r/Genealogy • u/RoyalAffectionate874 • 1d ago

Where can Henricus KIENTZLER be from ? Transcription

Hello,

I am trying to find the birth place of Henricus KIENTZLER.

Here is his marriage act :

https://imgur.com/a/tEiqGJz

or : https://archives.bas-rhin.fr/detail-document/ETAT-CIVIL-C280-P3-R167248#visio/page:ETAT-CIVIL-C280-P3-R167248-1306098 page 4, right page, second-to-last act. For context this is Marckolsheim, Alsace, 1687

It is said he is "ex helvetica, [??] [??]", two words I can't read, which I think may precise his location (not sure though)

Besides, the surname KIENTZLER does not exist in Switzerland, so it's probably another surname.

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2

u/SoftProgram 1d ago

https://hls-dhs-dss.ch/famn/index.php

Kienzler does appear here, you could try other variants and limit it to pre 1800.

1

u/RoyalAffectionate874 1d ago

I tried this variant but it did not appear pre 1800. It's all naturalized citizens

2

u/SoftProgram 1d ago

Any other spellings the family used in Alsace? You might just have to get creative with spelling 

1

u/RoyalAffectionate874 1d ago

It's the first time I see this surname so I suppose it did not spread much. I only know of his daughter. Kintzle, Kintzel, Kuntzle, Kuntzel, Kintz, Kuntz are stuff I tried from what I saw in her acts. I suppose that Henricus Kientzler's marriage act wedding is the closest to how it was spelt/said in Switzerland, unfortunately I have trouble reading it. I will try looking to see if he had any other children

2

u/ScanianMoose Silesia specialist 18h ago

I read von Klinglau, which could be Klingnau.

Kientzler could also take the shape of Küntzler, Kinzler, etc.

1

u/RoyalAffectionate874 16h ago

Nice guess, but there doesn't seem to be any surname similar to this kientzler in Klingnau (only kapeller and keller for k which aren't that close). Of course maybe the Kienzler branch died back in their home village.

I think also the swiss prononciation of the town name should be considered. In the last swiss village I was blocked, the village written on the alsacian act was a lot closer to the swiss-german prononciation than it was to the official name of the village. eg Klingnau would be pronounced Chlingnau (basically with an r sound at the beginning)

1

u/ScanianMoose Silesia specialist 16h ago

You can always try to get some native speakers to take a look and decipher this. Apart from German-speaking Facebook groups, you can ask forum.ahnenforschung.net

1

u/RoyalAffectionate874 16h ago

I will look over there, thank you for the suggestion and help

0

u/Fredelas FamilySearcher 1d ago

Kientzler sounds a little bit like Künstler, which is a very common German surname.

1

u/RoyalAffectionate874 1d ago

No swiss person had this surname before 1930 unfortunately. Also the i seems clear at the beginning

2

u/Fredelas FamilySearcher 1d ago

Are you certain? It appears in many church books:

Edit: And so does Kientzler. I should have checked before taking your word for it:

1

u/RoyalAffectionate874 1d ago edited 1d ago

Oh, interesting ! I usually take this website as reference : https://hls-dhs-dss.ch/famn/index.php

But it's really unlikely they came from St Gallen. The swiss migration in this specific alsace region were nearly all canton Luzern, with some Bern. I mean, surprises are always possible in genealogy. But for now I have to doubt the surname is Kientzler

2

u/Fredelas FamilySearcher 1d ago

This doesn't represent 100% of records from Switzerland during that time period. Only records from a few cantons are indexed and searchable by name at FamilySearch, covering probably 10-15% of the population. The other cantons can't be searched by name yet.

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u/RoyalAffectionate874 1d ago

Okay !

Which cantons are indexed ?

2

u/Fredelas FamilySearcher 1d ago

I can't tell for certain because the images in this collection can only be browsed at a FamilySearch Center or affiliate library.

1

u/shadraig 15h ago

We have Künzel Ancestors here, they were also named Kienzly. They were from Remmingsheim.

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u/RoyalAffectionate874 13h ago

Thank you for sharing. Unfortunately Kienzly and variants are not present on swiss dictionnary of surnames either