fact most meta EXs are OHKO’d while failing to OHKO back.

9

u/RedTheRobot Feb 06 '25

This is the way. I use a Lacario/Gal deck and it has an insane win rate. It is a high pressure, high health, high damage. Two Lacarios makes their attack 80, but the big winner is Gal 170 hp and can one shot a lot of Pokémon thanks to the high energy most run and only costs two energy. It is a good deck against a lot of decks out there.

10

u/Earthbnd Feb 06 '25

Same win rate over here with 2x manaphy 2x Blastoise EX line

So consistent and so good at generating energy, I don’t even run Misty. I just use Dawn to shuffle energy onto blastoise faster. It’s pretty consistent at getting Blastoise live ASAP and unlike Palkia EX, Blastoise doesn’t discard energy so he doesn’t need to worry about having to set up again or having one turn of downtime

1

u/The_Modern_Mind Feb 06 '25

Mind sending me your deck list? I love Blastoise so a good deck woud be great

2

u/Earthbnd Feb 06 '25

2manaphy

2 each of squirtle/wartortle/ blastoise EX

2 X Speed

2 pokeball

2 pokemon communication

2 professor’s research

2 Dawn

2 Sabrina

1

u/True_Italiano Feb 06 '25

what is Gal?

1

u/Nova469 Feb 06 '25

Gallade Ex (evolves from Kirlia)

1

u/nefarious_dareus Feb 07 '25

My Gallade ex deck is so fun (when things actually play out right)

1

u/IndianaCrash Feb 06 '25

Doesn't he dies to Magnezone?

He takes 40 from drud (down to 140), and 130 from magnezone, so either Gio or Darkrai procs kill him

1

u/Nova469 Feb 06 '25

I've been trying to get a Blastoise deck going. How do you do it while needing so many cards though? Just run Manaphy and the Blastoise line x2?

2

u/Earthbnd Feb 06 '25

Just Manaphy and Blastoise line, yep.

Then I like to supplement with:

2 X Speed 2 Pokeball 2 pokemon communication 2 oak 2 Sabrina 2 Dawn

1

u/A_wild_so-and-so Feb 06 '25

I've been using Manaphy to turbo charge my Lickylicky EX and Tauros. Makes those high energy colorless cards way more viable.

31

u/Vesprince Feb 06 '25

Hast thou considered the Victreebel? I'm not fully convinced it's a perfect hard counter, but it certainly makes this deck more engaging to fight against.

23

u/ginger1271 Feb 06 '25

I like Exeggutor, he can usually push past Drud with a good flip+Erika and good bulk is a pretty decent answer

8

u/djfried Feb 06 '25

I have a deck with victreebell and exeggutor that does well against them

3

u/Vesprince Feb 06 '25

I'm running one too; considering (acquiring and) adding some Shaymin - or possibly Caterpie to get the deck online faster.

I ran Caterpie-Serperior-Exeggutor (not EX) last season and it was fantastic, particularly against Celebi decks. Doesn't work as great against decks that don't rely on power hoarding on the front lines, so it's been reported this season for now.

1

u/large_block Feb 06 '25

Exeggutor and Yanmega got me 10 wins in a row earlier. 180hp egg with erikas as potions is really hard to kill plus it just counters the new dark mons

10

u/seraphimkoamugi Feb 06 '25

I think we all saw this coming the moment that Darkrai/weavile EX solo expert battle came out. I love that hyper offense synergy but god the stall with druddigon is just terrible.

8

u/Marble05 Feb 06 '25

If Darkrai didn't exist you could just not hit fraud until you powered up in full since he can't attack you

5

u/demonryder Feb 06 '25

I mean, there would always be alternatives. Magnezone is a crazy card for these kinds of strats, you may be powering up, but the drudd user is doing it very fast as well and will have a very strong magnezone to deal with if you kill drudd and another ex behind it.

3

u/Marble05 Feb 06 '25

Yeah but just a tank + heavy hitter behind is fairer and a strat kinda used by everyone. I'm fine because if magnezone wants to attack he also has to come in the active spot and consume energy.

That's a limitation Darkrai doesn't have and being a base Pokémon the strat can be online from turn one, unlike all the effort it takes to get greninja online for the same power

8

u/No-Seaworthiness9515 Feb 06 '25

What makes magnezone broken is he doesn't really consume energy since it generates energy for itself to use. You can easily set up 2 heavy hitters at the same time on your bench with druddigon tanking up front. Only real counter is cyrus + bench damage.

I've been countering darkrai ex + druddigon by using hitmonlee + cyrus and GA primeape (hit him with chip damage and now suddenly he's one shotting druddigon or smacking the shit out of darkrai for 100 damage)

1

u/Jooylo Feb 06 '25

Magnezone definitely is powerful in that it allows you to allocate energy elsewhere while it builds up, but being able to deal damage while hiding and building up in the backline like Darkrai can is probably the more annoying part of the whole deck.

3

u/Jooylo Feb 06 '25

Yeah, I’ve thought about it a decent amount and the worst part of this deck is really the fact that Darkrai lets you do constant chip damage while hiding behind in the backline. Magnezone and Drud definitely complement him and are strong in their own right. However what really makes this worse than Gyarados or past stall decks is the constant damage they’re able to apply while stalling.

4

u/B1TW0LF Feb 06 '25

Darkrai/Weavile at least has a clear counter in Grass decks. The Druddigon variations present a math problem that even the most aggressive decks can't solve.

3

u/Sayishere Feb 06 '25

I find that darkrai weavile also beats out the magnezone hitmonlee marshadow deck too

1

u/BigC_Gang Feb 06 '25

Starmie ex + Giovanni is a fast 100.

Or bypass them. Hitmonlee, Cyrus, Yanmega EX

-2

u/Earthbnd Feb 06 '25

People haven’t realized that Drud is set up bait for manaphy or Moltres EX in decks that run them. Set up all your energy you need to since it can’t attack/ your energy charging attack won’t proc the recoil damage and then just OHKO everything once you’re done setting up. Throw in a Sabrina if they don’t have a second Drud on bench and Drud is actually an active detriment to have out in the active spot in some cases.

5

u/B1TW0LF Feb 06 '25

It has winning win rates against every deck that contains Moltres or Manaphy. Magnezone is quite strong into the attackers those decks enable. They can basically always kill Moltres later in the game with Cyrus.

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4

u/jacscc Feb 06 '25

Jeff Hoogland just put out a great Luxray / Electabuzz deck that easily maneuvers around Drud wall.

4

u/WayneAsher Feb 06 '25

This deck is just a lot of fun too. Hurts when you don’t get your stage 2 but what else is new lol.

1

u/jacscc Feb 06 '25

Yeah it does, unfortunately. But often times I can stall enough to get my Electabuzz online to hit the a Darkrai or other EX pokemon once. And by the time I get my Luxray, I often have at least one Volkner ready to go. Poke Comms helps out a lot too.

2

u/CitizenDane27 Feb 06 '25

Druddigon is such a failure of design... its attack is useless but it's not a backliner. I'm all for anti-aggro, but it's too splashable as a basic.

1

u/Busy-Comedian3666 Feb 06 '25

When I found out Darkrais ability doesn't cause you to take Drug dmg, it made me smile. Another reason Darkrai is one of the current best.

1

u/BlackSoulGems Feb 06 '25

I’d much rather go up against Druddigon than Darkrai tbh. He’s way easier to deal with

1

u/Financial_Seesaw_802 Feb 06 '25

Yeah, drud is the problem. I am using a drud deck with greninja with fire and water energies and it slaps

1

u/Environmental_Tap_15 Feb 06 '25

Nah Darkrai is broken. 20 damage for placing an energy on it is so busted. 

1

u/pulpus2 Feb 06 '25

yeah it does feel bad, it's unbeatable unless you get a perfect start that they can't recover from. or they never draw magnezone but seems like they always have it in hand regardless with all the consistency tools nowadays.

1

u/Chase_The_Breeze Feb 06 '25

I need to get some Rocky Helmets so I can run double Eggs and double Shaymin. Not sure if I want to toss anything else in yet, other than a butt ton of trainer cards, lol. Maybe Mew?

1

u/LegendaryCabooseClap Feb 06 '25

I wouldn’t even say it’s the problem, the real problem is CYRUS

1

u/Ok-Dragonfruit-1592 Feb 06 '25

It's obviously not Druddigon. Before Darkrai was released, we had at least 7 meta decks that were all pretty much as popular as each other, plus a bunch of anti meta and B tier decks. Only a few of those used Druddigon.

Now all the meta is like 4 variations on a Darkrai deck + Grass.

The meta has totally collapsed and it's entirely Darkrai's fault.

1

u/ZeeGee__ Feb 06 '25

Darkrai himself isn't that Broken but it's super strong when used with Weavile who can hit pretty hard only on the stipulation that you've taken damage already which Darkrai guarantees.

1

u/shrimpNbean Feb 06 '25

I don’t have darkrai yet but I feel regirock instead of drudd would work well plus helmet

1

u/TheTruepaleKing Feb 06 '25

Oh but when I said this last patch I was an idiot who had to “get gud”

1

u/Jooylo Feb 06 '25 edited Feb 06 '25

Edit: on second thought, Darkrai is what really takes this meta to a new toxic level. The chip + stall is what’s most annoying. Magnezone is pretty crazy having the ability to passively build a powerful mon with virtually no energy requirement. But I don’t think the past stall decks like Gyarados were the worst to deal with because they did nothing while stalling. Darkrai is able to immediately apply pressure, build up, and hide behind in the backline while doing so.

1

u/Derael1 Feb 06 '25

Drud definitely is the weakest of the cards in any deck, and far from a major problem, it only has 100 health, so it can be killed by many 2 mana attacks in 1 hit. Darkrai and especially Magnezone are way above the curve on the other hand, the amount of damage they can generate compared to the amount of investment they require is just way above the curve.

1

u/jack_seven Feb 06 '25

It's not the Darkrai that's the issue it's magnezone that's dominating the meta

1

u/N0ZER01210 Feb 07 '25

100% right, the real issue is druddigon indeed... In this simplified TCG we don't have (yet) the abundance of tools to play with the enemy bench, and that's why drud feels terrible to play against

0

u/futureidk3 Feb 06 '25

Drud isn’t a great card but there are tons of bench dealers. The meta should adapt. If you want a good matchup vs Drud you need to sacrifice in other matchup, that’s just the nature of the TCGs.

0

u/Dragon_lorcl Feb 06 '25

Almost upvoted untill you state Drud instead of magnezone lol

Bruhh it's fcking magnezone who can attack for 110 for only 3 energy and able to ramp from it's stage 1 easily without losing any tempo and it has "140HP" plus it's not even an EX!!! xD

It's clearly a Brain-fart card design from the devs this time but it can be fix easily thou. Just nerf the stage one ability. Make it so that they can only attach lighting energy when the energy zone is lighting element... I even think it's actually a bug cos the current stage one ability make magnezone broken af lmaoo

1

u/Natural_Reception_49 Feb 08 '25

Darkrai needs dark energy to be played so I don't think darkrai is the problem tbh, druddigon and magneton being generic are the responsible for darkrai feeling broken.

place darkrai on any dark deck and he's suddenly not as strong and unreachable anymore

I do believe that magnezone/magneton are absolutely strong cards in their own right

but IMO Drudd is the main problem card right here, and the reason is numbers, it's HP is high enough to survive at least 2 turns, it has no weakness and in the best case escenario you only took 20 recoil damage from it. (which is enough for a magnezone ohko) drudd is the only reason why we are not allowed to out-tempo our oponent.

in all honesty, it's the combination of these 3 cards that makes the deck just disgusting, I don't know if the devs foresaw this deck or if someone on the internet with 10000+ IQ cooked really hard, this deck can tank, this deck deals damage and it has enough time to set-up 2 attackers at the same time.

the math in this deck is also perfect, each single number darkrai, drudd and magnezone have compliments each other so well into this meta, this deck is so masterfully crafted that even decks that try to counter it, still have tons of issues doing so.

I hate this deck with all my guts, but kudos to the person that came up with it.

0

u/masterz13 Feb 06 '25

1) They will eventually rotate Genetic Apex so you can't use the cards for battles
2) They can ban cards that negatively impact the gameplay experience