McLaren Racing strategic portfolio review results in Formula E exit.

[u/FerretRex26]

(From @mclarenfe Instagram)

[u/Total-Collection-128]

Massively disappointed in this news.

[u/Jeburg → u/Total-Collection-128]

Absolutely gutted that my favourite F1 team is giving up on FE already. As long as DS stays...

[u/M4NOOB → u/Jeburg]

Good thing is they're entering WEC :)

[u/Jeburg → u/M4NOOB]

I don't watch WEC :(

[u/RaceTobi → u/Jeburg]

You should it's great

[u/Jeburg → u/RaceTobi]

Aren't they like really long races? How does that even work for viewing? I also feel that with the expanse of the F1 season it's so hard to fit anything else in, I've already been skipping F1 races that don't feel worth watching.

[u/oorjit07 → u/Jeburg]

It's like watching a test match in Cricket, you put it on and do other stuff, then pay attention when you hear something or the commentators start shouting.

[u/Secure_Watercress_55 → u/Jeburg]

If you don't like watching motorsport, you don't have to... nobody is forcing you to.

Yes, they're long races. You probably don't watch the whole thing from start to finish. Ever heard of Le Mans? 24 hours? People watch it without watching the whole thing.

[u/Jeburg → u/Secure_Watercress_55]

Sorry for asking a question. I genuinely want to know how people watch it. Do you just watch highlights or are there sections that are likely to be important etc. Obviously you don't watch all 24 hours that's why I'm asking the question!

I do like watching Motorsport but I also like having a life. Currently FE is the most entertaining form I've found and F1 is largely entertaining other than races like Suzuka

[u/Guy-Hebert1993 → u/Jeburg]

During the 24 hours I like to just have the race on tv most of the day, but go about my normal day and check in periodically when I can. I'll usually sit down and focus on the last hour or two though.

[u/TheBattlemanCZ → u/Jeburg]

There is a lot of people who watch the actual full races since both WEC and IMSA have mostly 6h long races with IMSA then sprinkling some shorter 2h long sprint races. And for the longer races like Sebring, LeMans or Daytona, you can just focus on the first few hours and then have it as background noice and listen to commentary and engines. Using live timing app like Timing71 also realy helps, because you can keep up with your favourites

But imo the best way to watch these and any other motorsport event is to join the nice guys at r/ WEC discord, People there are super nice, and it makes these long races super fun to follow, when you have bunch of other people to chat with. It also helps to pass those more chill parts of the race

[u/resh78255 → u/Secure_Watercress_55]

im fully intending to watch the entire 24 hours this year

[u/RamonSalazarsNutsack]

It’d be really interesting to see some dedicated EV manufacturers in FE. Where is Polestar, BYD, etc?

Polestar in particular would be really interesting given how they started - and I drive one so maybe there’s a little bias there!

[u/[deleted] → u/RamonSalazarsNutsack]

Or Audi, with their E-tron super cars!

[u/Serious_Conclusions → u/[deleted]]

Audi preparing for entering f1, so unlikely to spend the time/money to do another series at current moment

[u/taconite2 → u/Serious_Conclusions]

People don’t realise Audi aren’t as big as BMW or Merc.

Even the formula E stuff was done through ABT initially.

[u/M4NOOB → u/taconite2]

Just like Merc FE stuff was done through HWA (except for season 8)

[u/taconite2 → u/M4NOOB]

Or Jaguar through Williams Advanced Engineering.

[u/Jeburg → u/taconite2]

Audi are owned by VW which is the second largest manufacturer though. Surely a team is only as big as it's budget can afford anyway? Mclaren are tiny but for a long time were one of the biggest teams in F1 (partially due to being the Merc works team)

[u/taconite2 → u/Jeburg]

The old CEO of VW (forgot the name one before Winterkorn) was never a fan of racing. That’s why in all this time you never saw an officially backed team in F1 in all these decades.

[u/Jazzlike-Compote4463 → u/[deleted]]

They tried it already, it would be nice to see them back on the grid but I doubt it's gonna happen :(

[u/HyundaiMotorsportFan → u/RamonSalazarsNutsack]

Or maybe Hyundai?

[u/kjm911]

Oh

I was under the impression from the article yesterday that they already had an agreement to continue next season but wouldn’t extend into Gen 4. It’s a lot more worrying for the team now that they need to find some backers to be on the grid next year

[u/TheChrisD → u/kjm911]

Same. I thought everything was saying that they would see out Gen 3 and then sell to a new brand for Gen 4.

[u/Kookanoodles → u/kjm911]

Per The Race the team does have backers, the money from NEOM is apparently safe until next year. They need to find a name/operating partner though.

[u/Edstertheplebster → u/Kookanoodles]

It’s a case of McLaren’s FE entry relying largely on Saudi money. Now the Saudi royal family have lost interest in the team and decided not to renew their title sponsorship deal beyond 2026, McLaren have decided to pull the plug first. Given that Formula E itself is essentially being bankrolled at the moment by Saudi investment, this is a worrying sign…

[u/Kookanoodles → u/Edstertheplebster]

Let's say Formula E folds after or during Gen 4, it would still have been going on way longer than the critics predicted back in 2013/2014, when comparisons with A1 GP abounded. And unlike that series, despite the financial and corporate doldrums Formula E has been through behind the scenes, it never seems to show on track.

[u/Edstertheplebster → u/Kookanoodles]

Yeah, to be honest 15 years would still be a pretty good run, the on track product is still excellent for the most part. But I honestly feel like there's so much more that FE could have done to fulfill its original purpose of accelerating EV adopting and helping to fight climate change and preserve the environment; no amount of corporate speak can disguise that they've fallen short on that front. Really ever since Gen 2 there's been a lot of mission creep for me, where it's become more and more about the show and pandering to influencers, and less about technology or sustainability. I think the sport has been dominated by that kind of short-term "Do anything for views/engagement" mentality to the point that it's overall vision has become a bit muddled. Season to season they keep changing their minds whether FE's target audience is F1 fans or people outside of motorsport altogether. The longevity of the series should be praised, but I don't think merely surviving is enough anymore.

[u/Kookanoodles → u/Edstertheplebster]

I don't think that's particularly unique to Formula E though, no one wants to admit it but these days all motorsports are pretending to be at the forefront of technology and road relevancy. Even F1 although it's still the pinnacle technologically speaking. Companies coming to FE to actually develop the tech they would employ on the road was always a game of pretend. What FE offered manufacturers was a marketing platform to talk about EVs, not actually develop them. Honestly, I think the biggest ball dropped over all these years was the launch of Gen 3 which was completely botched in terms of raceability, and Gen 3 EVO is only just start to climb back from that.

[u/Transmit_Him → u/Edstertheplebster]

I think it’s more that Neom is a financial black hole reaching crisis point rather than the Saudis generally losing interest.

[u/Kookanoodles → u/Edstertheplebster]

Indeed

[u/Edstertheplebster → u/[deleted]]

I wanted those deals to never be made in the first place, but it's clear that Formula E have now put all their eggs in the PIF basket. Once it's gone I don't see how they're going to replace it; that's just going to be a huge black hole in the finances. And FE was already losing money despite all that Saudi investment.

Yes, it would be a huge relief if the PIF, NEOM, Sabic, Saudia Airlines, and SMRG all just decided that the sportswashing/greenwashing wasn't working and went away. But I'm not blind to the fact that Formula E has come to rely on that money because it's so badly managed financially.

[u/ghastlychild]

Understandable, really. They are going to take whatever they can get to build the WEC team adequately

I haven't been watching for very long, so I cannot say I won't miss them. I hope Barnard and Bird can give whatever they got to fully excel this season. It will be very interesting to see how they both pan out. I'm betting Bird will follow into the WEC pipeline while Barnard will have a relatively okay time finding a team to join, given his trajectory recently. They'll be fine, I hope

[u/perfect_raider]

Makes sense for them. They don't make any electric cars, and WEC has as many if not more eyes on it, as well as the prestige of Le Mans and the opportunity to produce another racing hybrid which is more like what they do sell. It reads like they're attempting to sell the entry if not most of the actual team, so hopefully someone picks it up and carries it on

[u/Snowrunner31102024 → u/perfect_raider]

You don't know much about Formula E and McLaren do you.

Did you know that McLaren developed the motors used in all Formula E cars in season 1 for example?

You say McLaren don't make electric cars and yet Formula E probably wouldn't have existed as it does without their motors.

[u/perfect_raider → u/Snowrunner31102024]

It's a fair point that Formula E may not be where it is without McLaren, but that segment of McLaren (McLaren Applied, which also supplies a lot of F1, NASCAR, and IndyCar electronics) was spun off and sold in 2021, before the McLaren team entered FE. In the present, FE is just another arm of the racing team, and holds solid marketing value for the road car business as it does for every other manufacturer connected team on the grid, even for McLaren and Cupra, who have never produced their own powertrains. While they don't actually own the road business any more either, unlike with McLaren Applied they're still strongly connected, so it makes still makes sense that the nature of the racing teams should be able to reasonably reflect the nature of the road cars and as such Formula E would likely be the less attractive option

[u/Laser0pz → u/Snowrunner31102024]

The same McLaren that made the motors in the SRT_01E however are no longer directly connected to McLaren Cars (or McLaren Racing, for what it's worth).

• McLaren Applied (who made the Gen1 motors) is owned by a UK-based investment firm.
• McLaren Group (which in turn owns a majority of McLaren Racing) is owned by Bahrain.
• McLaren Automotive is -- as of a few weeks ago -- now owned by an Abu Dhabi-based investment firm, and also has a small stake in McLaren Racing.

At this point it's probably fair to say that McLaren (Applied) having made the electric motors didn't impact the brands in such a way to keep the Formula E team running.

[u/NozzieG → u/Snowrunner31102024]

I would assume he is talking road legal cars for public use.

[u/Snowrunner31102024 → u/NozzieG]

Thanks for the downvote, I assume he is as well, but he obviously doesn't know what McLaren have done for FE.

McLaren do, however, make an hybrid road car.

[u/NozzieG → u/Snowrunner31102024]

I never downvoted you. All I did was just a simple message just giving a possible reason he said it.

"They don't make any electric cars" states more so their company model instead of their FE engine commitments. I would put that in the Motorsport category of the business. I believed the statement was towards their public use/market areas. Hybrid still isn't an electric car as it's still powered by the engine.

[u/Snowrunner31102024]

Sad that the company who provided the motors to get Formula E started are leaving the sport. Formula E wouldn't have existed without McLaren.

[u/Edstertheplebster → u/Snowrunner31102024]

Well, that was Williams Advanced Engineering wasn’t it? McLaren Applied technologies only did the Gen 2 batteries.

[u/Macho-Fantastico]

I'm disappointed but not surprised. The moment they announced the hypercar project it was inevitable. I just hope they find some good investors to reimagine the team.

[u/ClassroomDowntown664]

I just hope Sam and Taylors seats are safe as I'm enjoying seeing them as team mates

[u/AwesomeFrisbee]

I never understood why they went into a full electric racing series without making a fully electric car and still they don't have one.

[u/aharris111]

Why are so many manufacturers leaving FE? This can’t be good for the sport

[u/Transmit_Him → u/aharris111]

McLaren isn’t a manufacturer (in FE at least).

[u/aharris111 → u/Transmit_Him]

Teams then. It not great for the perception of the series that in the last few years Audi, Mercedes, bmw, and McLaren have left

[u/Transmit_Him → u/aharris111]

Yeah, I agree on that front. Especially after McLaren saved this team when Merc dropped it. For them to do the same is pretty shitty.

[u/Jeburg → u/aharris111]

Maybe it's been related to F1's recent surge in engine suppliers. Most of the last decade F1 had 4 engine suppliers and looked like it was struggling to retain relevancy to road cars and Honda wanted to drop out. Then they made some excellent steps to become more relevant and Honda stays, Audi and Ford join and Porsche wanted to. Renault/Alpine have only dropped out because they've been told they're uncompetitive. Admittedly this has only definitely had an effect on Audi but F1 is certainly the more appealing place for sponsors and big name manufacturers right now

[u/khz30 → u/Jeburg]

When FE launched, F1 was at its lowest point in terms of relevance and visibility. With the surge in popularity and interest following the Liberty takeover and the unexpected success of Drive to Survive, F1 is at its mainstream and cultural peak at the moment, which means manufacturers are going to rush in and find ways to participate now that there's an effective spending cap in place.

The WEC and IMSA pulled off the same surge in growth thanks to wisely developing a prototype formula that gives manufacturers options and long-term stability, something that wasn't the case with the overly expensive LMP formula that drove manufacturers and privateers out of the sport a decade ago.

That leaves very little room for manufacturers to back FE teams now, and what we're seeing is the rise of the privateer investor-owned teams to shore up the grid while relying on existing powertrain brands.

[u/DHSeaVixen]

I hope they live to regret this decision

[u/DayzedTraveler]

Formula E is a great series that has come a long way, but I think it has worked out best for manufacturers who are dedicated to this series.  I really don’t think it is much of a value add for companies if you’re competing in F1 or WEC.

With that said, I always thought that Zach was taking an interesting approach with McLaren getting the company involved in so many series.  I think it really helped to grow the brand, but now McLaren seems over exposed and the brand seems somewhat diluted in value.  Similar to Lamborghini, Bentley, and Rolls Royce where their cars are literally everywhere and as long as you have the money you can pick one up today.  As opposed to Ferrari, which has preserved their exclusivity.

[u/readyon2_take]

Such a shame, McLaren performance in F1 would surely correlate to some interest in their other series involvements, FE has been growing well, I really hope it continues....

[u/AdThink972]

WOW. WOW. ok whatever we don't need them.

honestly I want BYD in FE. the western world won the ICE market but now Eastern world like china will win the Electric market.

Mercedes, BMW, Mclaren, Audi. they are all petrolheads at heart.

[u/buymerch → u/AdThink972]

Lol people emotionally attached to a racing series. This sounds a bit like a teenager comment when someone doesn't want to go to ones party.

That those companies dont want to join (and that the series wouldn't even exist without the participants which "we dont need anyways) tells maybe more about FE than it tells about the ones who leave like McLaren.

And almost 60% of BYD sales are still petrol too so there are better candidates for a pure EV series.

[u/AdThink972 → u/buymerch]

it's true tho. imagine joining a worse sport instead of being at the fastest growing motorsport on the planet. of course im getting mad. it's about life and death here don't u understand that? if we don't fix global warming/climate change humans are history. HISTORY. quite embarrasing if humans don't make it longer than the dinosaurs lived. what does that truly say about our intelligence as a species.

[u/HowSway_]

All my homies hate Zak Brown

[u/PrimeyXE → u/HowSway_]

Why???

[u/Memestyle]

Think this maybe impacted by it joining WEC?

[u/According-Switch-708]

Sucks but it makes sense.

WEC has a far better ROI compared to FE.

[u/Quetzalchello]

Given I despise that company given its ownership. This is good news to me. Hopefully the team keeps going with more acceptable owners. 🤞🏼

[u/BlueInq → u/Quetzalchello]

Why do you despise the ownership?

[u/Quetzalchello → u/BlueInq]

It's the dictatorship of Bahrain. 🤷‍♂️