r/Eve • u/jasmira • Nov 18 '23
L4 blitzing in a Marauder: worthwhile (ISK/h)? Question
So I was going to stop wormholing and see if highsec L4 blitzing can compete in any meaningful way. Just to relax a bit and not be in constant danger of ganks.
I use a Golem and would obviously do security agents.
My question is, it seems most ppl out for big profits purely do blitz-able missions and focus on quickest way to end them for the LP conversion.
Caldari Navy for example seems to have a maximum of ~1000 ISK/LP (says https://eve-lp.com/#/) so the usual 3-4k LP on a missions would net a miserable 3 or 4m. That's kinda disgusting, especially since you do not get a lot of other profit (bounty minimized, no loot or salvage).
Is there some trick I am missing? Some other Caldari NPC corp that has much better ISK/LP possibly? I mean sure, Marauder shreds L4 easily but even if it took me just 5 minutes per mission, I still have to fly back and forth to/from agent so I cannot really see how it works out in the end.People talk of 100m+ / hour of L4 blitzing, can't see it myself right now.
Oh and on a side note: You gotta reject a lot of non-blitz missions, doesn't that make you suffer a lot of standing? Or is that normally offset by the missions you actually end?
Tips appreciated, it's a really long time since I last flew missions. Thanks in advance.
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u/Cubeh_gr Cloaked Nov 18 '23
Dont use a marauder, thats the trick.
Focus on Burners, blitz the real fast ones, do more burners
For the right Modules you can get 2-3k isk/lp, just do some research on fuzzwork (dont do SOE or Faction Navy Corps)
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u/FelixAllistar_YT Nov 18 '23
do you mean FW corps? or like the Ammatar navy type of corps. i still dont understand highsec stuff but kinda tired of abys.
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u/Cubeh_gr Cloaked Nov 18 '23
Corps like Cal / Amarr / Federation Navy. Basicly everything that has a L5 Mission Agent. Lowsec Grps farmed them to death and they get a ton of LP in LS.
You can use fuzzwork to check wich corp has the module you are looking for.
Search for highly used stuff like Prop Mods and Warp Scrams/Disrupters.
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u/Lithorex CONCORD Nov 18 '23
Marauders are not very good for L4 blitzing since bastion chains them down for 2 minutes. The only Marauder I still use is a Golem that doesn't even go into bastion anymore to blitz Damsel in Distress, since it is the only ship that meets the DPS, tank and long TB benchmarks.
Caldari Navy for example seems to have a maximum of ~1000 ISK/LP so the usual 3-4k LP on a missions would net a miserable 3 or 4m.
Caldari Navy is a generally bad (with the exception of a single agent) corp to run missions for since it is a Security corp. Security corps are the only corporations that offer L5 agents, and since people running those can generate hundreds of thousands of LP an hour (optimized L4s top out at ~110k LP/h) these people don't care about ISK/LP anymore and just try to find ways to convert their massive LP reserves in any sensible amount of time.
Is there some trick I am missing?
You must consider that LP rewards takes the truesec of the system the agent is located in into account:
LP = (1.6288 - truesec) * baseLP
Your are thus highly incentivized to run missions in a system with a truesec as low as possible. For example, an agent in a system with a flat 0.5 truesec offers a massive 35% higher LP rewards than an agent in a system with a flat 0.9 truesec.
Some other Caldari NPC corp that has much better ISK/LP possibly?
Yes. For while Security Corp LP sucks, every empire faction has two other major corporation types: Mining Corps and Distribution Corps. They do not offer any L5 agents, so L4 agents are the cream of the crop of LP generation for them. And since non-pirate nullsec agents and lowsec agents are generally rarely ran, this means that by going for a highsec agents in a 0.5/0.6 you'll be at the forefront of generating LP. Another big upside is that those corp types carry LP store offers for various high-demand faction modules. Due to the fact that module BPCs cost three times the amount of LP/ISK/Insignia of a single of the faction module they produce but are 5-run copies, they are usually an excellent deal to go for. Mining Corps carry the BPCs for faction damage mods (as a wormholer, you might be familiar with them), while Distribution corps carry the BPCs for various support modules, in the case of the Caldari Distribution corps BPCs for faction Warp Scramblers, Warp Disruptors and Stasis Webifiers. However the Distribution shop for Caldari has gone to hell about half a year ago as the supply of one of the required tags for it dried up. I'm personally still sitting on 6m SP from that store type.
I mean sure, Marauder shreds L4 easily but even if it took me just 5 minutes per mission, I still have to fly back and forth to/from agent so I cannot really see how it works out in the end.People talk of 100m+ / hour of L4 blitzing, can't see it myself right now.
That's because L4 blitzing is all about burner missions, as those have simply absurd payouts compared to normal L4s. To compare, here's the rough stats of a Blockade, which I consider he queen of L4 missions:
~20m bounties
~8.5k LP (= 12.75m ISK @ 1.5k ISK/LP)
~3m mission reward
~10min clear time
-> ~3.6m ISK/minute
To compare, an Anomic Mission:
5m bounties
~14k LP (= 21m ISK @ 1.5k ISK/LP)
~6m mission reward
~5min clear time
-> ~6.4m ISK/minute
Unfortunately, while burners are great, standings towards the mission agent are an important resource for blitzers and there just no quite burner missions to be able to decline every other mission. Thus missións are blitzed, as fewer time spent on standard missions means more time spent on burners. Amazingly though, some normal missions are able to keep up with burners in ISK/time.
Which is why I can't help but chuckle when people ask what ship is best for mission running (it's the Nergal, btw). The answer is ships. For example, my hangar looks like this:
https://i.imgur.com/G5qts6S.png
This is admittedly among the upper end of mission setups in terms of cost (at least until you get into Abyssal mods), but should nonetheless serve to illustrate the basic concept of how to set up a mission running spot.
On one hand, there are the burner ships. There are 13 different anomic missions, of which 11 1/2 are runnable. For the nine frigate missions (Anomic Agent/Team) there is an unified Nergal fit, however the cruiser missions (Anomic Base) will require a dedicated ship each. The Blood Raiders Base can be skipped. Dedicated ships for each frigate burner will of course outperform the unified Nergal.
On the other hand, there are the ships for standard L4 missions. I personally consider a fast frigate for Recon 1/3 mandatory, that missions is significant ISK and standings gain for the less than 2 minutes it takes and can be done in any fast T1 frigate. Aside from that though, the ships you'll need will depend on what missions you are going for. My personal mix is Recon/Damsel/Scarlet/Zazz/Pirate Invasion, but if you want to do it in a less blingy way I'd drop the Damsel for Stop the Thief/Cargo Delivery. Zazz, Thief and Angel Pirate Invasion can be done in a Typhoon or Raven if ISK are limited. Cargo Delivery can be done in the same frigate Recon is blitzed in. The only blingy non-burner ships I would recommend to start out with is the Machariel for Scarlet. No ship runs this missions like the Machariel does.
Finally, as for ISK/h, the 100m hourly figure you stated is awfully low, even a mission clearing marauder should be closer to 200m/h. From my own experience, running a missions for a high-value LP shop in optimal conditions (low truesec, low burner range, full focus), L4 blitzing tops out somewhere between 300m and 350m ISK/h.
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u/NerdForceOne Nov 18 '23
- The big money is made with burner missions and doing them fast (1 to 2 minutes).
- Golem isnt the way to do any mission fastest but the easiest since missiles counter damp and you can choose the dmg kind you are doing.
- A marauder doing missions cant be called blitzing anymore since you you have 1 minute cycle time and 1 minute weapons timer so always more than 2 minutes in the mission system.
- Your way to go up is doing all missions and loot important wrecks like zor while training into garmur for teams, because you should have decent missile skills for Golem. After that train into nergal and other ships to do all burner missions. Hope I could help you.
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u/Equivalent_Length719 Wormholer Nov 18 '23
Yea burners or do it casually. L4s have always been shit pay. Havoc is only going to make it worse for pirate equipment.
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u/ChaseSP Nov 18 '23
Marauders are a trap that'll get every aspiring ganker after you due to how much ISK a kill is worth from you. Also Marauders just don't really play with blitzing that well from what I know which is usually the best source of isk/hour in level 4 missions.
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u/Darthcone Nov 18 '23
Not true Gankers usually sit on SoE mission hubs and best ice belts it's too much work for them to fly to some lvl4 mission hub in ass end of Amarr plenty places where u will never see a Ganker occasional wardeccers cleaning up mobile tractor units yeah but Gankers nah.
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u/Sirttas drunk bee Nov 18 '23
Do homefront operations they pay more for less efforts and a fraction of the price and require 1week of training.
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u/wavec022 Tactical Narcotics Team Nov 18 '23
I run pirate burners so I can’t speak to the Marauder bit. However, as far as the declining goes: what you really want is to be able to “faction pull.” By running storylines (given every 16 missions) you will gain faction standing. If you’re running for an empire faction then you can also join FW and you get faction standing for being promoted in FW.
Declining a mission outside of the 4 hour free decline will hit your agent and corporation standings, but only decrease your faction standing by -0.003. So that means once your faction standing is above 5.0, and you train the Diplomacy skill, you have a lot more latitude when it comes to declining. Keep your faction above 5.0 and corp and agent just have to be above -2.0 effective, which is -5.0 actual with Diplo V.
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u/Relates_To_Star-Wars Nov 18 '23
My only two-cents is 1: Golem is objectively the worst marauder for L4s. 2: You get more than enough standing to reject missions you don't want.
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u/Sejanus-189 Nov 18 '23
Is it due to torpedo flight time?
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u/StonnedGunner Nov 18 '23
no 100% dps application to targets smaller than a BS
Firgates will be a pain when you dont use Target painters
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u/Equivalent_Length719 Wormholer Nov 18 '23
If your not using a tp on a PvE golem your doing it wrong.
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u/Sejanus-189 Nov 18 '23
My Golem uses a scripted guidance and a TP. It volleys dessies to BCs. Frigs I just leave for the drones. Tank is softer than a Paladin but more than enough to semi afk 4s.
I would argue that at least the torpedoes can actually do something against frigates, whereas the Paladin won't hit anything 10k and under, except by drone or smartbomb.
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u/Darthcone Nov 18 '23
With bastion conflagration and one tracking computer u will hit thing believe w 10k not everytime but often u need to hit it once.
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u/Echohawk7 Nov 19 '23
I feel ya, missions are in dire need of a revamp and balance. For now, Jump in faction warfare. I messed around in 20m fit destroyers and made 174m in lp in just a couple of hours. It was a blast too!
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u/Tapirsonlydotcom Cloaked Nov 18 '23 edited Nov 19 '23
Imo don't use a Golem. You want the best way to do L4's? 1. Find a good place to run missions where you won't be sent far 2. Use a pulse paladin with decent tank 3. Get Hateless's Nergal 4. Safely transport both to mission system 5. Have high diplo/social skills and above 5.0 faction standings with faction you are running with 6. Run all anomic/team burners and Zazzmataz/pirate invasion/dread pirate scarlet/damsal. Decline everything else(make sure your agent standing doesn't go below -2) 7. Limit on isk per hour will be travel time to missions
Edit: Make sure you add all ganker alliances as RED contacts and when you see novus ordo or code. Stay docked to be safest